DUST Search - Is the Ion Pistol's charged shot actually any good?

Username Alpha wrote:

As a proud Gallentean, I've recently been using the Ion Pistol as well as the submachine gun I was originally issued. Aside from the very limited range compared to other pistols, I've been enjoying it for the most part, but I've had some trouble with the charged shot, to the point that I've mostly given up on that aspect of the weapon. It does do a lot of damage, but the drawbacks make me question whether it's really worth it. I've heard that by the time a shot is fully charged you could have done more DPS by just shooting normally, and even if that's wrong I doubt it's wrong by much. Considering that firing normally also avoids the long seize time and has less chance (in my experience) of missing completely like a scrub, about the only things it seems really good for are ducking in and out of cover with a charged shot to try to shotgun whoever is standing on the other side of the wall (and waiting out the painful seize time, so only a foolish enemy would let you do it multiple times), and executing unsuspecting enemies standing still with headshots (e.g. people manning turrets).

Therefore, "surprise execution" seems like the main application, which is not only horribly limited but also seems like something the Scrambler Pistol might be able to do just as well with its huge headshot bonus. (Disclaimer: I haven't used the Scrambler Pistol enough to say that authoritatively.)

My first question to the forum is: Am I doing something wrong? What is the proper use for the charged shot?

The current benefit of leveling the Ion Pistol Operation skill to V is charging the charged shot a total of 25% faster, but this doesn't help the seize time at all so it seems like a very limited benefit, and it's a double edged sword as well since it becomes 25% easier to accidentally overheat the pistol (by partially charging shots) while trying to fire normally.

My second question is: Am I wrong about the Operation skill benefit being stupid, and would it be overpowered if the benefit was instead (or also) a reduction to seize duration?

Jakkal Shoobah wrote:

Oh and on the skill bonus. Yes you are correct. **** THE OPERATION BONUS. It is USELESS. Its actually bad for the gun. When you skill into the operation you make it harder to use. It actually makes it overheat faster unless you are some sort of finger guru master. The tiny charge time reduction is not worth the increased heat build up per shot because it charges eat shot 25% more which leads to faster overheat.

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Username Alpha Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2015.04.29 15:52:00 - [1] - Quote As a proud Gallentean, I've recently been using the Ion Pistol as well as the submachine gun I was originally issued. Aside from the very limited range compared to other pistols, I've been enjoying it for the most part, but I've had some trouble with the charged shot, to the point that I've mostly given up on that aspect of the weapon. It does do a lot of damage, but the drawbacks make me question whether it's really worth it. I've heard that by the time a shot is fully charged you could have done more DPS by just shooting normally, and even if that's wrong I doubt it's wrong by much. Considering that firing normally also avoids the long seize time and has less chance (in my experience) of missing completely like a scrub, about the only things it seems really good for are ducking in and out of cover with a charged shot to try to shotgun whoever is standing on the other side of the wall (and waiting out the painful seize time, so only a foolish enemy would let you do it multiple times), and executing unsuspecting enemies standing still with headshots (e.g. people manning turrets). Therefore, "surprise execution" seems like the main application, which is not only horribly limited but also seems like something the Scrambler Pistol might be able to do just as well with its huge headshot bonus. (Disclaimer: I haven't used the Scrambler Pistol enough to say that authoritatively.) My first question to the forum is: Am I doing something wrong? What is the proper use for the charged shot? The current benefit of leveling the Ion Pistol Operation skill to V is charging the charged shot a total of 25% faster, but this doesn't help the seize time at all so it seems like a very limited benefit, and it's a double edged sword as well since it becomes 25% easier to accidentally overheat the pistol (by partially charging shots) while trying to fire normally. My second question is: Am I wrong about the Operation skill benefit being stupid, and would it be overpowered if the benefit was instead (or also) a reduction to seize duration?
Genral69 death Random Gunz Rise Of Legion. 201	Posted - 2015.04.29 15:58:00 - [2] - Quote A charge shot to the face is very affective. I WA using a basic ion pistol and one shotted a min assault in the face General limited: warming failure to pay, may lead to death,massive amount of pain or even lose of family. Since 1995
VAHZZ Arrary of Clusters 1629	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:01:00 - [3] - Quote Watch Sgt Kirks Ion Pistol compilation, you'll see just how effective it is. im not a Minja, I'm a pirate.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. RUST415 3721	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:03:00 - [4] - Quote Yes. Kirk also misses a lot, despite his admirable skill level. Personally, I find the BrScP to be the MUCH more effective weapon, even with its shield bias.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 21538	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:05:00 - [5] - Quote yes, oneshotting with it is one of my favorite hobbies "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Knightshade Belladonna Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 1252	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:07:00 - [6] - Quote seeing as I get one shotted fairly often by them damn things..i'd say yes, it's rather effective if you can land it.
Genral69 death Random Gunz Rise Of Legion. 201	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:08:00 - [7] - Quote Odd question bit does the galenetes hope for bonus count on the ion pistol? General limited: warming failure to pay, may lead to death,massive amount of pain or even lose of family. Since 1995
Jakkal Shoobah Eternal Beings 119	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:11:00 - [8] - Quote My fellow Gallentean brother , the ion pistol charge shot is a double edged sword. I use it as a last resort or my dumb luck opener I mean LAST resort. You can achieve better overall dps by tapping the trigger , but the charge shot can scare the **** out of people. I use it to scare caldari shield tankers. Make em think a scrambler rifle is nearby or to make em think a sniper hit em. Charge shots require all your focus, training , and luck. I've recently started using it against amarr who use assault scramblers to remind them of the power of the charge shot. There is no proper way to use it. Its a feeling of knowing when high alpha two second downtime is the best option for you. Sometimes to finish of a target when your ar is empty, or to when you have the drop on someone or when you only have 3 bullets left in your ion pistol and there is no time to reload either weapon. A personal tactic of mine is to wittle targets about halfway with the AR, switch to the ion and fire 4 or so shots and then charge shot. While slow to anger and occasionally indecisive, they are also capable of harnessing enormous resolve when truly tested.
Username Alpha Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:13:00 - [9] - Quote VAHZZ wrote: Watch Sgt Kirks Ion Pistol compilation, you'll see just how effective it is. My two main takeaways from that video were "don't miss" and "get good at head shots". Also, "don't use it as a one-hitter except on scouts, but rather as a finishing move", but I already knew that.
Username Alpha Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:15:00 - [10] - Quote Genral69 death wrote: Odd question but does the galenetes hip fire bonus count on the ion pistol? "5% reduction to hybrid - blaster light/sidearm hip-fire dispersion and kick per level." It certainly should.

Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5800	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:23:00 - [11] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Yes. Kirk also misses a lot, despite his admirable skill level. Personally, I find the BrScP to be the MUCH more effective weapon, even with its shield bias. If it hit every time it'd be some seriously OP nonsense. Usually banned for being too awesome.
Jakkal Shoobah Eternal Beings 119	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:26:00 - [12] - Quote Oh and on the skill bonus. Yes you are correct. **** THE OPERATION BONUS. It is USELESS. Its actually bad for the gun. When you skill into the operation you make it harder to use. It actually makes it overheat faster unless you are some sort of finger guru master. The tiny charge time reduction is not worth the increased heat build up per shot because it charges eat shot 25% more which leads to faster overheat. A 5% reduction to heat buildup would actually allow fully skilled users to charge shot and then fire a few times or GASP ACTUALLY CHARGE SHOT AND SWITCH WEAPONS LIKE THE AMARR ! Best charge shot recounts ? My favorite was baiting a fully shield and armor stacked scout cko to walk face first into my ion pistols hot and ready barrel . Either that or a gal assault fight that was super close.it was down to the last quarter of armor. Ion pistol vs ion pistol. He spammed and rushed while I charged mine and jumped off the hill and shot him mid air before falling to my death. While slow to anger and occasionally indecisive, they are also capable of harnessing enormous resolve when truly tested.
Cyrus Grevare WarRavens 455	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:39:00 - [13] - Quote Your observations echo my own OP, IoP is a good sidearm, but there's better out there. Charge shot IMO is fun and trolly, but too much of a gamble for my taste and sometimes not even worth it, I find myself dying more than being saved by it. If you add a laggy game on top of it, you're better of not switching weapons as it will start charging by itself at the worst of moments. That said I'll never forget being chased by a proto cal sentinel around the bridge objective in my Spartan, I was moving backwards circling the panel while the death hose ran after me with its hail of bullets, each time he rounded the corner I let loose a charged shot, it took 4 that miraculously hit to take him down and it was awesome. www.protofits.com - a Dust 514 fitting tool
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 2896	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:43:00 - [14] - Quote Username Alpha wrote: As a proud Gallentean, I've recently been using the Ion Pistol as well as the submachine gun I was originally issued. Aside from the very limited range compared to other pistols, I've been enjoying it for the most part, but I've had some trouble with the charged shot, to the point that I've mostly given up on that aspect of the weapon. It does do a lot of damage, but the drawbacks make me question whether it's really worth it. I've heard that by the time a shot is fully charged you could have done more DPS by just shooting normally, and even if that's wrong I doubt it's wrong by much. Considering that firing normally also avoids the long seize time and has less chance (in my experience) of missing completely like a scrub, about the only things it seems really good for are ducking in and out of cover with a charged shot to try to shotgun whoever is standing on the other side of the wall (and waiting out the painful seize time, so only a foolish enemy would let you do it multiple times), and executing unsuspecting enemies standing still with headshots (e.g. people manning turrets). Therefore, "surprise execution" seems like the main application, which is not only horribly limited but also seems like something the Scrambler Pistol might be able to do just as well with its huge headshot bonus. (Disclaimer: I haven't used the Scrambler Pistol enough to say that authoritatively.) My first question to the forum is: Am I doing something wrong? What is the proper use for the charged shot? The current benefit of leveling the Ion Pistol Operation skill to V is charging the charged shot a total of 25% faster, but this doesn't help the seize time at all so it seems like a very limited benefit, and it's a double edged sword as well since it becomes 25% easier to accidentally overheat the pistol (by partially charging shots) while trying to fire normally. My second question is: Am I wrong about the Operation skill benefit being stupid, and would it be overpowered if the benefit was instead (or also) a reduction to seize duration? One tip - Run an active scanner on your suit, it allows a lot more 'predictive' charging (a trick I've shamelessly stolen from kirk & arkena after watching some of kirks