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Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
833
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Posted - 2015.06.07 00:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
Squagga wrote:Shields are terrible right now. Not to mention the fact that every weapon tears through shields. On top of that we have to place shield regulators, to try and get our shields back, which means we can't put on armor plates in those slots. It's terribad 1. Only 2 weapons have a positive profile for shields. 2. If armour suits have to chose between high reps or base rep, shield suits have to deal with needing a slot for the recharge to kick in faster. No one is forcing you to use a regulator. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
833
|
Posted - 2015.06.07 10:59:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mina Longstrike wrote:Petra 222 SoM wrote:I'll just leave this here for you to ponder. Dust.thang I think that 'example' can be pretty cherrypicked. It can be quite possible to stack large amounts of shields *and* armor on the cal assault, and because shields rep much faster than armor (once their recharge kicks in) the turnaround on your total EHP is better (because armor reps sloooowly). Basically it's a niche type of fit that allows you to more often have a larger portion your total EHP pool available in individual engagements. This doesn't mean necessarily that shield tanks are 'fine'. Aside from needing a damage threshold and maybe a fitting room buff what exactly is wrong with them? |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
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Posted - 2015.06.08 11:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
JARREL THOMAS wrote:Just give caldari a stat increase to sheild hp, recharge rate, depleted recharge time, and recharge time. Why? You already have the best shield stats in the game. There is no reason you should get even better stats Just because you don't want to fit regulators. Armour suits need to fit reps to get anywhere near shields HP rate. All shields need is a remote shield booster and a damage threshold (maybe even a fitting buff) they don't need more HP |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.08 13:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
JARREL THOMAS wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:JARREL THOMAS wrote:Just give caldari a stat increase to sheild hp, recharge rate, depleted recharge time, and recharge time. Why? You already have the best shield stats in the game. There is no reason you should get even better stats Just because you don't want to fit regulators. Armour suits need to fit reps to get anywhere near shields HP rate. All shields need is a remote shield booster and a damage threshold (maybe even a fitting buff) they don't need more HP They're the best but still **** is why. And, I do fit regs I don't armor stack but thats the thing also the regs take away our ability to stack bio and electronics mods and one of them is in high slots while you guys can hop do more damage or stack shields. Also why would you guys need to stack to have reps like us you guys can stack way more ehp than us and still deal massive damage. And besides the hp bonus up there would be minor but the others would go up. Caldari are the shield version of Gallente they rep fast and we should to, but faster since we're weak ass shields. Fitting armour means I can't fit biotics, so that's a moot point. Also caldari are not the shield version of the gallente, they are 2 different suits that function very differently.
And please, don't complain that armour suits can get more eHP, doing that means they have no reps, they get caught with their pants down and they get punished for it. Shields need tweaking but caldari suits shouldn't be buffed (except logi cos its abysmal) just because you think it's stats are bad. If anything, all that needs to happen is a fitting reduction, a damage threshold and a shield repairer needs to be added. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.08 18:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:JARREL THOMAS wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:JARREL THOMAS wrote:Just give caldari a stat increase to sheild hp, recharge rate, depleted recharge time, and recharge time. Why? You already have the best shield stats in the game. There is no reason you should get even better stats Just because you don't want to fit regulators. Armour suits need to fit reps to get anywhere near shields HP rate. All shields need is a remote shield booster and a damage threshold (maybe even a fitting buff) they don't need more HP They're the best but still **** is why. And, I do fit regs I don't armor stack but thats the thing also the regs take away our ability to stack bio and electronics mods and one of them is in high slots while you guys can hop do more damage or stack shields. Also why would you guys need to stack to have reps like us you guys can stack way more ehp than us and still deal massive damage. And besides the hp bonus up there would be minor but the others would go up. Caldari are the shield version of Gallente they rep fast and we should to, but faster since we're weak ass shields. Fitting armour means I can't fit biotics, so that's a moot point. Also caldari are not the shield version of the gallente, they are 2 different suits that function very differently. And please, don't complain that armour