DUST Search - Swarm launcher lock on change proposal

Bright Cloud wrote:

Im gonna dig into this by explaining how lock ons are working on eve online. You have a ship and that ship has a signature profile similar to dropsuits on dust. The bigger your signature is the faster a hostile ship can lock you, the smaller it is the longer it takes.

Now that we know about this how about if Swarm launchers would have a different lock on time based on the scan profile of the target? The bigger the vehicle the faster you can get a lock on, the smaller it gets the longer it will take. Sounds fair right? In my opinion it should be somewhat like this:

A.

HAV's= no penalty cause its the biggest vehicle, current scan profile is set at 200DB
LAV's= +50% lock on time, scan profile should be then 133DB (current profile is 150DB)
Dropships= +35% lock on time, scan profile should be then 148DB (current profile is 150DB)

B.

Additionally we could introduce profile dampeners for vehicles which influence the lock on time for swarm launchers. Maybe even have a powerfull active profile dampening module that cuts down your scan profile by 50%.

C.

If we would implement this then AV weapons like the forgegun and the plasma cannon would shine more cause they actually require skill and not just point it in the general direction of a vehicle and spam it. Additionally pilots would have a "counter" against swarms with a active profile dampening module which actively lowers the DPS from swarm launchers. LAV's could take a hit and have the time to escape before the second volley finishes them off.

When there is light, shadow's lurk and fear reign's... Yet by the blade of knight's, mankind, was given hope.

