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Oceltot Mortalis
88
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
I may not be an expert gamer, but from what I know of PVP games, is that they are not casual if they ONLY include online multiplayer. They become competitive only, unless there is a way to separate the Hardcore players from the ones who only have time on the weekends and are not that serious about it. This, I believe, is why we can't hold on to new players in Dust 514.
Part of getting/keeping a new player into the game is empowering them, making them feel like a bad ass, and it nearly always includes PVE. Whether its just one segment of running through a kill house picking up different weapons and finding out what they do, or an entire campaign of single-player / co-op content before PVP, killing helpless NPCs is pretty much the standard in introductions to a game.
Even EVE Online has this concept available to it's player base. Why can't Dust?
Before Dust makes the jump to PC and sets the precedence for itself on that platform, I would like to see either 1) PVE content where new players who are tired of getting stomped on repeatedly can go and have fun being Rambo for a while, or 2) Some kind of ranked and unranked matches that keep "try hards" out of the new guys matches. Whether this is through Planetary conquest or not, it doesn't really matter. But they need to be able to always have access to the ranked matches, or they will filter back into the wrong matches.
Aspiring Forum Warrior.
Commando Advocate / Gallente Advocate / Legion Advocate / Avocado Advocate
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Sicerly Yaw
Quantum times
430
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
I wouldn't consider myself competitive as I don't consider myself to be that great at the game and I don't strive to be at the top of the leader boards or anything
however I do play for the challenges and I consider myself a hardcore gamer as I put a lot of time and effort into getting good results
click here if you are making a new account and want some free BPO's
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
11
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:36:00 -
[3] - Quote
Your post contains a Dust 514 (PC) endorsement and a request for PvE.
I cannot hit this Like button hard enough.
@Ripley_Riley CPM2 candidate. Ripley.Riley on Skype!
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postapo wastelander
Corrosive Synergy
No Context
1
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Your post contains a Dust 514 (PC) endorsement and a request for PvE.
I cannot hit this Like button hard enough.
inb4 vaporware (WoD we don't forget)
"Caller of the Monolith"
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
11
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:44:00 -
[5] - Quote
postapo wastelander wrote:inb4 vaporware (WoD we don't forget) WoD was never released. Dust 514 was released, has had an expansion, and still has a team (albeit, a small team) developing it. Please continue comparing apples to hand grenades 
@Ripley_Riley CPM2 candidate. Ripley.Riley on Skype!
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Asad Thahab-Jabal
Incorruptibles
10
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Posted - 2015.06.29 16:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:inb4 vaporware (WoD we don't forget) WoD was never released. Dust 514 was released, has had an expansion, and still has a team (albeit, a small team) developing it. Please continue comparing apples to hand grenades
Pull the pin using the "alphabet, who will I marry" method.
*gets beaned in the head with an apple* |
Oceltot Mortalis
90
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Posted - 2015.06.29 18:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Sicerly Yaw wrote:I wouldn't consider myself competitive as I don't consider myself to be that great at the game and I don't strive to be at the top of the leader boards or anything
however I do play for the challenges and I consider myself a hardcore gamer as I put a lot of time and effort into getting good results
The "good results" you get as someone who plays this game and is invested enough to meander down to the forum board is not the kind of results that an overwhelmed new player can hope to achieve. There are no new players in this forum trying to improve the NPE.
Simple PVE scenario: Send the player on a series of missions trying out each suit against NPCs. Every single role has to be tried, and at the end of the tutorial, that character receives SP into the suit, weapon, equipment, and tank of that role. It gives them a place to start that they picked for Gameplay reasons, instead of everyone picking Gallente because they look the coolest :)
Aspiring Forum Warrior.
Commando Advocate / Gallente Advocate / Legion Advocate / Avocado Advocate
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Mejt0
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.06.29 23:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Small playerbase.
Can't be split even more.
Loyal to The State
Member of State Protectorate //
Belongs to Patriots power bloc
Civire Bloodline
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Sequal's Back
Dead Man's Game
627
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Posted - 2015.06.29 23:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mejt0 wrote:Small playerbase.
Can't be split even more.
WON'T YOU PLEASE TAKE ME HOME !
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Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
1
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Posted - 2015.06.29 23:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mejt0 wrote:Small playerbase.
Can't be split even more.
Except that everyone would be able to play whenever they want and enjoy it.
Include a squad PVE mode and the game will do better than ever. The small player base argument is dumb.
Alt of Halla Murr. Sentinel.
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Oceltot Mortalis
95
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Posted - 2015.06.30 00:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Mejt0 wrote:Small playerbase.
Can't be split even more. Except that everyone would be able to play whenever they want and enjoy it. Include a squad PVE mode and the game will do better than ever. The small player base argument is dumb.
For that reason, Kallas, and also because if Dust 514 is ever released on Steam, the free-to-play player base there is MASSIVE. A lot of people will try it for the first time since they didn't have a PS3, or will return to it hoping for new content. If you disappoint those players, then this game is truly dead.
