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Vehicle Capacitor Compromise

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Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5882	Posted - 2015.04.16 18:58:00 - [1] - Quote Interesting idea to say the least, like you said It's kind of like bandwidth. However I don't think this is exactly a low-hanging fruit so to speak. I'd much rather get rid of these damn passive reps first, see where things go from there, and reevaluate if entirely new systems are needed. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5883	Posted - 2015.04.16 21:09:00 - [2] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Interesting idea to say the least, like you said It's kind of like bandwidth. However I don't think this is exactly a low-hanging fruit so to speak. I'd much rather get rid of these damn passive reps first, see where things go from there, and reevaluate if entirely new systems are needed. Why not have both? This is a means to address Rattati's multiple hardener issue. Here is my point....we've had multiple hardeners for literally the entire existence of Dust. There has never been a limit, and it has never been a problem until recently. What changed? A move from Active Regen modules to Passive Regen modules. People seem so very set on killing hardeners and restricting them, yet they have never been an issue prior to the original vehicle mass-rework. Much of which happened then was a mistake, and should be reversed. I think that's the key to making things right again, not trying to place arbitrary restrictions on hardeners which have never been an issue until they were paired with passive regen modules. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5885	Posted - 2015.04.16 21:20:00 - [3] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Also an increase of 50% efficiency or greater on the hardeners...... Sorta. We also lost the passive 10% resistant bonus from skills which roughly translates into the increase resistance on the hardeners. If they want to bring back the 10% from skills and reduce the hardeners back down to 25% and 30% I would not complain. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5887	Posted - 2015.04.16 23:10:00 - [4] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Here is my point....we've had multiple hardeners for literally the entire existence of Dust. There has never been a limit, and it has never been a problem until recently. What changed? A move from Active Regen modules to Passive Regen modules. People seem so very set on killing hardeners and restricting them, yet they have never been an issue prior to the original vehicle mass-rework. Much of which happened then was a mistake, and should be reversed. I think that's the key to making things right again, not trying to place arbitrary restrictions on hardeners which have never been an issue until they were paired with passive regen modules. I don't want to see hardeners nerfed. I want to seem them buffed. In my view there is an 80% resistance hardener at 8 cell use. There are 10% passive hardeners There are active and passive Armor repairers. Try not to use my single example close your mind. Perhaps I shouldn't have given an example at all. I think you will see massive issues with resistances that high. And I'm not against your idea, don't get me wrong. I just think we should be revert back to an active system that we know worked in the past before we start exploring options to limit functionality of module use. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5889	Posted - 2015.04.16 23:34:00 - [5] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: [...] I just think we should be revert back to an active system that we know worked in the past before we start exploring options to limit functionality of module use. Agreed 100% ! Sorta off topic question for you, since you know dropships well. Would Dropships suffer if Light Armor Repairers moved back to an active style? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5890	Posted - 2015.04.16 23:47:00 - [6] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: [...] I just think we should be revert back to an active system that we know worked in the past before we start exploring options to limit functionality of module use. Agreed 100% ! Sorta off topic question for you, since you know dropships well. Would Dropships suffer if Light Armor Repairers moved back to an active style? Not at all ! it would actually be great. Right noww shield dropships have more stayingpower than armor ones, which is backwards. With active armor repping, we could finally see that fixed. Turn on reps -> I am tanking this AV for 10 seconds, and not, i'm going to use my passive reps to barely escape. I'd like to move to a model where passive regen is quite low with primary HP regen being focused around active model. Armor having a longer duration than shield boosters, but boosters having a higher HP/minute than armor. I was considering leaving Light Armor Repairers as passive as not to screw dropships, but if actives wouldn't be problematic then it may be better to just do that for the sake of continuity. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5890	Posted - 2015.04.16 23:52:00 - [7] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: A lot of things in this game could easily be balanced by capacitors. We said this in the beginning but Blam thought we were too stupid to understand the concept of capacitors. And sadly there just isn't the manpower to implement it now. Rattati has said himself that there are no current plans to implement capacitors. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5891	Posted - 2015.04.17 00:09:00 - [8] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: A lot of things in this game could easily be balanced by capacitors. We said this in the beginning but Blam thought we were too stupid to understand the concept of capacitors. And sadly there just isn't the manpower to implement it now. Rattati has said himself that there are no current plans to implement capacitors. Well if we keep on him, maybe he can see that it's important and try to push it higher in the list of priorities. Maybe when CCP AquarHEAD finishes up his work with the matchmaker. Again it comes to a the "Low Hanging Fruit" concept. There are a lot of other things which require less effort with more benefit, which will always come first on the list of priorities. Not saying to not suggest it, but he knows its a desired feature and nagging him will likely get the opposite of the desired result. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5891	Posted - 2015.04.17 00:13:00 - [9] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: A lot of things in this game could easily be balanced by capacitors. We said this in the beginning but Blam thought we were too stupid to understand the concept of capacitors. And sadly there just isn't the manpower to implement it now. Rattati has said himself that there are no current plans to implement capacitors. Well if we keep on him, maybe he can see that it's important and try to push it higher in the list of priorities. Perhaps when CCP AquarHEAD finishes up his work with the matchmaker and they get PC figured out. Apparently CCP the current DUST team only has enough resources to tune things already in game. Pretty much all they can do is ** with colors and numbers. Pretty much. I mean small new features are not out of the question, but something like a Cap system is pretty 'deep-code' so to speak and would take a lot of effort and change to get working properly. I just don't think it's economical for them to dedicate so many resources to it at this time when there is a lot of other things that could be more readily changed. "That little st Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5893	Posted - 2015.04.17 00:55:00 - [10] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: 1. Vehicles can't ever be properly balanced without capacitors. They're either very weak and feel cheap and pathetic. or they're too strong and they ruin the experience for everyone. It's pretty impossible to get that right unless vehicles have to fear being tackled. Actually vehicles have been in a nearly balanced state in the past, even without capacitors. I see capacitor as a nice feature, but not necessary to achieve workable balance. Additionally, you don't need a capacitor to tackle/incapacitate the enemy. I could see this being achieved with active modules/infantry equipment. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5894	Posted - 2015.04.17 01:09:00 - [11] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: True Adamance wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: A lot of things in this game could easily be balanced by capacitors. We said this in the beginning but Blam thought we were too stupid to understand the concept of capacitors. To manage caps, especially during a fight would be hell. Especially for other vehicles. It would bring actually less balance than the current timer system we have in place now. I don't see how. It's like looking at one combined module cool down. If its going down you might need to turn some modules off if you get to <25%. If it's going up you are in the clear and probably should turn some mods on. This is a problem when you realize that you will have to manage this one wheel, but while you are moving around and/or fighting back, and have to figure out what and what not to turn off. It works for ship combat because aiming isn't even a thing, and moving around takes much less to do, as well as being able to set modules on and off to a button. it would work well on larger platforms, like say a MCC, but on smaller platforms, it simply won't work well. EDIT: Look, the only thing I can see caps actually adding doing positively is making it to where you can control how long you run a module better, vs. having just a straight timer. This has been done however through the cloak. Having the timer mechanics of the cloak on active modules would effectively do just that, but still allows the current timers a thing. Except this is basically what you already do, is it not? Just shorter cycles, I mean typically you're not going to be turning hardeners on and off mid-fight, you do it once and let it run until you need to disengage. I guess I don't personally feel like it would be difficult to manage modules. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5894	Posted - 2015.04.17 01:18:00 - [12] - Quote Again I have to ask, why do you need capacitors to tackle vehicles? Can you not use Webifiers to slow vehicles and open up opportunities for AV to break through a vehicles tank before it escapes? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5896	Posted - 2015.04.17 04:08:00 - [13] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Again I have to ask, why do you need capacitors to tackle vehicles? Can you not use Webifiers to slow vehicles and open up opportunities for AV to break through a vehicles tank before it escapes? It would be a start, but a vehicle could still activate it's prop mod if webbed and probably get away. With cap, and neuts, you could shut down the prop mod and kill their ability to run hardeners/reppers. The whole thing becomes a lot more deep and fun. True, but with the sake of manpower in mind, I think it may be better to go with a simply webifier before we go into something as intensive as a full cap system. I think that in of itself would be awesome. Remote Webifier Mines? Awww yeah. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5896	Posted - 2015.04.17 04:13:00 - [14] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Again I have to ask, why do you need capacitors to tackle vehicles? Can you not use Webifiers to slow vehicles and open up opportunities for AV to break through a vehicles tank before it escapes? It would be a start, but a vehicle could still activate it's prop mod if webbed and probably get away. With cap, and neuts, you could shut down the prop mod and kill their ability to run hardeners/reppers. The whole thing becomes a lot more deep and fun. True, but with the sake of manpower in mind, I think it may be better to go with a simply webifier before we go into something as intensive as a full cap system. I think that in of itself would be awesome. Remote Webifier Mines? Awww yeah. I agree that there are some more immediate pressing concerns (like trading, and PC, and webs) but I think trying to add capacitors and get them balanced before a relaunch is important (hopefully before December). DUST is the perfect "laboratory" to work this stuff out and get it all balanced. You speak as if a relaunch is a guaranteed thing right now. Was there something I missed on this topic? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5896	Posted - 2015.04.17 04:32:00 - [15] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Well either we have one and we should get ready for it, or we don't, in which case none of this really matters much at all. Either way I'd like to give feedback under the assumption that the game will have a future. If it won't than nothing I write (or you or anyone else for that matter) really means anything. CCP Hilmar hinted that he's happy with the direction of the game, I have to think we're going to have some kind of future. Fair enough. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast & Blog www.biomassed.net