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Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2015.06.22 20:25:00 - [1] - Quote Im gonna dig into this by explaining how lock ons are working on eve online. You have a ship and that ship has a signature profile similar to dropsuits on dust. The bigger your signature is the faster a hostile ship can lock you, the smaller it is the longer it takes. Now that we know about this how about if Swarm launchers would have a different lock on time based on the scan profile of the target? The bigger the vehicle the faster you can get a lock on, the smaller it gets the longer it will take. Sounds fair right? In my opinion it should be somewhat like this: HAV's= no penalty cause its the biggest vehicle, current scan profile is set at 200DB LAV's= +50% lock on time, scan profile should be then 133DB (current profile is 150DB) Dropships= +35% lock on time, scan profile should be then 148DB (current profile is 150DB) Additionally we could introduce profile dampeners for vehicles which influence the lock on time for swarm launchers. Maybe even have a powerfull active profile dampening module that cuts down your scan profile by 50%. If we would implement this then AV weapons like the forgegun and the plasma cannon would shine more cause they actually require skill and not just point it in the general direction of a vehicle and spam it. Additionally pilots would have a "counter" against swarms with a active profile dampening module which actively lowers the DPS from swarm launchers. LAV's could take a hit and have the time to escape before the second volley finishes them off. Rudimentary Mercs of scrubs and incompetence. You touch my mind, fumbling in Ignorance, incapable of understanding.
Derrith Erador Fatal Absolution 3	Posted - 2015.06.22 20:48:00 - [2] - Quote Love the idea, had one of my own where swarms could based on distance and lock size. By that I mean this Swarms would have three lock box modes, each with gradually smaller lock boxes but longer lock distance and the swarmer will have to maintain lock, and will lose missiles for every two seconds he cannot regain lock. By that I mean this: I used the inner crosshair of a forge gun to make these box sizes. Lock mode 1: Distance 100 meters, box size: 16x Lock mode 2: Distance 200 meters, box size: 8x Lock mode 3: Distance 330 meters, box size: 4x The thought behind this is to give swarms the opportunity to still hit a vehicle from afar, but to make sure that the hit is earned instead of just given to him. The assault swarm would behave differently and get greater range, but at a reduced damage rate. Lock mode 1: Distance 150 meters, Box size: 16x Lock mode 2: Distance 250 meters, Box size: 12x Lock mode 3: Distance 380 meters, box size: 6x 99% of what Derrith says is stupidity. -D3lta Blitzkrieg Oh yeah?! Well, I love redheads.
Zan Azikuchi G.R.A.V.E The Ditanian Alliance 108	Posted - 2015.06.22 21:05:00 - [3] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: Im gonna dig into this by explaining how lock ons are working on eve online. You have a ship and that ship has a signature profile similar to dropsuits on dust. The bigger your signature is the faster a hostile ship can lock you, the smaller it is the longer it takes. Now that we know about this how about if Swarm launchers would have a different lock on time based on the scan profile of the target? The bigger the vehicle the faster you can get a lock on, the smaller it gets the longer it will take. Sounds fair right? In my opinion it should be somewhat like this: A. HAV's= no penalty cause its the biggest vehicle, current scan profile is set at 200DB LAV's= +50% lock on time, scan profile should be then 133DB (current profile is 150DB) Dropships= +35% lock on time, scan profile should be then 148DB (current profile is 150DB) B. Additionally we could introduce profile dampeners for vehicles which influence the lock on time for swarm launchers. Maybe even have a powerfull active profile dampening module that cuts down your scan profile by 50%. C. If we would implement this then AV weapons like the forgegun and the plasma cannon would shine more cause they actually require skill and not just point it in the general direction of a vehicle and spam it. Additionally pilots would have a "counter" against swarms with a active profile dampening module which actively lowers the DPS from swarm launchers. LAV's could take a hit and have the time to escape before the second volley finishes them off. Okay, first of all, I know you mean well, but reading this and I splitted it so I can tell you what's wrong with this, but this will only break the SL's completely and make them worthless again, now I could be like most AVer's and tell you off, but I'm gonna take the time to actually get on level with you and say: Yes SL's are what they are now and break vehicles, but no should they actually recieve debuff unless you've got the actual skill to tread through the mud and stick it to your enemies (chromosome tank's anyone?). A. HAV's seem's obvious, I'm okay with that. LAV's are you sure you don't realize that Heavies like to jump into lav's and gank people harder than you can scream "F%$#!", so I'd say no. Dropship's are extremely annoying, unbelievably annoying to deal with and most people only use them to get uplink's to area's, dropships like sniper's, are purely situational, and because of hardener's and DS tanking, they'd be in the area far too long and dropping far more people than they already should be able to, this implies if your a good/skilled pilot. B. Okay seriously, you started off good, but then you ruined the entire OP by making something OP (oh the irony or double meanings). Anything that improve's this kind of dampening would dis allow SL's to do anything other than look threatening, DS' and LAV's could sit there for minute's on end if they had this kind of profile related lock on, and tank's would practically sit there and shoot everyone on the field, how many heavies ACTUALLY survive in a CQC match with a tank? The only reason why vehicles GTFO the zone is cause of swarm launcher's in the first place, sure PLC can do the job too, but how threatening is a PLC in their current state? You were thinking highly negatively of the AVer's and obviously want to be sh%$ing on everyone not inside a vehicle. C. Umm for those of you who don't really