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korrah silain
True Illuminate
29
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Posted - 2015.05.04 22:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:Would any of these things be different or unique enough to warrant their own models and the work that goes into them? Would they add any new and exciting gameplay? all signs point to no, this is pointless redundancy for the sake of redundancy.
We have a lot of gun varieties because this is a shooter. We do not have a lot of melee weapon varieties because this isn't dungeons and dragons.
Well why couldn't they? Gallente use a one handed weapon (shorts sword/maul) and a shield which can be used as mobile cover (using aim button) that can be depleated
We have nks which can be charged but have short range
A two handed claymore or Axe for whoever which swings slow but can take out heavies in one shot potentially.
A whip which can be used at longer range for less damage and maybe be used to drag an opponent. Short distance out of cover or what have you.
I'm not saying it should be changed because yes there's a lot that could be fixed, however I'm in favor of it cause I hate but stroking and pistol whipping, think it would add variety, and also people have been looking for more weapons, so maybe melee? Since we are discussing it. Also since melee functions from stamina we can have performance differences there, and it creates more interplay for cardiac regulators.
Edit: oh **** just realized people have been asking for the web things from eve that slow ships, this could be a fair way of implementation: myrmydons using nova tridents and webs. |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
35
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Posted - 2015.05.05 01:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
Billy Jr wrote:shadow tongue wrote:At this rate I'm surprised nobody suggested a gunblade type of deal...honestly I think we could use more melee weapons for more diversity. But not right now, CCP needs to fix what's broken first simple as that. Yeah. Sure. That's about as realistic as me appearing out of your monitor in a pink bikini and a box of your favorite chocolates.
Hey billy that was an interesting bikini you had on last night, good chocolate too. Seriously if you utilized whatever tech you used to pop out of my moniter for shipping you could become a billionaire...
Translation: keep hope alive, stranger things have happened. |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
35
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Posted - 2015.05.05 02:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:One Eyed King wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:One Eyed King wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:1: Why the hell would someone bring a sword to a gunfight?
The same reason that we bring knives. Because it is more fun than guns, is by and large more silent, and you know when you stab someone you either earn their respect, or make them rage. Winning. wow. Some people either can't read, or is just dumb. or both. Actually, if you are going to attempt to insult someone, particularly on intelligence, you should use proper grammar and punctuation. I would be happy to hear what I misread or didn't quite grasp however if you are insistent I am the one getting something wrong. Even though I did, I have to use proper grammar to talk **** now? You're still either a blubbering idiot, or simply can't read.
You probably meant blithering idiot, not blubbering which would be OK if you weren't trying to get on a high horse about grammar and intellect... |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
36
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Posted - 2015.05.05 02:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:korrah silain wrote:
You probably meant blithering idiot, not blubbering which would be OK if you weren't trying to get on a high horse about grammar and intellect...
No, I meant blubbering. As in you're as dumb as my child's fat.
you are all being children are we going to address each others arguments on their merits or just continue with some variation of "I'm not dumb you are!" All night? |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
43
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Posted - 2015.05.05 06:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:BLOOD Ruler wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:It's not really a tactical shooter when nearly anyone can carry around 6+ nanohives worth of more ammo than they will ever need under normal circumstances.
We have enough BS cartoon **** with myofibs, the last thing we need is for the game to turn into freaking Warframe with people bouncing all over the place with katanas. Don't be a hater. And what pve do we have? We kill players. I have no idea what any of that has to do with what I said. We don't have PvE therefor we should have katanas? lol Like seriously, just because you want cartoony bouncing around with swords, does not mean that it's acceptable in a game that is supposed to be a heavy gritty shooter. Doesn't make me a hater, just makes me not want another Destiny/Warframe/Super Mario FPS
Where exactly does it say it was "supposed" to be anything, and why can't we be heavy and gritty with melee weapons?
