DUST Search - 4 man squads in Pubs? Then give us Team Deploy in FW!!!!

deezy dabest wrote:

Starlight Burner wrote:

deezy dabest wrote:

Kain Spero wrote:

Also, match leaving is a problem present in ALL game modes today. There is a reason removing the team list has been discussed of a of couple occasions and even touched on by CCP Rattati and leaving who you are fighting to the kill feed and the EOM screen.

The whole match leaving thing seems to fall back more on incentive to fight. There is just not any real reward to battling it out and taking the win. Adding incentive to win solves the issues of leaving matches as well as gives people a reason to want to work together and bring an actual fight to the table.

When it comes to solving that the possibilities are truly endless which is strange to me that out of all the things that could work we ended up with the one that does the exact opposite.

The incentive to fight is LP and affecting EVE Online.

Lets not forget the fact that we've complained about the **** LP payouts. They boosted LP to add more incentive to fight.

I was speaking more to all game modes on that part.

With regards to FW every single one of us know that point that a match is lost and that no profit is going to be made no matter what happens so the whole match just turns into waiting for it to end. There are anomalies in there that go against that such as wanting bragging rights or whatever but none of the rest of our team share those feelings unless there is at minimum a partial sync so that we can get others excited.

I am not even bothering to say what I have tried to get people to see in that whole thing as this thread has been argumentative enough. What I will say is that something needs to be done for both FW and pubs because we can all agree on that.

WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.