know this, but swarm's do take skill, it's called positioning, knowing the best way to get the second volley in, and having the balls to actually get in the vehicles face with the SL. You clearly have no idea how easy it is to kill someone, NOT in a vehicle. as for FG's and PLC's, again, who stand's against a tank, and only FG's will be able to effectively kill POSSIBLY kill a DS or any other vehicle for that matter, PLC's are a "scare-em-good" weapon meant to look menacing but not actually be a threat, unless your a shield heavy vehicle. Evaluation: You had something, but then you dropped the ball on this, now just letting you know, I don't use vehicle's, and neither do I see a disparity in power between vehicle's and anti vehicle personnel, if you get killed by AV it's generally because you got stuck on something, or you out stayed your welcome. Good at the very beginning, but started dropping in the middle, and then hit the ground hard (and not in the good way) at the end. Well this became a wall of text, kudos to ANY who decided to actually read this, and finally, I don't discourage nor support vehicle use, I'm neutral party, the longer a vehicle survive's, the more point's I get from it, essentially getting more from it while it's alive rather than actually getting the kill on it (though there IS a bit of pleasure in taking the kill on it though), anything that reduce's the amount of potential WP an AVer in 1 general class only mean's that you'll be seeing more PLC and FG's on the kill feed against INFANTRY, and not actual vehicles (the consequence's were not thought of at the end which poses a considerable question here, but passes because everyone else does the same thing, myself included). Again, kudos to anyone who read's this, your an un-godly saint. When there is light, shadow's lurk and fear reign's... Yet by the blade of knight's, mankind, was given hope.
Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2015.06.22 21:33:00 - [4] - Quote How would this be OP? Yes it would devalue swarm launchers and encourage the usage of forgeguns and PLC's. You need aswell to keep in mind that you have to make room for it on your vehicle fitting and the module might turn out to be somewhere around -25% scan profile. And dont come at me with the positioning crap when all you need to do is aim in the general direction of a vehicle, hold it for like 1.2 seconds and then fire the swarm volley. Seriously how does that take in any way more skill then firing a PLC at range where you have to consider travel time+projectile drop or the forgegun where you need to lead your shots on a fast moving target like LAV's or dropships? Swarms are fire and forget and even worse is the better quality grade your swarm launcher is the bigger the lock on box gets. Yes youve read right not just that proto swarms have more damage they aswell have a significant bigger lock on box which makes aiming at a vehicle even easier then its allready is. PLC's and Forgeguns do not have anything like that, they work exactly the same and have the same reticule, projectile drop and travel time troughout all tiers. Swarm launchers are the AV weapon for lazy guys who cant even hit the broad side of a barn. In my opinion skill should be rewarded and "easy mode" solutions should have a drawback attached to them and in this case the smaller your vehicle the longer it takes to acquire a lock on with your swarm launcher. Rudimentary Mercs of scrubs and incompetence. You touch my mind, fumbling in Ignorance, incapable of understanding.
Zan Azikuchi G.R.A.V.E The Ditanian Alliance 108	Posted - 2015.06.22 22:01:00 - [5] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: How would this be OP? Yes it would devalue swarm launchers and encourage the usage of forgeguns and PLC's. You need aswell to keep in mind that you have to make room for it on your vehicle fitting and the module might turn out to be somewhere around -25% scan profile. And dont come at me with the positioning crap when all you need to do is aim in the general direction of a vehicle, hold it for like 1.2 seconds and then fire the swarm volley. Seriously how does that take in any way more skill then firing a PLC at range where you have to consider travel time+projectile drop or the forgegun where you need to lead your shots on a fast moving target like LAV's or dropships? Swarms are fire and forget and even worse is the better quality grade your swarm launcher is the bigger the lock on box gets. Yes youve read right not just that proto swarms have more damage they aswell have a significant bigger lock on box which makes aiming at a vehicle even easier then its allready is. PLC's and Forgeguns do not have anything like that, they work exactly the same and have the same reticule, projectile drop and travel time troughout all tiers. Swarm launchers are the AV weapon for lazy guys who cant even hit the broad side of a barn. In my opinion skill should be rewarded and "easy mode" solutions should have a drawback attached to them and in this case the smaller your vehicle the longer it takes to acquire a lock on with your swarm launcher. I already stated the consequence's of this entire OP, the broken profile dampening and overall my concern's, there's no point in arguing over this with you (not that I'm saying I'm right in any form or way), and also yes, positioning is a thing as any vehicle can easily take you out with the wrong footing. Regardless of anything, this would truly make SL's worthless and obsolete and would only ignite a massive damage buff to SL's after 1 year of them being in said lock on state... And if you can't think of any way's to work around the dampening (which should be clear to you as it is to me), then this OP isn't going to get anywhere real. You need to remember infantry are gonna bash vehicles hard on the forums (and dev's will probably make them more glass-cannon, or do something that's gonna put balance's off the scale and deep end). When there is light, shadow's lurk and fear reign's... Yet by the blade of knight's, mankind, was given hope.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 1	Posted - 2015.06.23 12:12:00 - [6] - Quote Dropships are larger than tanks. Land one next to a gun logi. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me. "I sometimes wonder why I share stuff "- CCP Rattati


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