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korrah silain
True Illuminate
43
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Posted - 2015.05.05 06:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:
Where exactly does it say it was "supposed" to be anything, and why can't we be heavy and gritty with melee weapons?
The New Eden universe is traditionally heavy and gritty. Dust takes place in the New Eden Universe. I expect it to it feel as such. Jumping over buildings and swinging around katanas, is not heavy and gritty. It's Destiny ****. It's Warframe ****. Just because something is cool, doesn't mean it has a place in every video game you play. To me, that stuff seems as out of place as a dragon or a chainsaw in Dust.
So your argument is: "doesn't feel right to me"? OK I guess that's fair, but its also presuming that it will change the meta into that, and I disagree that it will. There's no real reason not to try it.also if you expand weapon types with other mechanics it will add a lot of variety. |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
43
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Posted - 2015.05.05 15:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:There's no real reason not to try it.also if you expand weapon types with other mechanics it will add a lot of variety. Can I get a gun that shoots out boxing gloves and waffles too? No real reason not to try it. I mean at what point in your mind does it change from "This is fine for Dust" to "That's unacceptable"?
Once the new content doesn't add any gameplay. For example adding a new gun that shoots boxing gloves and waffles is just adding a new gun of which we have plenty. Is it going to have some special function or mechanic? Does it add counterplay against any strategy's out there? Does it open up new tactical options? Play styles? Is it anything other than a massive aggressive hyperboly used a a slippery sloe fallacy?
No?
Huh.
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korrah silain
True Illuminate
46
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Posted - 2015.05.05 19:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:There's no real reason not to try it.also if you expand weapon types with other mechanics it will add a lot of variety. Can I get a gun that shoots out boxing gloves and waffles too? No real reason not to try it. I mean at what point in your mind does it change from "This is fine for Dust" to "That's unacceptable"? Once the new content doesn't add any gameplay. For example adding a new gun that shoots boxing gloves and waffles is just adding a new gun of which we have plenty. Is it going to have some special function or mechanic? Does it add counterplay against any strategy's out there? Does it open up new tactical options? Play styles? Is it anything other than a massive aggressive hyperboly used a a slippery sloe fallacy? No? Huh. And a sword offers a significant difference in gameplay compared to a knife? More damage, slower, and longer range? How is that anything more than a variant of the knife? Explain to me exactly how this will alter gameplay significantly. Convince me that further breaking the atmosphere and gameplay that brought me to Dust, is worth it.
Sigh:
*repost from ultimate melee board discussion*
Gallente: tower shield/ one handed sword fits with their combat doctrine of preserving combatants life and emphasis on cqc
Caldari: said trifdent because its historically paired with nets, though any pole arm would do. I propose a net/ polearm for 2 reasons; it satisfies the requests on the boards I've seen for a stasis webifier equivalent, and it fits caldari doctrine(in as much as a melee weapon can) by immobilizing the enemy, thus stopping them from closing ranks with(theoretical) gunline allies, and can be used to strand someone out of covers...a sort of advance defense. Also spears have the longest reach of melee weapons traditionally used in warfare.
Minmitar whip: because again it can be used as a snare which harkens to their Savannah hunter heritage, and is more tactically versatile if we give it a drag effect.
Amaran great sword: with av capabilitys really brings home the idea of superiority when you can kick a vehicle...
There this introduces: a new av option, and three new tactics to work into the battlefield.
They are functionally different from knives and hypothetically could help balance commandos if we give them a speed boost now that I think of it... |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
48
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Posted - 2015.05.06 05:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:
Gallente: tower shield/ one handed sword fits with their combat doctrine of preserving combatants life and emphasis on cqc
Caldari: said trifdent because its historically paired with nets, though any pole arm would do. I propose a net/ polearm for 2 reasons; it satisfies the requests on the boards I've seen for a stasis webifier equivalent, and it fits caldari doctrine(in as much as a melee weapon can) by immobilizing the enemy, thus stopping them from closing ranks with(theoretical) gunline allies, and can be used to strand someone out of covers...a sort of advance defense. Also spears have the longest reach of melee weapons traditionally used in warfare.
