DUST Search - [Update] Warlords 1.1.3

DeathwindRising wrote:

Echo 1991 wrote:

DeathwindRising wrote:

CCP Rattati wrote:

What may not be obvious, is that I am aiming for a clear matrix of "best" in class per role per faction of stats.

That means cleaning up the many discrepancies we have, simple logical systems of calculations and then iterations according to a bigger plan.

Imagine a table with factions and roles on the left, and all the stats on the right as columns. Then a color oaf varying greens and reds to indicate best and worst. That's the master plan. Then we can all argue over why something is better than the other thing and how it should be changed.

Pirate

does this also include theory crafting like suit builds? because slot layout negate suit stats.

a cal assault is better with an AR then a gal assault because he's faster and able to get into range better.

a gal assault is better with ARR because he cant tank damage at range better than cals can because of how armor reps work, as well as deal more damage at range.

this was intended design? or oversight?

are you going to add the necessary suit bonuses to ensure slot use doesn't override suit stats and design? id like to see them before the Playstation 5 comes out lol

A Cal assault isnt faster, so i have no idea what you are on about and almost any other weapon is better on a gal suit than an AR.
I can make a Gal fit that reps at around 16 hp/s has near 560 armour and run at 8 m/s, if i tried to do the same with a cal assault i'd have trouble fitting a duvolle.

and cal assault can fit 613 shields, 52 hp/s, and sprint at ~8m/s

while fitting a proto AR with a basic nanohive. plus zero movement penalties.

so like i said. AR better on a cal assault.

you clearly dont run cal assault... or your fitting skills are trash.

and the reason ARs suck on gals is because gals are too slow to use them. its much better to use a longer ranged weapon and abuse armor reps at range than it is for a cal assault to fight at range with a long range weapon.