suits can get more eHP, doing that means they have no reps, they get caught with their pants down and they get punished for it. Shields need tweaking but caldari suits shouldn't be buffed (except logi cos its abysmal) just because you think it's stats are bad. If anything, all that needs to happen is a fitting reduction, a damage threshold and a shield repairer needs to be added. It's not moot, high armor is part of the reason we want a shield buff, plus you don't need reps, 3 out of 5 games will always have a guy with rep tools, making armor reps obsolete, which in turn makes shield reps obsolete, alone a shield regen with 2 complex shield recharges is 66 per every, what? 4 seconds without complex regs? All this on amedium cal suit. A min logi can give an amarr medium stacking armor plates over 120 per what? 0.20 seconds? Thats what it feels like, and i've been on both ends of said repping, so I can tell from experience, and th excuse "go for the logi"doesn't apply if the amarr suit is in the way, or if the logi is around the corner, by which time in this scenario, i'd have died 6-8 times until I give up and go else where. Regardless of scenario A, even if the enemy armor didn't have a logi, my weapon requires spooling, my enemies do not, breach AR rips through shield and armor, like the CR and the ScR and its aslt variant. It doesn't matter if my suit's suppose to"function" differently, theres a formula to CQC battles that simply cant be met with the current gimpy shield suits, we need a proper buff. Shields don't need a buff, they need more things that benefit them. Like a shield repairer. Also mate, shield recharge rate is still per second there's just a delay which needs a threshold so it isn't broken by a bullet from 100m away that does 1 damage doesn't stop it. Maybe make it easier to fit rechargers and energizers as well even extenders.
And whoever told you that the AR rips through armour is smoking something. Another thing, if shield suits are bad, why are most other shield suits fine? Min assault is fine, cal scout is fine, caldari commando is fine, min scout is fine. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.09 08:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote: Shields don't need a buff, they need more things that benefit them. Like a shield repairer. Also mate, shield recharge rate is still per second there's just a delay which needs a threshold so it isn't broken by a bullet from 100m away that does 1 damage doesn't stop it. Maybe make it easier to fit rechargers and energizers as well even extenders.
And whoever told you that the AR rips through armour is smoking something. Another thing, if shield suits are bad, why are most other shield suits fine? Min assault is fine, cal scout is fine, caldari commando is fine, min scout is fine.
So your saying that shield's should remain lower in HP value to armor? I can fit recharges and shield extenders and regulator's just fine, and I didn't say AR, I said BREACH AR. The shield suits you speak of: Min assaults don't rely on shield's they rely on armor plates, cal scout has horrible/problematic hit boxes, not an excuse for no shield buff's unless you plan to give caldari broken hit boxes that nobody can hit. Caldari commando is absolute trash, it's most viable simply sniping and defending one's self when someone decides to take out a DS to hunt your ass, if their not in an ADS of course. and Min scout, again, doesn't rely on shield's, they use myrofibs and once more, like all other scout's, have horrible/problematic hit boxes, and once more, not an excuse for no buffing or no rebalancing's, (also the tac ar does pretty well against armor as well my friend's have beaten high HP armor fit's with them). So, what's your next move? Otherwise i'll call checkmate on this (no joke, no troll).
Lol, min assaults aren't armour tanks and last i checked, min scouts use shields. I swear you have no idea what you're on about. I know the caldari commando is fine, point defence from up high with a swarm launcher is one of the things it does best, minmando beats it but compared to the minmando all commandos are bad.
If you want an actual shield buff, provide actual evidence that shields are bad, not they're bad because 2 weapons wreck them. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.09 14:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
Then ask for a buff to regulators and a buff to the delay on the heavy frames. Also a shield repairer is NEEDED so logis can rep shield suits, it isn't fair that this isn't in the game but its not that shields are bad that cause shield suits to not be as good, its the lack of support equipment. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.09 20:27:00 -
[8] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Then ask for a buff to regulators and a buff to the delay on the heavy frames. Also a shield repairer is NEEDED so logis can rep shield suits, it isn't fair that this isn't in the game but its not that shields are bad that cause shield suits to not be as good, its the lack of support equipment. If that would be the case, then we would need a shield buff any how, a buff to overall shield HP to make overall use to the shield reps, it's only common sense at that point... No you wouldn't because you already have built in reps which is one of the reasons plates give more HP. It requires 2 modules to get HP and reps whereas shields don't need to fit any modules to repair, you can speed up the process but you don't have to.