Minmitar whip: because again it can be used as a snare which harkens to their Savannah hunter heritage, and is more tactically versatile if we give it a drag effect.
Amaran great sword: with av capabilitys really brings home the idea of superiority when you can kick a vehicle...
There this introduces: a new av option, and three new tactics to work into the battlefield.
They are functionally different from knives and hypothetically could help balance commandos if we give them a speed boost now that I think of it...
Tower Shield + Sword So basically a Sentinel with a long knife. Nothing new here. Trident + ....net? Again just longer range melee, the only thing that's new here would be the webifier effect, which doesn't require a melee weapon to actually be a thing. Whip A grab effect? Why? What's the advantage of pulling them in? What will do you do once you have them there? whip them at close range while they shoot your in the chest? Or do you stick with 'ensnare' which is again....basically a webifier, which doesn't and shouldn't be tied to a weapon. Greatsword Ah yes, so kinda like....Nova Knives, which already do some AV damage. Thing is not one does it because you can't keep up with a tank, or a dropship, or an LAV. Or better yet you DO stab a stationary LAV and it blows up and kills you in the process. But actually you should test this repeatedly. Your running around chasing HAVs with a knife will amuse everyone. Get some Yakkety Sax going. It'll be great.
Your assessments are innacurate or unfounded:
Shield and sword(gives directional HP boost on any suit not just sentinals its an option that can be employed differently in different situations on different suits your over simply location is flawed.
Net/polearm: why SHOULDNT a net be tied to a weapon? And immobilization is useful for any number of situations, quick get away, stranding opponent out of cover for Ally's to target.
Heavy sword: like the others say the melee is just to weaken, nades are for the finish.
Whip/snare: secondary is for support, can be used to bring people into the line if fire of your allies, or to delay an opponent so an ally can get into cover.
Seriously though as someone who successfully uses nk I can vouch melee is viable and more options will open up new approaches to combat. |
korrah silain
True Illuminate
49
|
Posted - 2015.05.06 17:13:00 -
[10] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:korrah silain wrote:
Your assessments are innacurate or unfounded:
Shield and sword(gives directional HP boost on any suit not just sentinals its an option that can be employed differently in different situations on different suits your over simply location is flawed.
Net/polearm: why SHOULDNT a net be tied to a weapon? And immobilization is useful for any number of situations, quick get away, stranding opponent out of cover for Ally's to target.
Heavy sword: like the others say the melee is just to weaken, nades are for the finish.
Whip/snare: secondary is for support, can be used to bring people into the line if fire of your allies, or to delay an opponent so an ally can get into cover.
Seriously though as someone who successfully uses nk I can vouch melee is viable and more options will open up new approaches to combat.
*sigh* Well I'm tired of bickering, clearly we're not going to see eye to eye so I'll just write it off as a disagreement on what kind of things actually fit the universe and what don't. I think this sort of thing completely tears apart a massive part of what I like about Dust, you seem to think these ideas fit in fine. Obviously a pretty clear fundamental difference in opinion. But don't take it the wrong way when I say that I would likely quit Dust if this sort of stuff started popping up in-game. It would honestly ruin the experience for me in such a way that I would be disinclined to continue supporting or playing the game. All too often I see scope creep in games which have a very rich and vibrant universe that is ruined by things that are either out of place or taken to such an extreme that it betrays the setting. I suppose I find it unsettling when games try to incorporate elements from other games "because it's cool" even if it doesn't really fit the original theme. I'm a big fan of RPGs, particularly sci-fi ones, so story and setting are by far the most important aspects of a game to me. So even if an element mechanically works to alter gameplay in a meaningful manner, if it ruins the setting or tone of the game, it ruins the game for me.
I respect your maturity and our difference in opinion pokey, and for the record I doubt the devs are going to move on this but its still a cool idea. |
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