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Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
2534
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Posted - 2015.03.09 06:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
I can't in a right mind accept that the Minassault makes CRs/ACRs better than BuPRs/PRs on a Galassault.
It just doesn't make any sense...
PR damage per mag: 2163.7 - 2380.07
ACR damage per mag:1349.8 - 1484.78
With Minassault: 1687.25 -1855.975
BuPR damage per mag: 2065 - 2163.33
CR damage per mag: 1458 - 1603.8
With Minassault:1890-2079
These differences are hugely in favor of PRs. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, people heavily underestimate the value of more damage in the magazine.
Minassault never even closes the gap at any point...
Also, PR has less kick and better hipfire, even without skills applied. With Galassault and Sharpshooter the PR has practically no kick, and an absolutely amazing hipfire.
The only real advantages that CRs have over PRs are as follows...
>Small range advantage. 3m more optimal for CR, 5m more optimal for ACR.
>Less fitting costs. Probably the biggest advantage, but it only becomes truly apparent at PRO level.
>Armor damage based. I'd say the CR barely wins out here, mostly because the PR has a less extreme profile, which makes its weak armor damage less of a problem than the CRs weak shield damage... but I won't argue that more armor damage is better, so the CR gets a small advantage here.
Overall, with or without the corresponding Assault bonuses applied to them, the PR is just better overall.
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Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
2540
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Posted - 2015.03.09 17:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:Aztec, stop with the bonus being 'crucial' crap. It only affects the last 25-30 bullets that come out of the gun by which point most suits would be dead. The bonus is jank. Why is the bonus reducing something that is low if you have sharpshooter? The only weapon it really helps is the ion pistol and even then the first shot will probably go where you want it. It just seems to me that I would be better off using a CR cos it already has almost no dispersion, can kill things faster and is able to fire an entire mag and reload before an AR has emptied its mag. Either RoF buff or a range buff would be a better bonus. Optimal range would be nice.
This is I no way a good thing for the CR... "Oh man, CRs are so much better because their magazines run dry faster!" You sound stupid saying **** like that.
And the bonus affects every single bullet that you fire, not just the last 25-30, because it affects both dispersion and kick. It reduces recoil, and makes you more accurate while ADS and on the hip.
It doesn't just reduce kick... It makes your hipfire better as well.
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Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
2540
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Posted - 2015.03.09 17:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Aztec, stop with the bonus being 'crucial' crap. It only affects the last 25-30 bullets that come out of the gun by which point most suits would be dead. The bonus is jank. Why is the bonus reducing something that is low if you have sharpshooter? The only weapon it really helps is the ion pistol and even then the first shot will probably go where you want it. It just seems to me that I would be better off using a CR cos it already has almost no dispersion, can kill things faster and is able to fire an entire mag and reload before an AR has emptied its mag. Either RoF buff or a range buff would be a better bonus. Optimal range would be nice. This is I no way a good thing for the CR... "Oh man, CRs are so much better because their magazines run dry faster!" You sound stupid saying **** like that. And the bonus affects every single bullet that you fire, not just the last 25-30, because it affects both dispersion and kick. It reduces recoil, and makes you more accurate while ADS and on the hip. It doesn't just reduce kick... It makes your hipfire better as well. How is that stupid? It means you are able to apply more damage over a shorter timeframe, emptying an entire mag on someone in less than 3 seconds is a huge advantage when close to someone. Also the first 40 shots from an AR barely have any kick so why would I want a bonus that reduces something that is small anyway? It is a redundant bonus.
You clearly have no idea on the relationships between DPS, Magazine Size, Magazine Time,and Damage per Magazine.
It isn't applying more damage over a shorter timeframe. It is applying less damage over a shorter timeframe, as there is less damage in a ACRs magazine.
Saying the ACRs magazine size is better is like saying the AR would be better if its mag was reduced to 43. Its stupid.
It is an unarguable point that the AR has better magazine and damage based stats than the ACR. It is just better, simply.
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Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
2540
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Posted - 2015.03.09 18:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Fizzer XCIV wrote:Echo 1991 wrote:Aztec, stop with the bonus being 'crucial' crap. It only affects the last 25-30 bullets that come out of the gun by which point most suits would be dead. The bonus is jank. Why is the bonus reducing something that is low if you have sharpshooter? The only weapon it really helps is the ion pistol and even then the first shot will probably go where you want it. It just seems to me that I would be better off using a CR cos it already has almost no dispersion, can kill things faster and is able to fire an entire mag and reload before an AR has emptied its mag. Either RoF buff or a range buff would be a better bonus. Optimal range would be nice. This is I no way a good thing for the CR... "Oh man, CRs are so much better because their magazines run dry faster!" You sound stupid saying **** like that. And the bonus affects every single bullet that you fire, not just the last 25-30, because it affects both dispersion and kick. It reduces recoil, and makes you more accurate while ADS and on the hip. It doesn't just reduce kick... It makes your hipfire better as well. How is that stupid? It means you are able to apply more damage over a shorter timeframe, emptying an entire mag on someone in less than 3 seconds is a huge advantage when close to someone. Also the first 40 shots from an AR barely have any kick so why would I want a bonus that reduces something that is small anyway? It is a redundant bonus. You clearly have no idea on the relationships between DPS, Magazine Size, Magazine Time,and Damage per Magazine. It isn't applying more damage over a shorter timeframe. It is applying less damage over a shorter timeframe, as there is less damage in a ACRs magazine. Saying the ACRs magazine size is better is like saying the AR would be better if its mag was reduced to 43. Its stupid. It is an unarguable point that the AR has better magazine and damage based stats than the ACR. It is just better, simply. And like I said, the bonus doesn't just reduce kick. It also tightens the hipfire cone of the weapon, which is a really good thing by itself. Together with the kick reduction, which reduces the need for feathering pretty much completely, the overall Galassault bonus is really great. The AR hardly has any dispersion, go use a BAR or a burst and tell me when kick and dispersion become a problem. As for the CR thing, I can apply my entire magazines damage on someone in a little under/over 3 seconds. I can then reload and start shooting again in about another 2.3 seconds. So a Combat rifle could empty an entire magazine on someone, fire some more, all before a gallente assault can empty and reload. A combat rifle can apply more damage overall because of its good fire rate and short reload times. That and it has a much higher DPS anyway.
Are you comparing Regular CRs to ARs instead of ACRs... :/
At least make it an equal comparison. Burst ARs vs CRs, and ACRs vs ARs.
In which case, my argument still applies. ARs have much more damage in their magazines than CRs do, and apply that damage at a faster rate...
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Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
2540
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Posted - 2015.03.09 18:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:Fizzer I'm not sure how you're not understanding that High RoF means being able to apply damage faster? Regardless of your views on it I'm not sure your grasping what Echo is saying.
Think of it as a drag race, you may say that the AR has a greater damage per clip but when they are in a drag race its all about who reaches the finish line the fastest. And with the Combat rifle its going to cross the finish line everytime before the AR gets into 2nd gear.
Also, I'm sticking with Base variants for now fizzer if you didn't catch that in the original post.
And you need to calm your tone down. This thread was keeping it level until you started throwing tantrums in post #17
So we aren't comparing ACRs to ARs, but instead CRs to ARs...?
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