DUST Search - So Gunjack was developed by a small Shanghai team ?

Shadowed Cola wrote:

Soraya Xel wrote:

PLAYSTTION wrote:

We already knew about this. I don't know why everyone is surprised, we were told months ago about this and how/when they made it.

This. Not news. This was said at Fanfest this year.

howard sanchez wrote:

Look, I just want to ask this right now - are we gonna get Rouge Wedding'd again?

Is CCP using Shanghai (Dust team) to develop a VR game while doing everything they can to suck the last bits of aurum out of a small but dedicated community of loyalists (if you're playing, reading or thinking about DUST you're a loyalist, all there is to it)?

Because, CCP; I don't want to do that again. Hear me? DON'T DO THAT AGAIN!

If anything, Gunjack is a good thing for DUST players. For one, Shanghai is a lot more than just DUST, and several benefits to DUST can come through sharing resources. You might've noticed in the Biomassed interview, AquarHEAD mentioned he has worked on multiple projects. We potentially get access to more dev resources since CCP is able to have staff there to do more than just one thing.

This is the kind of half ass excuses CCP has been feeding our CPM for a long time now.

"Don't worry, other projects don't effect Dust!" "And if it did - it's positive!" .... ..... ....

I don't know what crack you people are smoking, but in the development industry, it's usually considered a bad thing for your development team to be cut up by different projects. The 'resources' you speak of are already available - and is being used on a different project, and the material that comes from that project sometimes' benefits other games.

Instead of more staff for Dust's development and porting - you're putting staff into other projects. more RnD costs, more development costs, and when the project nears completion and list of other costs pop up. All of which could of been put into improving existing games, 3 in total if you include Valkyrie. Now they have a fourth, before they even grant Dust a ******* future.

all that i'm actually seeing is CCP actively showing Dust players how little they honestly care. We get word of projects that mean the opposite of a positive effect around here - but nothing, not a ******* word, if we have a future.

