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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 13:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
And I will start it.
Current public matchmaking is horrible. The system is broken, and as I have said in another thread, in regards to this issue, 99% of the time, the results of the match can be determined prior to joining the match.
Here is an example from last night:
While talking with Sgt Kirk about this very issue, I sat in queue for 10 minutes to get into a public skirm match. Scotty'ed. Queued for FW and after 5 minutes, I got in. When I got out, I tried queuing for another public skirm, sat in queue for 10 minutes. Scotty'ed. Queued again for public skirm... 5 minutes, left queue. Heimdallr suggested Domination... 1 minute, re-queue, 3 minutes, gave up and went to read a book.
Even when you get into public matches, it seems like the "blueberries" or "redberries", depending on the lucky side, have never even played an FPS before. Sadly, more often than not, the players who have an established character in the game, seem to be expected to carry 10 people, or more, against several squads of "balanced" members.
Match quality has deteriorated, and people wonder why FW has become the preferred deploy for most larger corps. Adjust the 'mu' system, or remove it... either way, something needs to be done in order to democratize the public queue.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 18:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
Darken-Sol wrote: Perhaps you too should graduate to FW. Pubs should be like an extended academy. For new bros or the scrubs that need to fight them
That is all I run now, as the public matchmaking system is broken.
However, there is no good money making system for FW, so it is necessary to supplement income with public matches. They are the only way to make money outside of PC, currently, so a working public matchmaking system is vital to the economy.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 18:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:The MU System is noble but it has it's flaws.
Regardless of the nobility, no other FPS has a system that punishes players like the current one does. Other FPS games have a similar system, that still makes evenly matched teams (albeit, with the same real chance you will get stomped out), but without the ridiculous queue times, and impossibly uneven team assignments.
Aeon Amadi wrote:
A player that frequently runs with his corp-mates and friends is likely going to have an artificially inflated MU score because of it and the game is going to consider them to be something they're not, at least by my understanding. I could by wrong and if I am I apologize.
Thing is, if that is true, than virtually every time you run with your bros you're both positively and negatively impacting your own MU score - positively because it is rising but negatively because those gains aren't truly how you as a player operate. IMO the best solution for that would be to have a separate variable to account for whenever you're running with a team and whenever you're running solo.
For instance: On a scale of 1-to-100, with higher numbers being better, my MU score could be somewhere in the 40's but because I run with teams frequently and we're coordinated my score will rise because of my increased KDR, WP accrual, etc. So, whereas my TRUE score is in the 40's the game thinks I'm in a much higher bracket, so it tries to fill in gaps in matches with that artificially high score and I'm left having to deal with more competition than I can reasonably handle as a result.
Correct. We, as non-NDA members (and I am assuming even those behind NDA know, but who knows if they do), can't even offer suggestions on how to improve the system, since we don't know what is weighted, and what is included but at a small impact. It is impossible to tell. Until we know something more, it needs to be heavily revised, or nerfed so that the public matchmaking will work.
Aeon Amadi wrote:And there are some playstyles that this sort of thing MUST FACTOR IN because it is impossible to achieve those higher gains otherwise: Gallente Logis, for instance, can expect much lower WP accrual without a squad because their Intel Assist WP accrual simply cannot exist without squad-mates. Warbarge Strikes are another good example. You don't get the WP gains with those sort of gameplay mechanics running solo, so that must be taken into account when considering the "skill" of a player.
Reduced squad sizes were a good thing as that further narrows the chances for that team-play factor to matter as much in the overall scheme of things. I'm all for it. However, unless pub matches become solo-que only, there is no reasonable way (to my knowledge) to account for solo vs team-play except through different score systems.
But yanno, I could be wrong and just talking out of my ass.
Another reason why I think the system is broken... the system needs to account for 20+ variables, but it only seems to look at 2 or 3... KDR, Win/Loss, and total War Points. Even then, when it "evens out" the teams, 1 person can't carry 6 bad blueberries, let alone when they are put against two, very good squads, and be expected to win. This is the sort of placement you get, if you can get in, and your mu is heavily weighted down by unaccounted for variables.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 18:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:demens grimwulff wrote:Darken-Sol wrote: Perhaps you too should graduate to FW. Pubs should be like an extended academy. For new bros or the scrubs that need to fight them
That is all I run now, as the public matchmaking system is broken. However, there is no good money making system for FW, so it is necessary to supplement income with public matches. They are the only way to make money outside of PC, currently, so a working public matchmaking system is vital to the economy. Now that Planetary Conquest has been uberhauled (yes, I just made up that word), I'm going to see if PC can be my primary source of income.