All I've seen is most shield users complain that they cannot recharge their shields fast enough when in cover, so it stands to reason that if anything is the problem its recharge rates. So therefore they should be buffed. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.09 20:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Squagga wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Then ask for a buff to regulators and a buff to the delay on the heavy frames. Also a shield repairer is NEEDED so logis can rep shield suits, it isn't fair that this isn't in the game but its not that shields are bad that cause shield suits to not be as good, its the lack of support equipment. Just because armor tankers have their armor reps the way they want them, and the tech to support it. Doesn't mean we shouldn't have both. Also I wasn't going to go out of my way to ask for everything. But since you suggested it. Why not? There is no reason (except lack of game memory) to not implement these things. Hopefully, when power cores are introduced and memory is freed up, they can just use the the standard rep tool as a base and make it rep shields.
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Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
835
|
Posted - 2015.06.09 20:44:00 -
[10] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Then ask for a buff to regulators and a buff to the delay on the heavy frames. Also a shield repairer is NEEDED so logis can rep shield suits, it isn't fair that this isn't in the game but its not that shields are bad that cause shield suits to not be as good, its the lack of support equipment. If that would be the case, then we would need a shield buff any how, a buff to overall shield HP to make overall use to the shield reps, it's only common sense at that point... No you wouldn't because you already have built in reps which is one of the reasons plates give more HP. It requires 2 modules to get HP and reps whereas shields don't need to fit any modules to repair, you can speed up the process but you don't have to. All I've seen is most shield users complain that they cannot recharge their shields fast enough when in cover, so it stands to reason that if anything is the problem its recharge rates. So therefore they should be buffed. The amount of shield tank on a caldari suit is low, to give shield repair tools but not increase shield HP to make proper use out of them is counter-intuitive, armor suits survive because they can take and soak up damage and get repped at the same time, if they get low, they find cover, and said logi can get 2k WP's from this, for the shield rep to be effective, shield HP needs to be improved. Not necessarily, if you have a shield rep tool, those high slots you use for energizers/rechargers with more extenders which will give you more HP anyway.
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Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
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Posted - 2015.06.10 20:50:00 -
[11] - Quote
Squagga wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Squagga wrote:That weak "nerf" to ScR isn't helping the situation. Caldari are the only race that are shield based. We still need a buff in this armor meta 1. Fit Regen 2. Use Cover Seriously, set up a ck.0 with 3x Complex Extenders, 2x Energizers, and 2x Regulators. You'll have over 500 shield that recharges almost instantly. This will also save you from the "Flux-Push" tactic. Once again, it doesn't matter how fast I get my shields back, if I'm already laying on the ground with guts hanging out of my ass Then by that logic it doesn't matter how fast armour reps if I get smashed by a core locus. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
|
Posted - 2015.06.10 21:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
Noooooooo, it was warped logic. No one has said that shield suits shouldn't be able to get stuck in there. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
|
Posted - 2015.06.10 21:33:00 -
[13] - Quote
Armour reps through damage cos it uses a module to get a rep rate. What module does a shield suit need to get their shields back? You don't need one. Just fit 2 regulators and your shields come back within 2-3 seconds at 30hp/s. An armour suit needs 4 modules to get over that. it seems you want the best of both worlds and are throwing your toys out of the pram cos everyone is telling you no.
