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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1710
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Posted - 2015.03.12 19:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
DUST uses the Unreal engine.
Unreal Tournement was a ducking mid air jet pack combat game.
I think its awesome we finally get a shout out to it.
Brb, minja-bombing all the things.
Recently re-discovered the Assault Mass Driver, LOL@your 'cover'
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1711
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Posted - 2015.03.12 19:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:LUGMOS wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:but not liking it doesn't change it. I agree. Just because you don't like them, doesn't mean they should be changed No, it is your opinion that these should remain this way, the fact is that these numbers are way higher than intended. Considering your OP says "think" and "opinion" a large amount of times, and lack of dev confirm/deny of your OP, your use of the word fact is akin to Fox News' use of it.
Recently re-discovered the Assault Mass Driver, LOL@your 'cover'
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1711
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Posted - 2015.03.12 19:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:LUGMOS wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:but not liking it doesn't change it. I agree. Just because you don't like them, doesn't mean they should be changed No, it is your opinion that these should remain this way, the fact is that these numbers are way higher than intended. Considering your OP says "think" and "opinion" a large amount of times, and lack of dev confirm/deny of your OP, your use of the word fact is akin to Fox News' use of it. Should I go back and edit it for your satisfaction? or does the link to the spreadsheet not suffice?
Naw because its still hinges on the ASSUMPTION that melee mechanics are inextricably tied to jump mechanics.
Poke a dev, get them to comment. If your correct, ill apologize for antagonizing you. If not, stop backseat game designing. deal?
Recently re-discovered the Assault Mass Driver, LOL@your 'cover'
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1712
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Posted - 2015.03.12 20:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:Naw because its still hinges on the ASSUMPTION that melee mechanics are inextricably tied to jump mechanics.
Poke a dev, get them to comment. If your correct, ill apologize for antagonizing you. If not, stop backseat game designing. deal? There is no assumption being made, look at the ****ing math and compare it with what we know. There is a reason I like to use math, it can't lie. We know that myos were changed to affect jump height, we also have a stated design intent for a minscout to barely be able to het up on a crate. With 4 complex myos at the intended (via spreadsheet) 25% (*1.5 from skill) you only get about 144% jump height or ~110% jump height with 3 aka double regular height. Now it's pretty easy to see using basic powers of observation that people are jumping far higher than that. So lets compare our observations with the other relevant piece of data we have - the amount myos increase melee damage by... And with the math I did in my first ****ing post we can see that it's about a 400% increase to melee damage and hey that seems to fit the things were seeing a lot better! This isn't a huge ****ing leap of logic. It's basic problem solving given information at hand.
I've looked at your math half a dozen times. The math is not wrong.
The parameters are. You're still making the sound-logical call to tie your math to melee damage buffs, and applying it to jump mechanics. It is a wise and logical choice. But in this instance, im going to have to say its incorrect.
The modules themselves say nothing about raw data in terms of jump height modifying, hell, the aurum versions DONT MENTION it affects jumping. At all. There's a hidden command string with an undisclosed raw value attached to it, not translated into readable data for the player to know.
Further credence to why its working as intended. the sheer bulk of forum posts and dev responses since the uodate hit, and none of them are echoing that the jump values are wrong, misbehaving or otherwise. And they commented on krins display errors, equipment number errors, etc. if there was a jump issue it would've been mentikned several times over, yet it has not.
Your math is correct, parameters not.
Find me dev posts to say otherwise.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1714
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Posted - 2015.03.12 21:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
DozersMouse XIII wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:I really don't see what the problem is.
It's an alternative to Damage Mods - which increases TTK - which is awesome. It's an alternative to Precision Enhancers- which helps Scouts - which is awesome (kinda). It's an alternative to Shield Modules - which reduces brick tanking - which is awesome.
Further more, you can't really aim worth a **** when you're jumping... So it's not like bunny hopping is hurting anyone. You can't do it more than a few times in rapid succession -AND- you can't recover stamina while in the air.
That being said, it's a navigational tool and it's doing so amazingly well. It provides options that weren't there before, prevents from having to use ladders - which is awesome - and because it's not that great for combat it's a very awesome addition to have in a science fiction shooter.
It's not nearly as bad as you're making it out to be.
it affects splash damage weapons that are easy to aim while mid air
So weapons that are more often than not being underutilized with really low rate of fire?
Also, aiming the plasma cannon mid air is a head trip, your going to get shot by it from the flattest point in the bombers arc trajectory, plenty of time for a rifle to smite him.
Ill concede RE-nuking is totally going to be annoying as all hell.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1728
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Go pvp destiny.
The guys that dir the most fly the most.
Go play cod;aw, the more you jump the more you die.
seriously dude. If you cant hit a single target moving in a predictable arc, just quit now.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1730
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
LUGMOS wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:Go pvp destiny.
The guys that dir the most fly the most.
Go play cod;aw, the more you jump the more you die.
seriously dude. If you cant hit a single target moving in a predictable arc, just quit now. Bruh, no personal attacks. It ain't productive. Your other points are correct though.