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Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.29 15:28:00 - [1] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: madness I categorically disagree with you on pretty much all of your objections. Pubs are the designated "safe space" with matchmaking and smaller squads. Faction Warfare and PC are supposed to be hard mode and "I get to pick whose wheaties I get to sh*t in" hardmode respectively. There is no reason to cordon off two game modes for the benefit of people who do not wish to cooperate. Carebear protections should only be allowed so far. After a certain point they are detrimental to the game. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.29 16:24:00 - [2] - Quote It's supposed to be a competitive mode. You enter solo? You enter underskilled? This is a simple thing: Entering FW or PC means you pays your money, you takes your chances. Neither are intended to be solo, nor new player queues. Pubs are there for safe places from stompers. You're getting squads reduced to 4 to lessen that effect. Pubs are the ONLY intended safe haven from stomps. And there is no reason for other game modes to be subordinated as safe havens as well. Part of the original intent was for players to graduate FROM pubs to wars in FW, and organized corps that formed out of pubs and FW would move to compete in PC. The progression is: Academy --> Pubs --> FW --> PC. Going Academy --> FW isn't exactly part of the intended progression, but you can do it. The game mode is not walled off. but matchmaking doesn't rule here, and the mobs of organized squads are brutal as hell to fight. Because of that, there is no reason to further punish organized groups by preventing them from using FW as their "moneymaker" grounds or PC training areas. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.29 21:16:00 - [3] - Quote Piercing Serenity wrote: And I'm sure, even in EVE, it is possible to run FW solo. You might not have a noticeable impact, but you can do it without being curb stomped for trying. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Funniest statement I've seen all goddamn morning. Good one. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.30 08:00:00 - [4] - Quote System prioritizes squad sizes. That means it rapidly generates matches to dump 16 man squads. It then immediately dumps in the 9-15 groups, filling in gaps as needed. Then it drops the 8s. Then continues down. The more people who queue, the faster the process goes. If you get 8 miscellaneous squads in the queue with 500 solos, they get dumped on each other. Then the game rapidly generates 25 more matches for the randumbs There's not going to be any idiotic exclusion. This is tinfoil... More tinfoil... And look! More tinfoil! And singe the matchmaker in FW literally looks to pit larger groups against each other, there are still lots of places for smaller queues to fall in. Trying to force FW to cater to solos isn't expanding the game play. It's fostering that "individual > team" mentality catered to in other games. If I wanted that I'd play those other games. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.30 09:44:00 - [5] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Starlight Burner wrote: deezy dabest wrote: Kain Spero wrote: Also, match leaving is a problem present in ALL game modes today. There is a reason removing the team list has been discussed of a of couple occasions and even touched on by CCP Rattati and leaving who you are fighting to the kill feed and the EOM screen. The whole match leaving thing seems to fall back more on incentive to fight. There is just not any real reward to battling it out and taking the win. Adding incentive to win solves the issues of leaving matches as well as gives people a reason to want to work together and bring an actual fight to the table. When it comes to solving that the possibilities are truly endless which is strange to me that out of all the things that could work we ended up with the one that does the exact opposite. The incentive to fight is LP and affecting EVE Online. Lets not forget the fact that we've complained about the **** LP payouts. They boosted LP to add more incentive to fight. I was speaking more to all game modes on that part. With regards to FW every single one of us know that point that a match is lost and that no profit is going to be made no matter what happens so the whole match just turns into waiting for it to end. There are anomalies in there that go against that such as wanting bragging rights or whatever but none of the rest of our team share those feelings unless there is at minimum a partial sync so that we can get others excited. I am not even bothering to say what I have tried to get people to see in that whole thing as this thread has been argumentative enough. What I will say is that something needs to be done for both FW and pubs because we can all agree on that. You steps out of pubs? Then you pays your money, and takes your chances. The FW queue was never intended to be "balanced" or "fair." If youwant fair and to never have to worry about getting pasted just stay in pubs. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.06.30 10:14:00 - [6] - Quote Kevall Longstride wrote: But I still maintain that after a while they'll be calls for it to be reduced back to squads and Fireteams only for the reasons I specified. there will be. Just like the calls to rwmove all vehicles from a game mode were heeded. Just like the call to limit squads in pubs by reducing them by 2 was heeded. Part of the game is teaching players that working together brings the best results. Why are we pulling back and making it so that organization and teamwork don't matter as much? Teamwork is being treated like exploitive behavior. That's a bad precedent to set in a team tactical shooter. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.07.05 20:22:00 - [7] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Kain Spero wrote: Again, I was present when CCP set up team deploy as it stands in FW. I know for a fact that it was intentional. This has been stated publicly by CCP on a few occasions including fanfest round tables etc. so it isn't some gotcha moment. The matchmaker that was removed was for public matches and had nothing to do with Faction Warfare which is a separate system. So you are revealing information (or claiming to) that was obtained under NDA with CCP and using that as your argument? You have yet to show any of these public statements that you are claiming so it all has a bit of a stink to it. The only thing you linked stated exactly to the contrary of what you are saying. Show me any of this evidence and I will gladly admit that I was far in the wrong. God you're reaching. The fact that squads have priority in the matchmaking queue was an open secret that's been around since chromosome and earlier. The fact that Q-syncs were possible was arranged because they were having problems with the code to link multiple squads to the same match, which rattati and co. handily decided to work around via making three types of squads. Is this really difficult to figure out? If kane had been vomiting NDA materiel, Archduke woulda banned his ass and deleted the thread before it hit page 3. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.07.05 21:40:00 - [8] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: deezy dabest wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: Kain, you down to get the NF boys together and Q-synch 32 people, 16v16? I can record it. The most profitable scenario would be 16 people each from two corps who are both land holders. They would then be able to lock up districts and sell clones at will with no risk other than one of the squad leaders not hitting X at the right time. Yes this would take a somewhat considerable amount of effort. But hey everyone is too lazy to exploit things in this game right? No one uses modded controllers because they are too expensive for Dust either. O.o????? The hell are you going on about now with this clone selling business? Land holders? The hell does any of that have to do with Faction Warfare???? It has to do with exactly the point I made earlier about intentional CP farming through the same exploits. Considering CP is required for almost every move you make in PC as well as provides access to discounted clone packs any CP exploit is a serious one that has the means to offset the many months now that has been spent trying to work out PC 2.0. CP is required to sell clones. No CP no passive ISK from clone generation, more CP more passive ISK and district credits to spend in the "unique market" CP is required to change timers. If you want to lock districts through moving timers around you need a large flow of CP exactly what exploiting this could provide. CP can be used for cheaper clone packs which can also be used to launch locking attacks as well as give any corp a larger advantage than their corporation activity is meant to dictate. none of the preceding argument means a goddamn thing in the context of team deploy in faction warfare. Confirming Chewbacca Defense in action. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.07.05 22:32:00 - [9] - Quote You're making a lot of assumptions about "what, and Why" and forgetting that the previous dev team loved to overcomplicate simple things. We are currently at the mercy of a mad scientist dev who seems to think that simplicity that even a 12 year old can understand isn't a bad thing if it can add to the game. There is not "Matchmaker wasn't built to handle 16 man squads. the matchmaker doesn't give a crap if the squad is 16 or 6. In fact, if there's multiple 16s in the queue all the matchmaker has to do is pull the two highest in the queue, drop them then go back to Mu sorting of the smaller squads and randumbs. Every argument I have seen based on math eitehr needs to sh*t numbers proving the thesis or admit that the thesis is based on an asspull. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.07.05 22:49:00 - [10] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: The team builder in FW is not the match maker in pubs. It does not have Mu or anything else. It simply slams 16 people together as fast as possible while making sure squads get to go in first. OMG! YOU PAID ATTENTION! It appears you DO seem to understand how the matchmaker works. Now apply the following logic: Greater squad size = acceleration to a higher spot on queue. Priority of deployment: Full Squads. THEN partial squads THEN Randumbs. It has always been thus, even in FW. It does not simply roll the random number generator and go "All right, what miserable mismatch can I pop out of my ass today???" WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.07.05 22:52:00 - [11] - Quote Literally the only way to get a pot of randoms in FW vs a 16 would be for THE ENTIRE FW FACTION TO NOT DEPLOY ANY FULL TEAMS WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.