and no, overworking your staff is EXACTLY the reason Dust's code is the pathetic shape it's in - stop poorly using your staff CCP. Concentrate on one issue at a ******* time. Or at the very ******* least stop making new projects and claiming it's helping Dust when it means it's putting more pressure on developers - because i'm VERY positive that the Dust developers aren't the happiest of people.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
byte modal 233	Posted - 2015.08.05 16:13:00 - [1] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Basically, what it comes down to, is CSMs and EVE devs mostly care about EVE players, much like CPMs and DUST devs mostly care about DUST players. The sweet spot of mutual interest will happen someday but that day isn't today. Talk to regular EVE players, that's going to get you much further than trying to convince CSM to take our wishes over those of their own community. See, this is a much better response than simply 'they don't care' Really hope you don't work PR irl. Context clues FTW? Soraya had already given a logical argument to that point in an earlier reply---not to mention the pages of information already posted. Try debating someone for 3 days for what should already be understood based on forum info and drawn conclusions from what already exists, histories, etc.; all the while your opponent insists on arguing with the fingers-in-the-ears technique with kung-fu prowess. Soraya has far more patience than I have. More than most on these boards deserve, TBO. Ironic, IMHO, that most of what's said is to help parse the vagueness that can be (usually is) CCP, all to help give insight to those unable or unwilling (or just flat out lazy, looking for something to moan over) to read between the lines themselves, and it's all taken as hostile. I swear, I've never seen such entitlement as I have the last 6 months or so here in the DUST GD. Well, except perhaps the Rogue forums over at WoW, years ago. To the quoted, most of this is not directed towards you. I just got caught up in the moment. Your quote was just a trigger ;) <3 <3 <3 - me. kitten bacon taco (nom)
byte modal 233	Posted - 2015.08.06 17:34:00 - [2] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: howard sanchez wrote: Look, I just want to ask this right now - are we gonna get Rouge Wedding'd again? Is CCP using Shanghai (Dust team) to develop a VR game while doing everything they can to suck the last bits of aurum out of a small but dedicated community of loyalists (if you're playing, reading or thinking about DUST you're a loyalist, all there is to it)? Because, CCP; I don't want to do that again. Hear me? DON'T DO THAT AGAIN! ...Yes, because replacing DUST 514 entirely with a smartphone game app is CCP moving into the future with the best methods and motives possible. Please read the above statement in the most drily John Cleese britishly sarcastic tone possible. Or perhaps imagine the mocking voice of Eddie Izzard. Or better yet, a five year old in a tone indicating that even they are curious where the hell you find the logic. seee... this is one of the 90% of times that I <3 u. kitten bacon taco (nom)
byte modal 233	Posted - 2015.08.07 20:11:00 - [3] - Quote Shadowed Cola wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: PLAYSTTION wrote: We already knew about this. I don't know why everyone is surprised, we were told months ago about this and how/when they made it. This. Not news. This was said at Fanfest this year. howard sanchez wrote: Look, I just want to ask this right now - are we gonna get Rouge Wedding'd again? Is CCP using Shanghai (Dust team) to develop a VR game while doing everything they can to suck the last bits of aurum out of a small but dedicated community of loyalists (if you're playing, reading or thinking about DUST you're a loyalist, all there is to it)? Because, CCP; I don't want to do that again. Hear me? DON'T DO THAT AGAIN! If anything, Gunjack is a good thing for DUST players. For one, Shanghai is a lot more than just DUST, and several benefits to DUST can come through sharing resources. You might've noticed in the Biomassed interview, AquarHEAD mentioned he has worked on multiple projects. We potentially get access to more dev resources since CCP is able to have staff there to do more than just one thing. This is the kind of half ass excuses CCP has been feeding our CPM for a long time now. "Don't worry, other projects don't effect Dust!" "And if it did - it's positive!" .... ..... .... I don't know what crack you people are smoking, but in the development industry, it's usually considered a bad thing for your development team to be cut up by different projects. The 'resources' you speak of are already available - and is being used on a different project, and the material that comes from that project sometimes' benefits other games. Instead of more staff for Dust's development and porting - you're putting staff into other projects. more RnD costs, more development costs, and when the project nears completion and list of other costs pop up. All of which could of been put into improving existing games, 3 in total if you include Valkyrie. Now they have a fourth, before they even grant Dust a ***** future. all that i'm actually seeing is CCP actively showing Dust players how little they honestly care. We get word of projects that mean the opposite of a positive effect around here - but nothing, not a *** word, if we have a future. and no, overworking your staff is EXACTLY the reason Dust's code is the pathetic shape it's in - stop poorly using your staff CCP. Concentrate on one issue at a *** time. Or at the very *** least stop making new projects and claiming it's helping Dust when it means it's putting more pressure on developers - because i'm VERY positive that the Dust developers aren't the happiest of people. What world is this where you work one thing, and only one thing through completion---assuming that completion is obtainable? School: "For the next 2 months, class, we will read the entirety of our English Literature textbook. Do NOT work on your math, science, or humanities material until this is done. Doing so will pull resources away from the task at hand and it is a human impossibility to do two things in parallel." Career:** "Hey, Byte! I need those design comps