Ehhh... PC payouts can be quite bad (I got 400k in one match and was #2 on my team). If you rely on PC to supplement your wages, you will have a rude awakening coming to you.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 18:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
General Mosquito wrote:You didn't hear? That is what a competitive game mode looks like!
Even better is 16 v randoms, which is what the q syncers said wouldn't happen, but has been the case in more than 50% of the FW matches I have played. I can't even remember getting a 16 v 16 in an FW match since the changes.
Not that I mind, as it is exactly what I said would happen, and what the teamstackers said they were not looking for.
I run FW daily, and only see a q-sync, maybe... 30% of the time. Just as likely as if you allowed 16 man deployment, but without the frustration of having to get everyone voiced in one spot, have the squads hit the right timer, hope they get in, etc.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 19:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Darken-Sol wrote:demens grimwulff wrote:Darken-Sol wrote: Perhaps you too should graduate to FW. Pubs should be like an extended academy. For new bros or the scrubs that need to fight them
That is all I run now, as the public matchmaking system is broken. However, there is no good money making system for FW, so it is necessary to supplement income with public matches. They are the only way to make money outside of PC, currently, so a working public matchmaking system is vital to the economy. Im selling apex suits
Assuming you win 100% of the rounds, it will require 50 rounds (roughly, and w/o boosters)... even, assuming you only run APEX gear the whole time, and you die an average of 5 times per round, the math works out as such:
5 * 50 = 250 deaths 250 * 20,000 = 5,000,000 (20k is a rough average of my average APEX suit) 250 * 10,000 = 2,000,000 (gains from refund; my APEX average about 1/2 of the returns 5,000,000 - 2,000,000 + 10,000,000 = 13,000,000
13 million isk if you only run APEX, die an average of 5 times, and win every round. Overall profit is anywhere from 17 million, to 47 million, but to get the more expensive APEX suits, you will not be winning 100% of the time. Now, same calculation for pubs
In the same period of time, you can run up to 2 to 3 times the number of pubs, and make almost the same profit, but APEX suits will only sell for that amount for a short period of time, and there is an ever diminishing market. I doubt you'll see a huge gain in the long run, and, even then, it is not the sustainable path for the game as we move forward. Public matchmaking is the basic game mode and is the one that every new person will play... if it dries up due to lack of proper matchmaking, the game will die a long, slow death.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 20:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:demens grimwulff wrote:Ehhh... PC payouts can be quite bad (I got 400k in one match and was #2 on my team). If you rely on PC to supplement your wages, you will have a rude awakening coming to you. Is that accounting for salvage and any ISK you get as a bonus from the corp for participating?
Even with clone sales, isk earned from holding districts is not enough to provide a paycheck, considering, due to the high cost of clone packs ($30 mill).... so no "bonus isk" from the corp. Basically, the economy of the current PC set up is not that of times passed... it isn't an isk fountain, but more like, a self-sustaining flow. If you dedicate 100% of your CP to selling clones, that is one thing... you might be able to provide a mill or two to your members, each, but not wallet inflating numbers like it used to be. Besides, most people who want to PC, prefer to actually PC over getting a mill or two.
Salvage isn't even that great, depending on who you go against. If you earned 400k in a match, odds are, you're only getting basic or militia in your salvage. The higher end complex stuff does drop, but not at the rate one would consider useful and/or bank filling.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 21:04:00 -
[8] - Quote
Talos Vagheitan wrote:Matchmaking is a complicated issue. There's one thing I never see people talk about though.
The most popular mode in Dust by far, Domination is inherently one sided.
At least in most maps, the point is highly entrenched and easy to defend, which gives a huge advantage to whoever hacks first and gets links in the area.
By comparison, I've seen way more big comebacks in Acquisition and ambush much more often than Dom.
Maybe the Dom point needs to become mobile like Aq, or at least be placed in areas much harder to defend.
Dom is, basically, "First to cap and camp, wins".
Acq... I have mixed feelings on. It can either be a ground-and-pound, or a tank spam match... not many in betweens, from my experience.
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demens grimwulff
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Posted - 2015.07.12 21:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
501st Headstrong wrote:I thought you were going to say a port either to PC or PA4. Anywho +1
Movement too a more advanced platform is necessary for Dust's survival... but once we get there, the bad mu system will only limit our growth.
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