Shields have a naturally higher rep rate, the downside is always gonna be the fact you have a delay. Deal with it. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
|
Posted - 2015.06.10 21:51:00 -
[14] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:See, this is exactly what I was talking about... This logic, nothing will get done for shield's because you like the easy kills, the easy time you get killing shield player's, this is why shield players complain, it's not easy using an RR in CQC not easy killing an armor suit at 40+ meters with one either, but with an AR/SCR/CR/RR they beat you as shield's, the caldari are suppose to be the best at caldari tech, you know **** it, your not gonna understand cause you don't play it with nothing but shield mod's, no damage mods, no dampeners, just regs, extenders, and recharges, with nothing but the RR, use it for the next 3 month's and then tell me if it's fine... I've been saying shield regen mods need a buff on almost all my posts. You try use an armour suit and tell me how them RRs, CRs and mass drivers feel. You also have to remember the RR isn't meant for CQC which is why it isn't that good for it. Its primary use is long range. I'm fairly certain if the breach AR and normal AR could shoot out 70+ metres, people would call for a nerf cos its a short range weapon. Don't complain it isn't as good as an AR or CR in cqc, scramblers are a different story entirely.
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Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
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Posted - 2015.06.10 23:44:00 -
[15] - Quote
Zan Azikuchi wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Zan Azikuchi wrote:See, this is exactly what I was talking about... This logic, nothing will get done for shield's because you like the easy kills, the easy time you get killing shield player's, this is why shield players complain, it's not easy using an RR in CQC not easy killing an armor suit at 40+ meters with one either, but with an AR/SCR/CR/RR they beat you as shield's, the caldari are suppose to be the best at caldari tech, you know **** it, your not gonna understand cause you don't play it with nothing but shield mod's, no damage mods, no dampeners, just regs, extenders, and recharges, with nothing but the RR, use it for the next 3 month's and then tell me if it's fine... I've been saying shield regen mods need a buff on almost all my posts. You try use an armour suit and tell me how them RRs, CRs and mass drivers feel. You also have to remember the RR isn't meant for CQC which is why it isn't that good for it. Its primary use is long range. I'm fairly certain if the breach AR and normal AR could shoot out 70+ metres, people would call for a nerf cos its a short range weapon. Don't complain it isn't as good as an AR or CR in cqc, scramblers are a different story entirely. Lol, i've placed armor mod's on my Ck0, i've out lived, most players with all the weapons, including CR, mod's don't need a buff the suit needs changes, I shouldn't be capable of taking on amarr with an SCR and win with the RR in both cqc AND long range, while using armor mods, if I can do that, then either some mods are broken, or their too powerful. I've taken hit's from MD's too, not a problem, CR? give me a break, only reason it ever kills me, is cause I get jumped, or it's a jumper, everything that goes against armor, isn't as severely damaging as you make it out to be. (Every post you make, you seem to prove my logic right). Caldari needs a buff cos you can kill people with it?? Did you think about that before you typed? Try use an actual armour suit that doesn't have 350 HP shield buffer and then tell me that a combat rifle and mass driver doesn't rip through you. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
836
|
Posted - 2015.06.10 23:45:00 -
[16] - Quote
Mex-0 wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Zan Azikuchi wrote:See, this is exactly what I was talking about... This logic, nothing will get done for shield's because you like the easy kills, the easy time you get killing shield player's, this is why shield players complain, it's not easy using an RR in CQC not easy killing an armor suit at 40+ meters with one either, but with an AR/SCR/CR/RR they beat you as shield's, the caldari are suppose to be the best at caldari tech, you know **** it, your not gonna understand cause you don't play it with nothing but shield mod's, no damage mods, no dampeners, just regs, extenders, and recharges, with nothing but the RR, use it for the next 3 month's and then tell me if it's fine... I've been saying shield regen mods need a buff on almost all my posts. You try use an armour suit and tell me how them RRs, CRs and mass drivers feel. You also have to remember the RR isn't meant for CQC which is why it isn't that good for it. Its primary use is long range. I'm fairly certain if the breach AR and normal AR could shoot out 70+ metres, people would call for a nerf cos its a short range weapon. Don't complain it isn't as good as an AR or CR in cqc, scramblers are a different story entirely. Breach AR used to be OP. It then got nerfed because it was too good. |
Echo 1991
Dead Man's Game
841
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Posted - 2015.06.13 14:40:00 -
[17] - Quote
does no one realise that projectile weapons have a -15/+15 pofile? |
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