DUST Search - [Suggestion] Influencing Player Behavior w/ ISK

Adipem Nothi wrote:

Varoth Drac wrote:

How about this:

1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try.

So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra.
If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds.

I'm likely going to step on toes here, Varoth, but I'm of the opinion that we'd be best served if this mechanic rewarded players directly and on a per-kill basis.

When a newbro drops a protobear, I think we need to reward that newbro directly for his achievement, and I think it important for him to know exactly when and what he is being rewarded for. If it is possible for us to give him a digital "high-five" each and every time he defies the odds, I think we should do just that. This could only serve as encouragement, and early career mercs need all the encouragement they can get.

I realize that this "destruction bonus" overlooks to some degree support-oriented roles like that of the Logi. That's OK by me. EOM pay already accounts for WP earnings, and it is far from uncommon for Logis to top leaderboards. Furthermore, today's Logi has the tools needed to kick ass and perform Logi work. I see no harm whatsoever in encouraging our Logis to do both.

Dust is many things, but at its core it is a shooter. The systems in place already reward teamplay, and those systems fail to motivate. Don't get me wrong, teamwork is important and should be rewarded, which is why I suggest we keep existing pay mechanics in place. What I'm proposing is that we add atop existing mechanics an easy-to-understand bonus which directly rewards the act of killing, especially the killing of hardened targets.

Bosses drop better loot.

