DUST Search - [Suggestion] Shotgun Balance

Alena Ventrallis wrote:

Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:

Alena Ventrallis wrote:

I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it.

Out of curiosity, why?

I know you're capable of providing more reasoning than the thread creator.

I think the shotgun DPS is too high (a basic shotgun has a DPS of 685.68, a Boundless Combat Rifle has a DPS of 594) and while the extremely short range would seem to balance that out, I think light frames (and recently MinAssault) can too easily negate that disadvantage with speed. In addition, a basic shotgun with no skills or damage mods can put out almost 1000 damage in a single second. ie: The shotgun fires every 0.7 seconds at the current ROF. So one shot goes off for 480 damage, a second goes off 0.7 seconds later for a total of 960 damage within a 1 second time frame.

To show some numbers, Rattati's thread on weapon usage in PC show shotguns as the 2nd deadliest weapon behind HMGs in number of total PC kills, with the 3rd deadliest being a Python with a missile launcher as a distant 3rd. I think the shotgun should be viable on a wider variety of frames, and I think the shotgun should have lower DPS since it's such a high alpha weapon. The ability to kill a fully tanked sentinel in less than 3 seconds with a basic shotgun, let alone a proto one, seems way off to me.

To this end, I think the shotgun range should be increased to about 10-15m. This let's other frames use it effectively without needing to be as fast as a light frame. In addition, I would lower the ROF to 62.5 which gives the basic shotgun a DPS of 500, and the proto shotgun a DPS of 550. I would leave the alpha damage alone since the purpose of shotguns in any game is to be a high-aplha weapon. Now with a higher optimal and lower DPS, more frames can become effective with the shotgun, and we have less issue with scouts blapping mercs before they have a chance to respond.

If this takes the fun out of shotgun-scouts, I would see an assault shotgun with the following stats at standard level:

Damage: 34 (x12 pellets for 408 alpha)
ROF: 86
DPS: 584.8
Range: 4m

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Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 2	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:09:00 - [1] - Quote Give the std shotgun a wider horizontal spread and decrease its dmg the thing is way to powerful increase the breach mag size (id say 4) and give it a vertical spread so it can get head shots way easier i feel like the std shotgun should be for dealing with multiple targets while the breach is for dealing with one at a time a wider spread means switching to another target would be easier while a vertical one would be better for handling one at a time allowing you to focus way more at aiming this would add more play styles to scout suit instead of hide and kill or face ram the enemy and hope that you killed a few by spamming the r1 button
1e 3peat Corrosive Synergy No Context 68	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:14:00 - [2] - Quote I would like to down vote this idea.
Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 2	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:16:00 - [3] - Quote 1e 3peat wrote: I would like to down vote this idea. explain to me why you want that and maybe il change my mind
TheEnd762 SVER True Blood RUST415 796	Posted - 2015.07.30 04:36:00 - [4] - Quote Nah, shotgun spread/damage is fine as it is.
Arkena Wyrnspire Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 25	Posted - 2015.07.30 13:33:00 - [5] - Quote You don't need to start new lines in the middle of a sentence Arkena Wyrnspire - CPM2 candidate
Alena Ventrallis Commando Perkone Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 14:36:00 - [6] - Quote I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it. Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.
Arkena Wyrnspire Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 25	Posted - 2015.07.30 14:37:00 - [7] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it. Out of curiosity, why? I know you're capable of providing more reasoning than the thread creator. Arkena Wyrnspire - CPM2 candidate
Alena Ventrallis Commando Perkone Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 15:25:00 - [8] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it. Out of curiosity, why? I know you're capable of providing more reasoning than the thread creator. I think the shotgun DPS is too high (a basic shotgun has a DPS of 685.68, a Boundless Combat Rifle has a DPS of 594) and while the extremely short range would seem to balance that out, I think light frames (and recently MinAssault) can too easily negate that disadvantage with speed. In addition, a basic shotgun with no skills or damage mods can put out almost 1000 damage in a single second. ie: The shotgun fires every 0.7 seconds at the current ROF. So one shot goes off for 480 damage, a second goes off 0.7 seconds later for a total of 960 damage within a 1 second time frame. To show some numbers, Rattati's thread on weapon usage in PC show shotguns as the 2nd deadliest weapon behind HMGs in number of total PC kills, with the 3rd deadliest being a Python with a missile launcher as a distant 3rd. I think the shotgun should be viable on a wider variety of frames, and I think the shotgun should have lower DPS since it's such a high alpha weapon. The ability to kill a fully tanked sentinel in less than 3 seconds with a basic shotgun, let alone a proto one, seems way off to me. To this end, I think the shotgun range should be increased to about 10-15m. This let's other frames use it effectively without needing to be as fast as a light frame. In addition, I would lower the ROF to 62.5 which gives the basic shotgun a DPS of 500, and the proto shotgun a DPS of 550. I would leave the alpha damage alone since the purpose of shotguns in any game is to be a high-aplha weapon. Now with a higher optimal and lower DPS, more frames can become effective with the shotgun, and we have less issue with scouts blapping mercs before they have a chance to respond. If this takes the fun out of shotgun-scouts, I would see an assault shotgun with the following stats at standard level: Damage: 34 (x12 pellets for 408 alpha) ROF: 86 DPS: 584.8 Range: 4m Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 10	Posted - 2015.07.30 15:46:00 - [9] - Quote Shotguns on scouts are fragile as hell. With a 7m optimal I would say that if it didn't make an ACR look like a slowpoke there's something wrong. Further, PC usage of the shotgun was killing sentinels for the most part, the suit least suited to detecting/responding/pursuing/killing a scout. Unless the scout is unlucky or cataclysmically stupid. Shotguns are torturous in hit detection, hard to deploy and are most successful on dropsuits that die if small children fart too hard nearby. The speed is not the only factor. Scouts that just charge straight in usually get wasted. Shotguns do not "need to be reigned in." WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 16:52:00 - [10] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Shotguns on scouts are fragile as hell. With a 7m optimal I would say that if it didn't make an ACR look like a slowpoke there's something wrong. Further, PC usage of the shotgun was killing sentinels for the most part, the suit least suited to detecting/responding/pursuing/killing a scout. Unless the scout is unlucky or cataclysmically stupid. Shotguns are torturous in hit detection, hard to deploy and are most successful on dropsuits that die if small children fart too hard nearby. The speed is not the only factor. Scouts that just charge straight in usually get wasted. Shotguns do not "need to be reigned in." i never said nerf the gun all i ask is that they change the spread pattern to make the gun much easier to use a wider spread means i don't have to look around to much to get a hit in the same goes to breach if i have a vertical spread i don't have to look for the head for a headshot all i have to do is get a hit on the chest chances are i will get a headshot *plus i use my shotgun on my commando, heavy, medium and scout mostly my commando though

Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 16:54:00 - [11] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: You don't need to start new lines in the middle of a sentence its something i do to get on peoples nerves
Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 16:56:00 - [12] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it. Out of curiosity, why? I know you're capable of providing more reasoning than the thread creator. I think the shotgun DPS is too high (a basic shotgun has a DPS of 685.68, a Boundless Combat Rifle has a DPS of 594) and while the extremely short range would seem to balance that out, I think light frames (and recently MinAssault) can too easily negate that disadvantage with speed. In addition, a basic shotgun with no skills or damage mods can put out almost 1000 damage in a single second. ie: The shotgun fires every 0.7 seconds at the current ROF. So one shot goes off for 480 damage, a second goes off 0.7 seconds later for a total of 960 damage within a 1 second time frame. To show some numbers, Rattati's thread on weapon usage in PC show shotguns as the 2nd deadliest weapon behind HMGs in number of total PC kills, with the 3rd deadliest being a Python with a missile launcher as a distant 3rd. I think the shotgun should be viable on a wider variety of frames, and I think the shotgun should have lower DPS since it's such a high alpha weapon. The ability to kill a fully tanked sentinel in less than 3 seconds with a basic shotgun, let alone a proto one, seems way off to me. To this end, I think the shotgun range should be increased to about 10-15m. This let's other frames use it effectively without needing to be as fast as a light frame. In addition, I would lower the ROF to 62.5 which gives the basic shotgun a DPS of 500, and the proto shotgun a DPS of 550. I would leave the alpha damage alone since the purpose of shotguns in any game is to be a high-aplha weapon. Now with a higher optimal and lower DPS, more frames can become effective with the shotgun, and we have less issue with scouts blapping mercs before they have a chance to respond. If this takes the fun out of shotgun-scouts, I would see an assault shotgun with the following stats at standard level: Damage: 34 (x12 pellets for 408 alpha) ROF: 86 DPS: 584.8 Range: 4m i don't know what your talking about i use my shotgun on my calmando and its stupid amount of broken
Salvador-SIX7 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 17:19:00 - [13] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think the shotgun needs reigning in, but none of these ideas are the way to do it. Out of curiosity, why? I know you're capable of providing more reasoning than the thread creator. i agree, so tell me what you think would be best i want to know what your think
TheEnd762 SVER True Blood RUST415 801	Posted - 2015.07.31 03:09:00 - [14] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Shotguns on scouts are fragile as hell. With a 7m optimal I would say that if it didn't make an ACR look like a slowpoke there's something wrong. Further, PC usage of the shotgun was killing sentinels for the most part, the suit least suited to detecting/responding/pursuing/killing a scout. Unless the scout is unlucky or cataclysmically stupid. Shotguns are torturous in hit detection, hard to deploy and are most successful on dropsuits that die if small children fart too hard nearby. The speed is not the only factor. Scouts that just charge straight in usually get wasted. Shotguns do not "need to be reigned in." This. Changing the spread pattern would only serve to make it more awkward, and probably **** up hit detection even more. That's not balancing, that's a stealth nerf.
sergeant dragon falc Green Dragon Planetary Forces 0	Posted - 2015.08.03 07:59:00 - [15] - Quote Hey eveyone!


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