FW videos). The charge shot on the ion pistol does 7x listed damage... and as every shot made is at least partially charged it actually does really respectable damage at short range. Ion pistols have roughly twice the effective range of a shotgun (~20m vs 10m) and do roughly the same damage on a charged shot. Beyond that, abuse the everloving crap out of cover when you're making your charged shots. Sharpshooter/Gal assault is pretty mandatory for it though. Genral69 death wrote: Odd question but does the galenetes hip fire bonus count on the ion pistol? Only the assault gets the hipfire/dispersion bonus, but yes. Jakkal Shoobah wrote: Oh and on the skill bonus. Yes you are correct. ** THE OPERATION BONUS. It is USELESS. Its actually bad for the gun. When you skill into the operation you make it harder to use. It actually makes it overheat faster unless you are some sort of finger guru master. The tiny charge time reduction is not worth the increased heat build up per shot because it charges eat shot 25% more which leads to faster overheat. Every shot is partially charged with the ion pistol and scales from 1x dmg at 0 charge to 7x damage at max charge, the operation bonus is a damage increase putting it on par or making it better than the scrambler pistol (unless you're getting headshots). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
Cyrus Grevare WarRavens 455	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:44:00 - [15] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Yes. Kirk also misses a lot, despite his admirable skill level. Personally, I find the BrScP to be the MUCH more effective weapon, even with its shield bias. Yeah... a compilation is always great, that one was cool. Yesterday I watched another of his videos, one about the new game mode, the second thing that caught my eye most (new game mode being the first) was the painful way some of the charged IoP shots missed :( www.protofits.com - a Dust 514 fitting tool
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 758	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:51:00 - [16] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: yes, oneshotting with it is one of my favorite hobbies It totally works vs n00bs! LOLs There will be bullets. ACR+SMG [CEO of Terror]
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 23622	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:54:00 - [17] - Quote I can't really justify using the IoP over, say, the SMG, when the main use for a sidearm is as a panic switch weapon. When using the IoP in just rapid semi auto fire in an attempt to finish off a target very frequently ends in overheating, even without charging. The charge shot is pretty situational. I'm not a huge fan of the IoP, but it's Gallente, so I'll use it. The thing about trying to hit with the charge shot is that the hipfire on the ion pistol is pretty poor, the ADS is also weird and shakes everywhere (so I never use the ADS anymore) and if you miss with it, it's a serious problem. Galassault and Sharpshooter 5 are basically essential. Supreme Forum Warrior Gallente Guide
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 10482	Posted - 2015.04.29 16:58:00 - [18] - Quote Cyrus Grevare wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: Yes. Kirk also misses a lot, despite his admirable skill level. Personally, I find the BrScP to be the MUCH more effective weapon, even with its shield bias. Yeah... a compilation is always great, that one was cool. Yesterday I watched another of his videos, one about the new game mode, the second thing that caught my eye most (new game mode being the first) was the painful way some of the charged IoP shots missed :( Yeah there are sometimes where the ion pistol should really hit and it doesn't. I've had a guy stand almost still and still miss. It's good when it works, its pathetic when it doesn't. Hit detection needs to be looked at. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
VAHZZ Arrary of Clusters 1637	Posted - 2015.04.29 17:05:00 - [19] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: yes, oneshotting with it is one of my favorite hobbies I have a suit just for my Ion Shenanigans. Rapid hipfire with my robotic finger. Best hobby of all time. I need a Ion Pistol named after me im not a Minja, I'm a pirate.
STYLIE77 KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 630	Posted - 2015.04.29 17:08:00 - [20] - Quote Here is my take on the charged shot... It is a mix of the Bolt pistol and scrambler rifle. It has the same auto aim and a bit more power but you suffer from the overheat after the shot. The upside over the bolt pistol is you can rapid fire smaller damage shots that are more effective than the basic scrambler pistol. So it is an interesting hybrid that I am finding myself using more often than my trusty SMG. http://caughtyouflinching.ytmnd.com/

Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 7246	Posted - 2015.04.29 17:09:00 - [21] - Quote Yes. If you have cover, I might even go as far as saying it's the best thing ever. I once killed a Sentinel Ak.0 with >1000 armor with the Militia Ion Pistol. All pure charge shots.
Username Alpha Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 10	Posted - 2015.04.29 20:36:00 - [22] - Quote Thanks for all the feedback, guys. You've inspired me to not give up on the charged shot, but to use it a bit more judiciously than I was the first time I tried it out. But what about the second question, the idea I had about changing the Operation skill to seize time reduction instead of charge time reduction? Do you think it's a good idea because it would let you do more charged shots? A bad idea because you like the quicker charge? A bad idea because it would be OP?
Melchiah ARANeAE The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 585	Posted - 2015.04.29 21:02:00 - [23] - Quote I've managed to one shot a Proto Amarr Assault with a charged headshot with the T-12. Don't underestimate the charge. We want cake and tea.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 18618	Posted - 2015.04.29 21:27:00 - [24] - Quote Username Alpha wrote: As a proud Gallentean, I've recently been using the Ion Pistol as well as the submachine gun I was originally issued. Aside from the very limited range compared to other pistols, I've been enjoying it for the most part, but I've had some trouble with the charged shot, to the point that I've mostly given up on that aspect of the weapon. It does do a lot of damage, but the drawbacks make me question whether it's really worth it. I've heard that by the time a shot is fully charged you could have done more DPS by just shooting normally, and even if that's wrong I doubt it's wrong by much. Considering that firing normally also avoids the long seize time and has less chance (in my experience) of missing completely like a scrub, about the only things it seems really good for are ducking in and out of cover with a charged shot to try to shotgun whoever is standing on the other side of the wall (and waiting out the painful seize time, so only a foolish enemy would let you do it multiple times), and executing unsuspecting enemies standing still with headshots (e.g. people manning turrets). Therefore, "surprise execution" seems like the main application, which is not only horribly limited but also seems like something the Scrambler Pistol might be able to do just as well with its huge headshot bonus. (Disclaimer: I haven't used the Scrambler Pistol enough to say that authoritatively.) My first question to the forum is: Am I doing something wrong? What is the proper use for the charged shot? The current benefit of leveling the Ion Pistol Operation skill to V is charging the charged shot a total of 25% faster, but this doesn't help the seize time at all so it seems like a very limited benefit, and it's a double edged sword as well since it becomes 25% easier to accidentally overheat the pistol (by partially charging shots) while trying to fire normally. My second question is: Am I wrong about the Operation skill benefit being stupid, and would it be overpowered if the benefit was instead (or also) a reduction to seize duration? ITS AMAZING! "MIN MAXING! MIN MAXING! I'M BETTER AT IT THAN YOU!" - Mobius Wyvern
Pseudogenesis Nos Nothi 2726	Posted - 2015.04.30 05:59:00 - [25] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: I can't really justify using the IoP over, say, the SMG Or literally anything else. It saddens me that it's been so long since the sidearm rebalancing and the IoP still isn't being looked at. Such a cool design, yet such wasted potential. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 2909	Posted - 2015.04.30 08:16:00 - [26] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: I can't really justify using the IoP over, say, the SMG Or literally anything else. It saddens me that it's been so long since the sidearm rebalancing and the IoP still isn't being looked at. Such a cool design, yet such wasted potential. Its only real problem to me is its range. As a heavy I'd generally want a longer range / more accurate pistol (like the Br.ScP, Fl.P or Bolt), or with a more specialist weapon I'd want a longer range sidearm (like the magsec). Beyond that I feel like the Io.P pairs incredibly well with the assault rifle on the gal assault and potentially with combat rifles on min-assault. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Titans of Phoenix RUST415 796	Posted - 2015.04.30 08:35:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: yes, oneshotting with it is one of my favorite hobbies Will you please change the fitting skill to reduce PG?


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