So, the SP system is clearly set up as a collection of skill trees, but it's not represented clearly as such in the menus. Is this intentionally obfuscated?

I too think the skill tree needs some work. Perhaps some explanation as to what equipment each purchase of skill level opens up? This would stop people (me ) worrying where to ' spend' skill points.

I understand there is supposed to be complexity in this game but there is complexity for the sake of it.

I also think that console gamers are often casual gamers (or like me older gamers) and grinding skills for one attribute without being able to trade these skills or realise 40 hours in that I wished I had gone another route may make me think twice about booting up the game.

This is not a monthly purchase game where the hardcore will keep the game afloat but F2P which will mean we will need numbers for it to be successful if money is to be made by CCP and if people arent able to 'enjoy' the game there will be a tail off.

This does not mean I am a COD (or even a BF3) fanboy - I am not.

Perhaps the best thing would be the EVE style of certificates.

Certificates in Eve have skills that you have to get in order to get them, and different ships have certificate's that are recommended to have.

This way you could see that XX heavy drop suit recommends heavy drop suit certificate and heavy armor tanking certificate or something like that, which would help you guide your skill progression.

Certificates are not binding though, they are just recommended. If you want to jump into combat with the minimum skills for your suit, its a risk but you can do it even if you don't have all of the recommended certificates.

The reason there is no skill tree is that there is no tree.

As was said, you create your own tree by looking at what you want to do, figuring out what skills you have to have and what skills you should have in order to be effective and then you design the tree yourself.

That is one of the best features of CCP's skill model. It is not set in stone what tree to train, its up to the players to decide what skills they need and build their own tree.

Also remember that there are a lot of skills that are not required but that are good ideas. For instance, if you want to be a great sniper, it might be tempting to build a tree that gets you to prototype scout suits, prototype sniper rifles and thats it. But you should also train all of the light weapon skills (for capacity, reload speed, damage, etc), you should also train weaponry (+5% damage of all weapons) and you should train the skills for weapons damage mods that boost your damage. All of those skills mean the difference between single shot assault suit kills and having to plink away 3-4 shots to kill them.

So you see, there is no way to make a tree because there are a lot of skills that are optional and depend on your play style.

Are you an EVE player? you will find in EVE is very similar. You know there is a skill tree, but you have to follow each branch of that tree to make sure you are training the right thing for the course of developing your character.

you will find that there are many sites out there that the EVE community have made to act as a guide for this kinda thing, as with ship fitting and manufacturing and all that kinda stuff.

i would not be the least bit surprised if the DUST community do the same thing. CCP support 3rd parties a lot with their API system. it allows the community to grow the in game universe outside of the game. so...keep the eyes peeled for that kinda stuff once more and more is known about the game by the player.

this is simply incorrect, there most certainly are skill trees, they just use the term "prerequisites" for this purpose. If I have to purchase one skill to access other skills, that is a skill tree. My point is simply that there is no good reason not to clearly state on the skills themselves exactly what other skills they unlock, considering you can find this information out in other ways anyhow. Adding extra button clicks to find information doesn't make something "deeper," IMO, it just makes it clunky. Few people are going to just toss points willy nilly into skills without knowing there function, so it can be assumed the player will back out, go look up the skill they want to get to, and figuring out the tree to get there anyway, so why add in the unnecessary work and just put that information where it's useful?

Wrong.

If all you had to learn were the prerequisites, then you would be very bad at using that equipment. There are far more skills that affect the effectiveness of the equipment than just what is required to use it.

My point is that a "tree" is misleading because it can't include all of the supporting skills because learning ALL the skills that have an impact is impossible, but learning the right ones for you is doable.

There are no skill trees for a reason. They don't make sense when it depends on what you as the player want to do.

You can tell what the skill does by looking at the description. IF you need to unlock something, just to unlock it, then you probably shouldn't be using it cause you need more skill to use it right.

yes please, to attract and keep the more casual gamer types including me.

lots will be Non-EVE players who find the skill system very confusing.

example - I go to the market to try and get better armor module for my suit and see it requires armor upgrade level 1 skill.

I go back to the Character - Skill screen and page around for 5 minutes and do NOT see anything that says "armor upgrade" skill.

go back to market , look at prerequisites again, ok I see Mechanics is UNDERNEATH the armor upgrade skill listed.

this seems backwards, but I buy the Mechanics skill and now the Armor upgrade skill shows up as a subskill.

Either the prerequisites Need to be changed to show the correct unlock order: (so you know what to get FIRST)
-- Major skill
------ subskill

or
ALL the subskills need to be shown but "greyed out" in the Skill list so you know which Major skill you need to unlock.

better yet - have these Certificates or Skill Templates that give you a step by step recipe of what skills you need for selected "popular" classes.

You want to be a Heavy Machine gunner? - you'll want to get equipment A, B, C and D. and in order to use your equipment you'll need to get skills X, Y, and Z in this particular order.

This would be Mucho helpful.