10% of US schools no longer teach Cursive. A decade from now, 10% of the US isn't going to understand all the squiglies.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 10	Posted - 2015.06.24 12:24:00 - [1] - Quote Shield Recharge Decent enough start. Looking forward to how well it works and most of all looking forward to no-longer having to dive for cover every time someone 100m+ away hit me. Looking forward to no longer seeing 'whittling away' at shields. Mobility Cool. Thank you for listening to us and taking this slow instead of hacking away at it with a hatchet. Speed Changes As above. Strafe Changes Hrmm. Interesting. Was actually sort of looking forward to the strafe speeds being a bit closer to closed beta numbers. Stamina Changes Eh.... I think this takes away a bit from the Minmatar Assault. They sacrifice EHP for their mobility, so if they can travel the same distance in the same time-frame than their benefit isn't "mobility" in general so much as movement speed. Stamina recovery bonus; I'll have to see how well it performs after the update. Without numbers it is sort of hard to get an idea of where they're at. Now that we have a much better framework (i.e. calculations that are simple and intuitive, we can tweak based on feedback. Best part of the hotfix! =) EDIT: Any update on fall damage? It is a little unfair for shield users. Vote #TeamGreen Because if you don't, the Caldari will be the next ones who are bias!
Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 10	Posted - 2015.06.24 14:24:00 - [2] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Yeah, there are three areas I would want to focus on, which are min and am scouts, light dropsuits and ga/ca assault. To me they are the weakest from a design perspective. 1) we can increase fitting on min scout and buff amplifiers for am scouts 2) buff ehp on light scouts to make them a bit easier to get into 3) fix the AR situation + make the ga bonus better, and change ca bonus to recoil. With limited tiericide (no slot progression, only PG/CPU), there will be so many new options and chaos, that I think that needs to happen first though. Sweet. Glad the Gallente/Caldari Assault situation is finally being addressed. Been waiting -soooo- long for both of those suits to be viable ^_^ Vote #TeamGreen Because if you don't, the Caldari will be the next ones who are bias!
Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 11	Posted - 2015.07.04 20:02:00 - [3] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: What may not be obvious, is that I am aiming for a clear matrix of "best" in class per role per faction of stats. That means cleaning up the many discrepancies we have, simple logical systems of calculations and then iterations according to a bigger plan. Imagine a table with factions and roles on the left, and all the stats on the right as columns. Then a color oaf varying greens and reds to indicate best and worst. That's the master plan. Then we can all argue over why something is better than the other thing and how it should be changed. It sounds like a good design, I think, if I'm understanding it correctly - though I am wary about it. If we're making the argument that "The best Assault is the Amarr Assault" or "The best Sentinel is the Gallente Sentinel" than in more competitive environments a lot of people's choices become less meaningful because competitive entities will only be looking for certain things. If I know that, mechanically, there is a "worst" sentinel, I'm going to grab someone else in favor of winning than field the guy who can only run the "worst" sentinel. Roles should have unique, situational viability. Going for best and worst design from Faction/Role standpoint trivializes a lot of people's decision making, I feel, and it sort of degrades the overall feeling of progression and balance as a whole. That is, if we're looking at a "best/worst" from a -global- standpoint and not a situational standpoint. Gallente Assault is best in CQC, Caldari Commando is best at sniping, sort of deal. If that is what you're referring to than just ignore my above statements. 10% of US schools no longer teach Cursive. A decade from now, 10% of the US isn't going to understand all the squiglies.
Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 11	Posted - 2015.07.04 21:42:00 - [4] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: What may not be obvious, is that I am aiming for a clear matrix of "best" in class per role per faction of stats. That means cleaning up the many discrepancies we have, simple logical systems of calculations and then iterations according to a bigger plan. Imagine a table with factions and roles on the left, and all the stats on the right as columns. Then a color oaf varying greens and reds to indicate best and worst. That's the master plan. Then we can all argue over why something is better than the other thing and how it should be changed. does this also include theory crafting like suit builds? because slot layout negate suit stats. a cal assault is better with an AR then a gal assault because he's faster and able to get into range better. a gal assault is better with ARR because he cant tank damage at range better than cals can because of how armor reps work, as well as deal more damage at range. this was intended design? or oversight? are you going to add the necessary suit bonuses to ensure slot use doesn't override suit stats and design? id like to see them before the Playstation 5 comes out lol A Cal assault isnt faster, so i have no idea what you are on about and almost any other weapon is better on a gal suit than an AR. I can make a Gal fit that reps at around 16 hp/s has near 560 armour and run at 8 m/s, if i tried to do the same with a cal assault i'd have trouble fitting a duvolle. and cal assault can fit 613 shields, 52 hp/s, and sprint at ~8m/s while fitting a proto AR with a basic nanohive. plus zero movement penalties. so like i said. AR better on a cal assault. you clearly dont run cal assault... or your fitting skills are trash. and the reason ARs suck on gals is because gals are too slow to use them. its much better to use a longer ranged weapon and abuse armor reps at range than it is for a cal assault to fight at range with a long range weapon. The flaw in this logic is that there are players who run Gallente Assaults with ferroscale plates. They aren't "too slow to use them", it's just that there is no benefit -to- using them. AR gets a whole 8% more DPS than an ARR but at the expense of 43% of the range. That isn't a good trade-off. Speed has nothing to do with it, it is the trade-off of range over DPS. I could be running around at MinScout speeds but it isn't going to help me kill the guy any faster once I am within range of my weapon. When I run Cal Assault? I use an ARR because of that advantage. The shield/speed is an afterthought. I don't hesitate to engage someone in CQC -as- a Cal Assault because I know that the amount of DPS gains from other rifles is miniscule at best. 30 DPS can be, and is, negated by mobility, proper use of cover, and fitting. 30m of range is a completely different story. And please, spare yourself the consequence of looking foolish when saying "You clearly don't run 'x, y, and z'" because it just makes the rest of us more likely to dismiss your arguments. 10% of US schools no longer teach Cursive. A decade from now, 10% of the US isn't going to understand all the squiglies.