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Boot Booter
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.06 19:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Now we have the damage threshold and honestly I never notice it. Maybe it should be a bit higher. Anyway that's not the point of this thread. Shields still seem a bit UP. Perhaps a big part of this is the scrambler rifle which is still OP versus shields and in the hands of amarr assault. Anyway I'd like to propose another buff for shields:
What if....
Shields constantly regenerated at X% of the shield recharge rate until the regulator kicked in.
For example: let's say I have a cal assault with 30 hp/s recharge and a 5 second delay. If the shields were damaged, they would begin immediately recharging at X% of 30hp/s for 5 seconds and then jump to 30hp/s.
Perhaps something like 10% would do.
I don't think we are too far off for shield and armor balance. Little interesting tweaks like this could go a long way. The damage threshold effected armor and shield suits the same. This proposal makes rechargers and energizers more valuable hence directly buffing shields suits. |
Alena Ventrallis
Commando Perkone
Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2015.08.06 21:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
But then armor suits have a constantly regenerating shield buffer on top of all the other advantages they currently have.
Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.
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Kensai Dragon
T.H.I.R.D Acadamy
141
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Posted - 2015.08.06 22:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
Make it a high slot variant of the shield recharger / energizer. Even on Cal suits you're looking at a native 3hp/s increase (I think, maybe 4, not really a Cal fan). After the 5 second delay he's only up 15hp. If you haven't killed him yet then he goes back to normal regen. If you're just plinking him then he still regens, but very slowly. |
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
6
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Posted - 2015.08.07 03:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
The primary issue with shields is that they're currently only really capable of skirmish warfare, hit and run tactics. And while there is certainly a use for this style of gameplay, siege warfare is far more viable in *most* situations.
Armor on the other hand can basically do both. You can stack plates and stick a rep tool behind them and turn them into a brick tank Siege machine. Or they can get some pretty powerful (and more reliable) self reps and also play the skirmisher role.
So basically armor ends up being viable in a wider range of situations than shields, which is why it ends up being the preffered playstyle.
I think a couple things need to be looked at\
1. Some form of remote shield support. May that be a tool that forcefully starts shield regen or something else.
2. More options for shields in terms of the kinds of roles they can fill. Shields should be the best Skirmish Tanks and armor should be the best Siege Tanks, but hey should have options for both, and currently only armor has that capability.
Pokey Dravon for CPM2
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benandjerrys
Vader's-Fist
592
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Posted - 2015.08.07 03:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:The primary issue with shields is that they're currently only really capable of skirmish warfare, hit and run tactics. And while there is certainly a use for this style of gameplay, siege warfare is far more viable in *most* situations.
Armor on the other hand can basically do both. You can stack plates and stick a rep tool behind them and turn them into a brick tank Siege machine. Or they can get some pretty powerful (and more reliable) self reps and also play the skirmisher role.
So basically armor ends up being viable in a wider range of situations than shields, which is why it ends up being the preffered playstyle.
I think a couple things need to be looked at\
1. Some form of remote shield support. May that be a tool that forcefully starts shield regen or something else.
2. More options for shields in terms of the kinds of roles they can fill. Shields should be the best Skirmish Tanks and armor should be the best Siege Tanks, but hey should have options for both, and currently only armor has that capability.
I've always been an advocate to a shield rep mod that reduces regulation.
ONE UNIVERSE//ONE WAR
Support Dust/EvE cross content
Director Vader's-Fist
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
10
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Posted - 2015.08.07 09:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:But then armor suits have a constantly regenerating shield buffer on top of all the other advantages they currently have.
Not if you only apply it to shield suits.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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DeathwindRising
ROGUE RELICS
1
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Posted - 2015.08.07 10:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:The primary issue with shields is that they're currently only really capable of skirmish warfare, hit and run tactics. And while there is certainly a use for this style of gameplay, siege warfare is far more viable in *most* situations.
Armor on the other hand can basically do both. You can stack plates and stick a rep tool behind them and turn them into a brick tank Siege machine. Or they can get some pretty powerful (and more reliable) self reps and also play the skirmisher role.
So basically armor ends up being viable in a wider range of situations than shields, which is why it ends up being the preffered playstyle.
I think a couple things need to be looked at\
1. Some form of remote shield support. May that be a tool that forcefully starts shield regen or something else.
2. More options for shields in terms of the kinds of roles they can fill. Shields should be the best Skirmish Tanks and armor should be the best Siege Tanks, but hey should have options for both, and currently only armor has that capability.
its funny you mention siege warfare. its actually caldari's primary style of combat in Eve, because Caldari has the best defense of all races. the problem is dust didnt get the shield mechanics that make caldari such a defensive beast. without the constant shield regen mechanics found in eve, caldari in dust are just inferior imitations. |
Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.07 16:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
Would this make Dual Tanking better than it already is?
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Kensai Dragon
T.H.I.R.D Acadamy
145
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Posted - 2015.08.07 17:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Not sure that merging them is such a great thing to do - keeping recharge and regulate as separate high/low keeps the balance. I'd rather see the native recharge delay reduced. I really like running in the MLT Cal Heavy with its 1 second delay, as long as I can find cover I'm repping at 30 (minimum) hp/s. Not saying every suit needs to be the same, but I think the delay is the biggest weakness for shields in Dust. |
Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.07 18:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
Absolutely fair point. Again, the optimal solution (in my mind) is to nerf armor rather than buff shields. Otherwise, we run arguably high risk of shifting the balance problem from Armor > All Else to Dual Tanking > All Else.
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Boot Booter
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.07 21:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:But then armor suits have a constantly regenerating shield buffer on top of all the other advantages they currently have.
Yeah but they have lower shield recharge in the first place. If it was set at 10% for example my gal assault would have a measly 2hp/s while my cal would have 7.5 hp/s. It is a stronger buff to shield suits |
Boot Booter
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.07 21:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Alena Ventrallis wrote:But then armor suits have a constantly regenerating shield buffer on top of all the other advantages they currently have. Not if you only apply it to shield suits.
This could be a solution as well.
Here's the thing. I think shields need some work but I'm totally against getting more hp. Shields suits strength is highly active tanks. A buff like the one I proposed here opens a new level of active tanking. Imagine a cal assault with 1 ext and 4 energizers. It would have about 350 hp but have a shield recharge at 150 hp/s. With 10% constantly regenerating it would yield 15hp/s while the regulator was down. Enough to shed a few bullets like armor tanks currently can do. |
Boot Booter
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.07 21:31:00 -
[13] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Would this make Dual Tanking better than it already is?
I completely agree that Shields are inferior to Armor, though the same can be said for every other type of module. If nerfs or fitting increases for Armor modules are for whatever reason off-the-table, I'd personally prefer to first see Shield Rechargers, Energizers and Regulators merged into a single, better module.
Not i dont think so. The only reason dual tanking is a thing is because 1 there are no direct disadvantages to it and 2 because shields are inferior. Do you see dual tanked gal and amarr often? No. However I commonly see caldari dual tanked. If shields were balanced you'd see very few dual tanked cals |
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
6
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Posted - 2015.08.07 22:50:00 -
[14] - Quote
DeathwindRising wrote:
its funny you mention siege warfare. its actually caldari's primary style of combat in Eve, because Caldari has the best defense of all races. the problem is dust didnt get the shield mechanics that make caldari such a defensive beast. without the constant shield regen mechanics found in eve, caldari in dust are just inferior imitations.
Well it's difficult to really have a direct translation between space naval combat and infantry combat, but you are correct in that there are some elements of shields that didn't quite make it across properly.
Pokey Dravon for CPM2
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