Amarr and Minmatar Relationship simply put:

Amarr think it's their goddamn right to guide the "Inferior" races of New Eden.

Well, it's my goddamn right to kneel before them while telling them we're sorry "lets be pals".

"The Vherokior privately feel very good about recent events, but generally shy away from displaying this appreciation publicly. They're cautiously optimistic, but at the same time prepared for setbacks."

this is exactly how i am IRL

The Amarr view of slavery as a trial of faith (not "trail") is frankly pretty silly. Many subsequent generations descended from slaves will live die as slaves. If they truly wanted to just convert people, they would take the offspring of the first generation, raise them just like they raise regular Amarr children, and they will easily assimilate into the religion and society. Newborn Amarr children don't have to suffer trials of faith through slavery, so why should newborn children of any other race suffer it when they could just be raised as Amarr? If they used the method I described, the enslaved Minmatar could have been all converted and assimilated after the first 100 yrs, with the first defiant generation already dead -- personally I think that would have sucked, but it does prove that their claims of it being about religious integration is BS.

Minmatar: We are the most advanced race evaaaaa!
Amarr: *pew pew pew* *Lasers*
Minmatar: Nuhhh! Our stuff!
Amarr: You are our SLAVES! But here, we feel bad, so here is some Duct Tape.
Minmatar: WORST MISTAKE EVER LASER LOVERS! *Uses Duct Tape to make fast ships and huge Ragnarok Titans*
Amarr: Ah crap....
Minmatar: Hey Amarr, F- Youuuuuuuuuuuu!

I do get that's what the Amarr claim in the lore, but it just seems disingenuous on their part for the reasons I explained. Also the slave labor could have been replaced with cheap drones that don't need to be fed and can run on solar power or something. And seriously, the spelling this is kind of rampant in your posts, and it distracts from intelligent things you may have to say.

They may have had a more advanced military, but someone else in the thread actually reposted what I read.
"At one time they had a flourishing empire with a level of mechanical excellence never before or since seen anywhere."

Although that statement confuses me. If it hasn't been seen anywhere since, that would mean the Amarr didn't grab any of their tech for some reason.

I have a couple questions.

@Kirk - Why do the Gallente and Caldari continue to fight? From what I understand from what you wrote, the Caldari wanted independence from the Federation. Do the Gallente still not want the Caldari to be independent?

@True - Did the Amarr not try to enslave the Gallente and Caldari as well? If not, what made them different from the Minmatar? And why did the Amarr start by trying to enslave the Jovians?

I also have a few other points to dispute mainly with Kage but I already know how he feels on the subject. One big important part of the Amarrian-Minmatar debate is the difficulty I have trying to explain the stand point and culture of the Amarr to most players and trying to discuss the topic where Minmatar players can step out of their preconceived notion of "The Grand Democratic World" and critically look at both groups.

I often think I sound like an Amarrian apologist but I feel it necessary to try to explain the social and cultural nuances.

Also in terms of IC [In character opinion] I stand with the Amarrian Pro-Heideran Pragmatic Liberalists. I'm not against liberalism like some staunch Ardishapurites are but I accept that it's not a perfect concept and am willing to use it pragmatically to advance my personal agenda in the NOBLE TASH-MURKON WAY!

There's more to technology than just weapons.

The reason for their lack of colonization wasn't because they were afraid or because they didn't have the technology for it, it's because there was little incentive for it. Matar is a natural paradise, even more so before the invasion. Not much reason to go far when you can get everything you need nearby. (The early Amarr empire nearly broke apart from over population and a stagnant economy.)

The success of the Amarrian invasion is due the fact that the Minmatar had been at peace for centuries, and was unaware of any other advanced race. (The Gallente and Caldari made contact early on, and the Amarrians made contact with the Udorians early as well. The Minmatar however were alone within their region.) Thus little reason to improve weapons or build defenses. The Amarr also had waited to invade just as the largest storm on the planet happened.

Now these facts shouldn't detract from the technology the Minmatar did have. The fact that the most numerous race managed to live prosperously on such little land and was capable of production of pretty advanced technology without international trade is pretty amazing. Whatever it is they were doing, it was clearly super efficient and beyond what every other race was doing.

"At one time they had a flourishing empire with a level of mechanical excellence never before or since seen anywhere."
I will say however, the fact that this line is never gone into any more detail is infuriating to me, because there is such ambiguity involved. One of the most important things to make note of though is that the Minmatar empire was flourishing. Meaning any Amarrian justification for the invasion involving uplifting the Minmatar or saving them from squalor is a total lie.

Pator is the system. Not the planet. The planet is Matar.
"However, having known no large-scale warfare for centuries"

I've not seen a date on when the tribal wars happened so I'm not sure how long they were between the invasion, but I'm fairly certain I read Matar was at peace for 600 years before the Amarrian invasion. I'll look more into finding a source for that later.

The thing that worries me is the alliance between the Amarr and the Caldari. Just how formal and strong is this 'alliance'?

Can't let go of the past? Almost a third of all Minmatar are still enslaved today. That calls for action.