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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8325
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Posted - 2015.05.01 11:50:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:It stands a buff, what do you want. I was playing around with it just yesterday, it feels right, I like the dispersion, kick is reasonable. ADS is fine to finish off weakened fleeing targets.
Smart ideas?
I have a few. But it's mostly a rough idea based on bringing similar classes of weapon closer together performance-wise. IE breach weapons perform similarly, assaults perform similarly, bursts, et al.
What buffs would you consider unreasonable? Honestly I personally would like to see ranges pushed outward 10-20m optimal on most battle rifles given the framerate improvements.
Generally where the gallente rifles fail is purely reach. They can get chopped too easily by distant opponents.
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8326
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Posted - 2015.05.01 14:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Serious suggestion:
Normalize the variants. Realistically all of the battle rifles perform the same function.
There is little reason why there should be humongous range/base DPS variation between an assault rifle and an ACR. The profiles exist and affect the damage they do, keeping each rifle from having that call of duty "all guns are relreally the same" feeling.
For example: if we normalized all rifles to 450 base dps without thr profiles and 60m the profiles alone will create variance. Then we take the racial thematics and apply them.
We'll use the assault scram as out baseline 450/60m without profile.
Caldari are our long range punks. So we'll reach the ARR to 70m. But it pays for that reach at a rate of 1% DPS per meter. The ARR base DPS ends at 405 DPS.
ok minmatar is next, they're known for some decent range so we push them to 65, and their base DPS kisses 427.5 base DPS.
Then there's the gallente, our house knife fighters. We're going to tell them they suck and drop them to 50m. But they'll gain 10% base DPS. So pre-profile the assault plasma rifle will be rocking 495 DPS.
Now add your profiles and damage mods. Does this have to be how it's done exactly? No. It's an example, but the DUST rifles lack a logical, consistent progression.
And I don't think we can balance the scramblers for shields if we keep buffing them to tackle armor equally with the rail rifle and combat rifle. The system breaks.
But my suggestion:
Assault 450 DPS/60m optimal
Burst 435 DPS/70m optimal
Breach 425 DPS/80m optimal
Tac 410 DPS/90m optimal
Set a baseline and revolve the racial weapons around said baseline in a logical and consistent manner.
The battle rifles of each race are built to do the same thing: general-purpose primary weapon. There is little reason why their performance overall should be inconsistent and wildly varied. Odd behavior and inconsistency of damage application Is the purview of racial specialist and support weapons.
The rifles should be roughly equal. The hybrids should be the most balanced, the CR line should be an inferior option vs. Shields and the lasers should be inferior to armor.
If there inis no clear winner in the battle rifles for "best in game" a lot of undesirable metagame habits get cleared up And pushed off a cliff, making preferred playstyle and actively countering the enemy the meta rather than "use the scrambler, it melts everything And is OP vs. Shields."
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8326
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Posted - 2015.05.01 16:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Mr.Pepe Le Pew wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:It stands a buff, what do you want. I was playing around with it just yesterday, it feels right, I like the dispersion, kick is reasonable. ADS is fine to finish off weakened fleeing targets.
Smart ideas? decrease optimal range 10%, increase output damage 10%. Gallente weapons are supposed to be the best at CQC. This might be a start?
Worst idea so far
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8331
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Posted - 2015.05.01 18:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:You already have an amazing performance bonus, you do not nor should you ever have a bonus that strictly makes your suits better in terms of TTK.
Gallente assaults and calassaults have awesome bonuses?
WHERE???
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8331
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Posted - 2015.05.01 18:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
on a more serious note: Rifles need to be normalized
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8376
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Posted - 2015.05.04 23:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
The gallente rifles suffer from one single major problem. and one minor problem.
the minor problem is scrams out-DPS them.
The major problem is every weapon in the game except for the HMG and shotgun outrange them.
it's pretty much that simple.
None of the rifles will ever be balanced, because all of the rifles use different balancing metrics. Until the balancing metrics are streamlined (and hard rules applied) then the AR will never get balanced against the other rifles simply because it has no range.
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8389
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Posted - 2015.05.05 13:20:00 -
[7] - Quote
But I wanted to be the one to make you lose your cool! 
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8390
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Posted - 2015.05.05 14:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
You can fine rifle the game and separate out the specialist and heavy weapons for other roles and balance points. Citing fine rifles and not msking that distinction obfuscates the issue.
A battle rifle is a battle rifle is a battle rifle. The decision of which to puck should be according to the character of playstyle, not according to the revolving door of superiority weve had for two years.
The problem adipem is you're not allowing for variant in your argument. Fine rifle is an excellent metric for main battle rifles so long as there is a logical curcurve to range and DPS that is universal.
You are using it in the context of ALL weapons conforming to fine rifle. Unfortunately this is where most shooters fall flat. Weapons for different roles like nade launchers cannot be balanced as rifles and be usable as distinct and discrete units on the field.
Bluntly while I do disagree with Mina ogon a few pounts, usually frequently and loudly, your fine rifle argument fails in DUST due to profiles alone. Even if you make every rifle a baseline 450 DPS the profiles will year that DPS count up or down eildly based on profile.
I made this point earlier. Guess you missed/ignored it.
But Realistically at this point your arguments are pushing past useful and more into the realm of fantasy. Please come back to reality for a moment so the conversation can continue.
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8408
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Posted - 2015.05.05 18:08:00 -
[9] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:You can fine rifle the game and separate out the specialist and heavy weapons for other roles and balance points. Citing fine rifles and not making that distinction obfuscates the issue.
A battle rifle is a battle rifle is a battle rifle.
randomized crap having little/nothing to do with my post.
Did you bother to read my posts on the topic or did you skip right to "Oh look, Mina posted after, let's make her madder by posting ad hominem.
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
8408
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Posted - 2015.05.05 18:17:00 -
[10] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:You can fine rifle the game and separate out the specialist and heavy weapons for other roles and balance points. Citing fine rifles and not making that distinction obfuscates the issue.
A battle rifle is a battle rifle is a battle rifle.
randomized crap having little/nothing to do with my post. Did you bother to read my posts on the topic or did you skip right to "Oh look, Mina posted after, let's make her madder by posting ad hominem. Look up "ad hominem" in a dictionary, then point out for me the "ad hominem" in my post. You claim the my position on Fine Rifles is removed from reality; I wholeheartedly disagree. You claim that Fine Rifles are fine so long as "there is a logical curve to range and DPS that is universal"; I wholeheartedly disagree.
now prove your thesis.
Disagreeing is not enough unless you care to walk away. I have presented arguments (which you ignored) and I have made a post (which you responded to by cherrypicking bits you wanted to poke at while ignoring the rest, and the context, absolutely doing everything Mina accuses you of) stating a position.
You don't get to simply choose parts of an argument to pick apart without addressing the rest of the argument in context.
Oh and "fine rifle" is a lie. CCP's profiles alone on the weapons will create four WILDLY different performances overall even if you set every base stat identically. You like the Nerf/buff merry-go-round. Some of us think it's idiotic and would like the rifles to follow a logical progression so that choice of weapon reprersents a choice of playstyle rather than a shoehorn of "You must do it this way"
There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
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