I apologize, let me rephrase the last point.
If the new mechanics are too troublesome to adapt to, perhaps it is time to roll a logi or heavy.
Or, and it saddens me.to.say this, it would be a good time to end a mercenary career in new eden
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1731
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:27:00 -
[8] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:LUGMOS wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:So if Kincats made you run 30% faster instead of 15% they would still be balanced?
The fact is that the numbers for these Myofibrils are nearly 2x higher than they were intended to be, and I can't see much use for any other high slots if they stay this way. You are making this waaay worse than you think it is. of course kincats would be OP, because they would break hit detection. And, just for clarification, they give a 12% bonus. And you are really over exaggerating on everything... shield modules and damage mods are still very useful... please, stop blowing things out of context and making use of highly hyperbolic comparisons. I'm not blowing things out of context at all. I'm saying the modules are 200% as powerful as they were intended to be, and that is an issue. Because when you compare 350% jump height to 121% damage or 330 more shields, the jumps will win ever time. They need to be brought down to the intended levels of power. Period. But you are just going to defend them anyways, aren't you?
id take 121% damage over jumping ANY DAY of the week.
Can we get that next?
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1731
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:LUGMOS wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:I'm not blowing things out of context at all. I'm saying the modules are 200% as powerful as they were intended to be, and that is an issue. Because when you compare 350% jump height to 121% damage or 330 more shields, the jumps will win ever time. They need to be brought down to the intended levels of power. Period.
But you are just going to defend them anyways, aren't you? It's hilarious that you think they are game breaking or even OP, since jumping really high isn't even comparable to a 121% damage boost or a 330 shield increase like you say. Whatever. They'll get nerfed, that much I know. When 80% of the blayerbase is jumping 30m into the air next week, even Ratatti won't be able to deny that it is a problem.
Find me a dev post from today mentioning even tweaking them and ill stop. I promise.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1731
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:LUGMOS wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:So if Kincats made you run 30% faster instead of 15% they would still be balanced?
The fact is that the numbers for these Myofibrils are nearly 2x higher than they were intended to be, and I can't see much use for any other high slots if they stay this way. You are making this waaay worse than you think it is. of course kincats would be OP, because they would break hit detection. And, just for clarification, they give a 12% bonus. And you are really over exaggerating on everything... shield modules and damage mods are still very useful... please, stop blowing things out of context and making use of highly hyperbolic comparisons. I'm not blowing things out of context at all. I'm saying the modules are 200% as powerful as they were intended to be, and that is an issue. Because when you compare 350% jump height to 121% damage or 330 more shields, the jumps will win ever time. They need to be brought down to the intended levels of power. Period. But you are just going to defend them anyways, aren't you? id take 121% damage over jumping ANY DAY of the week. Can we get that next? Stack 5 Complex Damage mods. There you go.
uhhh....bro....
Dmg-mods do suffer from actual stacking penalties.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1733
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:39:00 -
[11] - Quote
My bad, i thought you ment ADDITIONAL damage, not TOTAL.
330 additional shields is nothing to sneeze at, unless youre wielding an ascr, then sneeze away, cause buhbye shields.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1733
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Posted - 2015.03.13 00:48:00 -
[12] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:My bad, i thought you ment ADDITIONAL damage, not TOTAL.
330 additional shields is nothing to sneeze at, unless youre wielding an ascr, then sneeze away, cause buhbye shields. The point is that 30m jumps that allow you to get pretty much anywhere and evac any unfavorable situation and mach 1 is worth more than 330 Shields or and extra 21% damage.
Sure, in most 1v1 situations, but the second you lift off, your directional mobility is severally limited, your offenses are limited to slow rof splash weapons/grenades and mines if you're skilled, and three hops later you're a sitting duck for some random with even the slightest sense of awareness to blap.
A calassault cant out run or out dps an amrrassault while its shield fit.
It can jump away, and most likely not make it out of the amarrassaults range, unless it was at max range to begin with.
And as soon as it lands, it better be in a dmz or its insta gibbed
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance
1736
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Posted - 2015.03.13 01:10:00 -
[13] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:We will evaluate these modules like everything else.
Since playing last night, I have a growing doubt that stacing is applied, that is the first thing I will check at work today.
A 4th and 5th module should add almost nothing which is why we playtested with 3 stacked minnie scouts.
That said, the max height we were aiming for was a big crate, or second level of a building. I agree with both the combat effectiveness and fun versus silly arguments as well. They are supposed to be a mobility module, viable against dmg mods and hp, and open up tactical elements such as outflanking and such.
And to the OP's concerns, the 25% isn't an applicable number per se, it is a modification attribute % of another number and ground speed, so is not "25% the normal height". That was not clear enough.
Abridged:mtos may be OP, watching close, will evaluate soon.
Alright mina, fizzer, ill concede for now. Until the final eval comes out.
Cant hear you, carpet-bombing heavies with my minja.
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