Porting the game is only part of the solution. CCP themselves have even said it, that this game needs to be fun hour to hour and second to second. If new players are not taken care of, if they are introduced to the game as it is now or even Warlords 1.2, history will repeat itself. If the player cannot feel powerful or escape the stomping cycle, there is no hope.
This game cannot afford to not split its player base, no matter how small.
Commando Advocate / Gallente Advocate / Avocado Advocate
Twitter Stuff
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Squagga
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
835
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Posted - 2015.06.30 00:42:00 -
[12] - Quote
I am very competitive I constantly strive to get better. However, I want to see PvE, for multiple reasons
Shields, the silent killer.
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
531
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Posted - 2015.06.30 00:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
If pub matches are any indicator I'm not sure a PvP match would ever be available. |
Operative 1174 Uuali
True Companion Planetary Requisitions
853
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Posted - 2015.06.30 02:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
OP you have essentially repeated the main arguement people have been giving for matchmaking for the last two years. The struggle continues.
MY CPM2 PLATFORM
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Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
4
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Posted - 2015.06.30 02:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Oceltot Mortalis wrote:I may not be an expert gamer, but from what I know of PVP games, is that they are not casual if they ONLY include online multiplayer. .
Hearthstone is a pretty casual game despite only being PvP only (aside from the PvE that you do once). The game basically has a few brackets for "it matters to be competitive."
1. People that get to rank 20 every month. This basically means "do you play the game?" because Rank 20 can be done in like 10 minutes.
2. Can you get to Legendary Rank at least once? There is a chasm between 1 and 2.
3. Can you consistently get High Legend, like top 20 (qualifies for Blizzcon Tournaments). There is also a chasm between 2 and 3.
Beyond that, you just play the game for fun.
Titanfall was pretty casual-friendly from when I played it. It didn't matter win or lose, you just shot the bad guys. There was the elements of the guys that could do insanely good things over the "I got a gun and I shoot you!" people but on average you never felt like you were just getting your ass murdered with no reprieve.
So from my experience, I disagree with your premise.
Keeping people playing is not exactly "making them feel like a bad ass." Some games do cater to that, Call of Duty's endless score points from doing things for instance. "You killed two people in a row", "you got revenge on that guy that killed you at the start of the match", "you died 15 times is a row but killed someone now, +200", not saying it as a negative just stating that is how the game operates. Others don't. League of Legends doesn't do this. Even with the co-op v AI game, it is mostly meant as a "this is the map, this is a lane" kind of stuff.
What Hearthstone and LoL do have in common, however, is that there is a natural barrier between people of different skill levels for the most part. A rank 10 is not going to be facing against a Rank 20 Legend in Ranked Mode in Hearthstone and a level 15 Summoner isn't going to be thrown against Cloud 9, for the most part. It certainly does happen at the start of a new season but it normalizes fairly fast.
Why can't DUST keep new players? Because the game is not good enough to slog through the crap that a new player is expected to go through. I started playing 6 weeks after the game went open beta and the last wipe happened. I was against people that might have been in Advanced suits with basic equipment. The forums went nuts when the first person announced they had Prototype Caldari Assault and pretty much nothing else. There wasn't much of a gear difference. Now? The new players is being put against players who have more knowledge about the game and have been playing longer (skill) and have two to four times the HP and 1.5-2 times the damage (skill points).
So they get their asses kicked. What do they see when playing, while getting their asses kicked?
1. Glitches.
2. Low Framerates.
3. Lag that comes out of nowhere.
4. A game that their friends probably don't play.
5. Very limited game modes.
6. Seeing the same people over and over.
7. The mentality that "the game is dead" because "there are only 2,500 people playing at peak." It is a hard thing to overcome that thinking. I remember playing Loadout for a few hours, having a lot of fun so I was thinking about throwing some money into the game. I looked at Steam and saw that the peak player in the last week was 700. "This game is dead" and pretty much all interest went away.
8. "So it is going to take me weeks and weeks to be able to not suck?" That is a hard thing to accept while you are getting your ass kicked.
9. The game is on a system that is officially obsolete. This wasn't as much of a problem is 2013 with the PS4 just released. In 2014, that fact was a larger problem. Now, with Sony potentially ending their support for the console in the next year or two, "why bother to stick around on a sinking ship?"
EVE has that same "Welcome to New Eden" way of thinking but new people do get into the game. Why? Because the game is aesthetically pretty, it has a large player base, it does things differently compared to other games of the same genre, and EVE is a larger game than it really is, IE it is a social Facebook game that happens to have spaceships (again, no insult; the 'real game' in EVE is no way the mechanics within the game). In short, EVE is a good game that is just as much of a "we are going to kick you in the balls!" type of thing as DUST but if you slog through that "here comes the nut kicking!" you get something out of it.
DUST isn't good enough to accept that your jewels are going to be a little bruised.
If EVE is Day Z, DUST is War Z / Infestation: Survivor Stories. There is some fun to be had in DUST but it is easier to accept hoops you will be jumping through in a good game rather than a mediocre game.
That is why it is mostly veterans that stick around rather than the genuine influx of new players, imo.
"This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
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