Pages: [1] :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.08.10 19:49:00 - [1] - Quote Backstory An active, early career merc in an up-and-coming corp is looking to grind for ISK. He blew the bulk of his wallet over the past weekend when his corp participated in a series of attacks against a more established, landowning corporation. His corp was not successful, but they learned some new tricks and gathered valuable intel on enemy tactics; they plan to re-attack next weekend. Meanwhile, our merc is looking recoup funds over course of the upcoming week so he can afford to run his recently unlocked high-end gear in the big fights coming up on the weekend. He estimates that he'll be able to grind for 1-2 hours per day. Ambush It is Monday evening, and our merc has an hour or so free to grind. He queues for Ambush with profit margin on the mind, fielding modified APEX gear at a very reasonable 20k per loadout. Our merc is early career but well above average in terms of player skill thanks to previous FPS experience. He almost always goes positive, he gives each match he plays his best, and he consistently places in the upper half of EOM leaderboards. Match Results 1: 15/10. 220k payout. 200k expenses. 20k profit. 2: 8/5. 180k payout. 100k expenses. 80k profit. 3: 12/6. 200k payout. 120k expenses. 80k profit. 4: 12/10. 210k payout. 200k expenses. 10k profit. 5: [Late Deploy] 6/5. 70k payout. 100k expenses. -30k profit. Observations Our margin-minded merc is not a mathematician by training, but he is no dummy. He deduces immediately that deploying into partially completed matches and actually fighting works against his goals. Our merc also observes that in 50% of his matches, he faces seemingly unorganized opposition in low-to-mid-tier gear, and in the other 50% he faces well-known veterans from PC Corps often running officer weapons. When up against the latter, he realizes that the harder he fights the less his profit margin. Part of him wants to fight his hardest no matter what; the other part realizes this competitive drive might need to be tamed in order for him to realize his goals for the week. TL;DR Current pay mechanics encourage this player to not give each fight his best. To optimize margin and meet his goal for the week, our merc is best served by always leaving battle when put into partially completed matches and either leaving battle, avoiding combat, or otherwise not giving 100% when put up against high-Mu opposition. Suggestion Motivate our merc by speaking directly to his goals, encouraging his competitive spirit, and rewarding him for beating the odds. Pay our merc a fixed face-value percentage of any/all gear he destroys. The better he performs against tough the opposition, the steeper his potential profit margin. The harder he fights, the sooner he'll reach his goals. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.08.10 20:03:00 - [2] - Quote Spitballed Match Results (Current) 15/10. 220k payout. 200k expenses. 20k profit. Spitballed Match Results w/ 20% Destruction Bonus 15/10. 220k payout. 200k expenses. 20k profit. Plus destruction bonus: Bagged 6 protobears running 150k worth of gear (+180k) Bagged 5 players in advanced gear worth 60k (+60k) Bagged 4 players in STD/BPO gear worth 20k (+16k) ^ Our merc stuck out an arsekicking. Gave it his all, took his pound of flesh, and overcame tough odds. Which is more likely to keep him at it, the 20k profit or 276k profit? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 2	Posted - 2015.08.10 20:05:00 - [3] - Quote Payouts for all mercs entering battles already under way needs to be fixed by giving a real payout based on performance not time in battle. This single issue causes tons of battle imbalance since late comers often leave if put in mid battle, it's just not worth the payout to fight.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.08.10 20:13:00 - [4] - Quote Spitballed Match Results (Current) [Late Deploy] 6/5. 70k payout. 100k expenses. -30k profit. Spitballed Match Results w/ 20% Destruction Bonus [Late Deploy] 6/5. 70k payout. 100k expenses. -30k profit. Plus destruction bonus: Bagged 6 protobears running 200k worth of gear (+240k) ^ Scotty put our merc into the middle of a brutal pubstomp against a PC corp running officer gear. Rather than leaving battle, our merc gave it his all. He singled out the protobears and managed to take one down with him every death except for one, when he somehow managed to take down two. Our merc stuck it out and overcame tough odds. Which is more likely to keep him at it, the -30k loss or 210k profit? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Varoth Drac Dead Man's Game 1	Posted - 2015.08.10 20:29:00 - [5] - Quote How about this: 1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try. So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra. If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.08.10 21:04:00 - [6] - Quote Varoth Drac wrote: How about this: 1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try. So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra. If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds. I'm likely going to step on toes here, Varoth, but I'm of the opinion that we'd be best served if this mechanic rewarded players directly and on a per-kill basis. When a newbro drops a protobear, I think we need to reward that newbro directly for his achievement, and I think it important for him to know exactly what he is being rewarded for. If it is possible for us to give him a digital "high-five" each and every time he defies the odds, I think we should do just that. I realize that this "destruction bonus" overlooks to some degree support-oriented roles like that of the Logi. That's OK by me. EOM pay already accounts for WP earnings, and it is far from uncommon for Logis to top leaderboards. Furthermore, today's Logi has the tools needed to kick ass and perform Logi work. I see no harm whatsoever in encouraging our Logis to do both. Dust is many things, but at its core it is a shooter. The systems in place already reward teamplay, and those systems fail to motivate. Don't get me wrong, teamwork is important and should be encouraged, which is why I suggest we keep the existing systems in place. What I'm suggesting is that we also reward the act of killing. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 2	Posted - 2015.08.10 21:35:00 - [7] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Varoth Drac wrote: How about this: 1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try. So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra. If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds. I'm likely going to step on toes here, Varoth, but I'm of the opinion that we'd be best served if this mechanic rewarded players directly and on a per-kill basis. When a newbro drops a protobear, I think we need to reward that newbro directly for his achievement, and I think it important for him to know exactly when and what he is being rewarded for. If it is possible for us to give him a digital "high-five" each and every time he defies the odds, I think we should do just that. This could only serve as encouragement, and early career mercs need all the encouragement they can get. I realize that this "destruction bonus" overlooks to some degree support-oriented roles like that of the Logi. That's OK by me. EOM pay already accounts for WP earnings, and it is far from uncommon for Logis to top leaderboards. Furthermore, today's Logi has the tools needed to kick ass and perform Logi work. I see no harm whatsoever in encouraging our Logis to do both. Dust is many things, but at its core it is a shooter. The systems in place already reward teamplay, and those systems fail to motivate. Don't get me wrong, teamwork is important and should be rewarded, which is why I suggest we keep existing pay mechanics in place. What I'm proposing is that we add atop existing mechanics an easy-to-understand bonus which directly rewards the act of killing, especially when killing hardened targets. Bosses drop better loot. Well said. I agree you approach would work well although to be honest any improvement at this point would be appreciated.
Sardonk Eternia Tiny Universe 371	Posted - 2015.08.12 21:51:00 - [8] - Quote I've had this same thought before. I think it would really add a cool aspect to this game if you killed someone and instead of seeing war points you saw isk gained. It would be a great feedback mechanism. As a bonus I'd like my isk losses to be summarized in the end screen for me. I like how in factionals I can at least do the math myself. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.08.12 22:09:00 - [9] - Quote Sardonk Eternia wrote: I've had this same thought before. I think it would really add a cool aspect to this game if you killed someone and instead of seeing war points you saw isk gained. It would be a great feedback mechanism. As a bonus I'd like my isk losses to be summarized in the end screen for me. I like how in factionals I can at least do the math myself. My thoughts exactly! https://youtu.be/rKtYqWBR7h0?t=60 Drop a merc ... Onscreen: + X WP Onscreen: + Y ISK Destroy an installation ... Onscreen: + X WP Onscreen: + Y ISK Down a dropship ... Onscreen: + X WP Onscreen: + Y ISK Bust an HAV ... Onscreen: + X WP Onscreen: + Y ISK Destroy enemy MCC ... Onscreen: Victory Onscreen: + Y ISK (where Y = % of value of object/gear destroyed) Onscreen, instantaneous pay ... it'd make blowing sh*t up a far more rewarding an experience. PS: Love these old Dust trailers. Here's another good one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCCTrEhkUCY Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Raven Tarmiskis Planetary Response Organisation FACTION WARFARE ALLIANCE 6	Posted - 2015.08.26 01:42:00 - [10] - Quote I think this could be a pretty decent idea, let people earn and see said bonus for taking down other mercs that are better armed or armoured then them. Or those brazen enough to use an SL against a vehicle/installation. Or even have a set number for installations like 15k per turret, 10k pr CRU and Supply depot but only if they are "hostile". (To prevent farming mind you) I'd like to see a penalty for friendly fire in FW too though, and to help discourage intentional friendly fire the penalty is 50% of what the suit costs. Which would be deducted from someone when square gets pressed on the "Press [] to penalize"/death screen.

Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 12	Posted - 2015.08.26 02:16:00 - [11] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Varoth Drac wrote: How about this: 1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try. So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra. If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds. I'm likely going to step on toes here, Varoth, but I'm of the opinion that we'd be best served if this mechanic rewarded players directly and on a per-kill basis. When a newbro drops a protobear, I think we need to reward that newbro directly for his achievement, and I think it important for him to know exactly when and what he is being rewarded for. If it is possible for us to give him a digital "high-five" each and every time he defies the odds, I think we should do just that. This could only serve as encouragement, and early career mercs need all the encouragement they can get. I realize that this "destruction bonus" overlooks to some degree support-oriented roles like that of the Logi. That's OK by me. EOM pay already accounts for WP earnings, and it is far from uncommon for Logis to top leaderboards. Furthermore, today's Logi has the tools needed to kick ass and perform Logi work. I see no harm whatsoever in encouraging our Logis to do both. Dust is many things, but at its core it is a shooter. The systems in place already reward teamplay, and those systems fail to motivate. Don't get me wrong, teamwork is important and should be rewarded, which is why I suggest we keep existing pay mechanics in place. What I'm proposing is that we add atop existing mechanics an easy-to-understand bonus which directly rewards the act of killing, especially the killing of hardened targets. Bosses drop better loot. It is a good start. +1 Thanks for all the support guys, let's fix Dust 514 :D
PARKOUR PRACTIONER D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 3	Posted - 2015.08.26 03:31:00 - [12] - Quote Cool idea, i support it. +1 You don't need to follow the rules of the game just keep breaking it until it works-JSE GS Rifleman & SGer MS NKer
Terry Webber Molon Labe. RUST415 841	Posted - 2015.08.26 05:55:00 - [13] - Quote I also approve of this. Inertial Booster Module Vehicle Installation
Meee One Amakakeru-Ryu-no-Hirameki 1	Posted - 2015.08.26 08:30:00 - [14] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Varoth Drac wrote: How about this: 1.6 mil isk split between your team, shared out according to the proportion of total team warpoints earned. This rewards trying, regardless of how much better the enemy team is. You also get rewarded more for trying when your team lacks players, or doesn't try. So for example. If your team all fights hard and gets 1000wp each, you all receive 100k extra. If your team gets stomped, you only have 8 players, 3 players get 0 wp, 4 players get 50 wp, and you get 200 wp, you would receive a bonus of 800,000 isk for fighting against the odds. I'm likely going to step on toes here, Varoth, but I'm of the opinion that we'd be best served if this mechanic rewarded players directly and on a per-kill basis. When a newbro drops a protobear, I think we need to reward that newbro directly for his achievement, and I think it important for him to know exactly when and what he is being rewarded for. If it is possible for us to give him a digital "high-five" each and every time he defies the odds, I think we should do just that. This could only serve as encouragement, and early career mercs need all the encouragement they can get. I realize that this "destruction bonus" overlooks to some degree support-oriented roles like that of the Logi. That's OK by me. EOM pay already accounts for WP earnings, and it is far from uncommon for Logis to top leaderboards. Furthermore, today's Logi has the tools needed to kick ass and perform Logi work. I see no harm whatsoever in encouraging our Logis to do both. Dust is many things, but at its core it is a shooter. The systems in place already reward teamplay, and those systems fail to motivate. Don't get me wrong, teamwork is important and should be rewarded, which is why I suggest we keep existing pay mechanics in place. What I'm proposing is that we add atop existing mechanics an easy-to-understand bonus which directly rewards the act of killing, especially the killing of hardened targets. Bosses drop better loot. Underlined part:I want slayer logis back. So,my options as a logi is to bust my ass getting WP saving clowns from their own stupidity. Totalling maybe 200k,if i go positive... In my slower,more expensive,and easier killed suit. Or get 6~8 kills and get payed even more? Hmm,that choice seems pretty easy. Official Blueberry of the Forums. Title given by my #1 fan Sgt Kirk.
haerr Ancient Exiles. 3	Posted - 2015.08.26 11:32:00 - [15] - Quote better pub matches would require ccp to change a few design decision, such as differences in power level between low sp and high sp clones, power level between basic and pro gear, not to mention officer, and or , probably and, limiting the number of matches which has both low power and high power choices in them, which would be very uneve like there is something to be said about asking players to commit x isk in the form of suits before each match, if they know that they will lose those x suits regardless, then maybe they will use those x suits to keep trying to win or at least to try to inflict isk damages on the other team... maybe limiting matches to players which commit similar amounts of isk for of suits could be a thing similar mu s means little if one guy is in an apex suit and the other in all officer kit, or one running starter fits and the other a tank


Pages: [1] :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page