that we discussed last week for client X." Sorry, mate. I'm currently working the animation files for client B and it doesn't look like I'll be done with those for another 6 weeks. "But these comps should only take 6 hours. And it's your responsibility to learn how to manage your time and work load...." HEY! Don't talk to me like I'm a child!? I know exactly how long it will take, but the simple fact that YOU are forgetting is that you will NOT overwork me!" New Job a Week Later: "Byte. We have a new contract coming up in a few months and I would like you to give a few hours each week researching and educating yourself on this new software platform that we will be required to use. In addition, next week I would like for you to travel for a 3-day course on the program, to hit the ground running." No-can-do, Mr. Bossman! You tasked me with this technical manual layout that will clearly take the better part of a year to complete, and I am NOT going to stray from my duties. I understand that R&D is a necessary process that, if done correctly and with a bit of luck can lead to small-scale short-term development and potential profit as well as name brand recognition by putting our company out into waters we don't normally swim in, but really sir? No. I think not. I will stand firm on this longer term goal that doesn' t even really have a finite deadline or really may not even be realistic to be able to complete in the first place, until I am done, before even considering anything new. Besides, that will put me out for an entire *WEEK! There is absolutely no way on earth to make up that time in the remaining year, nor is it possible for team adjustments to compensate for my absence because I am THAT important! Unemployment Clerk:* Yeah, I'm going to need your social security to verify....." STOP RIGHT THERE! I will NOT give you a damn thing ...until I have finished writing my name and address on this here form." hm. Now that I think about it, working full time as a graphic designer, owning my own photography business, and returning to college is doing it wrong. Thank you for that moment of clarity. What ever was I thinking!? ONE THING AT A TIME!!! It all makes so much sense now! I get that resourcing can be abused, but you have nothing to go on but assumption and speculation to make your argument. Using the same assumption and speculation, anyone else can prove the exact opposite argument---if that is the measurement of proof. pannies = unwadded? kitten bacon taco (nom)
byte modal 234	Posted - 2015.08.07 20:19:00 - [4] - Quote Shadowed Cola wrote: byte modal wrote: Stuff When you release a promised triple A title game coded for the PS3 while developing another title for a different platform and doing everything you describe above lemme know. Didn't realize we had such experienced posters working on such projects? and your experience is where? I'm arguing that your points are short-sited and based on assumption and unrealistic expectations that R&D can't happen in parallel to long-term goals. Nothing more. Can it cause problems? You betcha! Does it by definition of existence do so? No. kitten bacon taco (nom)
byte modal 234	Posted - 2015.08.07 20:32:00 - [5] - Quote Shadowed Cola wrote: byte modal wrote: Stuff When you release a promised triple A title game coded for the PS3 while developing another title for a different platform and doing everything you describe above lemme know. Didn't realize we had such experienced posters working on such projects? That's generally why you schedule school around your schedule to not overwhelm yourself.... Unless you think high school material all at once is difficult enough to need breaks? College level material, you wouldn't want to overwhelm yourself. But back to your point - it stands to say that Dust's problem come from the coding itself and CCP's inability to deal with it, thus reoccuring issues unrelated to frame rate. This is easily due to mismanagement of personel by CCP side, marked clearer by how many developers have come and go from this project - and it's very easy to start making assumptions from there, as they're likely as not. I think that's fair, and tbo, had you written that to begin with I probably wouldn't have bothered. Again, though, my overall points are that 1) R&D and dumb luck can lead to some cool stuff that CAN (or cannot) give a much needed boost to esteem, pride, financing, marketing, bragging rights, wtfever; and 2) as your own post stated near the end, your creating causality through assumption. None of us know what the cause-effect relationships are. Shoddy code? Yeah sure, alright. There is a history there full of context that Ratman and current devs have been un-knotting. But that's not the end-all be-all of what may make or break a company or a company's development goal. Neither of us have thorough insight to CCP and their goals. Your arguments are based on your own desired goals for dust. understandable, I have my own and probably agree with you more than not. But going off on half-baked assumptions is silly. I don't have to be a developer of a AAA title to understand basic decision-making, when to invest, when to back off, when to split differences, or when to compromise, or the subtle intricacies that may lead one to make such decisions over others. I don't know what CCP is doing, but I know enough about common sense to figure that there are reasons more than what I see being argued here so often. Hey, maybe I'm wrong? But I have just as much proof for my stance as you do---which isn't much at all for either of us. kitten bacon taco (nom)
byte modal 237	Posted - 2015.08.07 22:22:00 - [6] - Quote Shadowed Cola wrote: it's goal vs promises made. CCP is ever expansive on there promises, but they very rarely deliver. If they thought more like me we'd have more delivery and less promises. But you're ultimately right, it's just my accusation and opinion. 4 years of this game, i probably have too many. Yeah, I feel you, man. Not in that creepy "uncle-behind-the-shed, just don't tell you're mom" kinda way either. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. But there's pros and cons with anything, I guess. Well, except that uncle. ...behind the shed. Can't imagine to many pros in that scenario. I'm going to stop typing now. - me. kitten bacon taco (nom)