DUST Search - Rattati please read. MU and Matchmaking

deezy dabest wrote:

LHughes wrote:

deezy dabest wrote:

LHughes wrote:

Smaller squad will be the only true fix to making games even

6 vets (& the worse10) vs the next 16 best players in the match = Vets will win.

4man squads for pubs was 10x better in closed beta

Smaller squads are only going to lead to more LOL stomping. In closed beta you did not have players at 70 - 80 million SP with hundreds of millions of ISK.

Maybe instead of more band aids someone should understand that you can not do match making based on K/D and W/L. It is really common sense that these stats would become skewed by match making doing its job thus negating itself exactly in the way that happened.

If you think SP and ISK come close to player skill you're an idiot.

As I do with everyone that writes a pathetic comment I checked your stats.

KD = 1.08
WL = 1.13
Total Kills = 39k
Total WP = 5.1mill

So you're probably a logi (getting there before you do as every crap player uses that excuse)

You've clearly played the game for over a year and probably have around 20-30mill SP (which is more than enough) yet you're still doing average so you look for an excuse and the only one you can think of is SP and Isk diferences? I pity you.

I have created a few alts over the last 2 years and I get similiar scores to what I do on this account (136k kills 66mill SP)

I am at roughly 53 million life time SP.

Not that I need to explain my stats to you but I ran nothing but Templar suits before and now Imperial BPOs because my favorite part of this game is growing my wallet in hopes that some day it will matter.

I did not compare SP/ISK to player skill. What SP and ISK are is empowering for proto stompers. Make all the excuses you want but these play a very real factor in this game. They do not take the place of skill but they sure make you benefit a lot more from your skill.


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deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1872	Posted - 2015.01.25 04:09:00 - [1] - Quote LHughes wrote: Smaller squad will be the only true fix to making games even 6 vets (& the worse10) vs the next 16 best players in the match = Vets will win. 4man squads for pubs was 10x better in closed beta Smaller squads are only going to lead to more LOL stomping. In closed beta you did not have players at 70 - 80 million SP with hundreds of millions of ISK. Maybe instead of more band aids someone should understand that you can not do match making based on K/D and W/L. It is really common sense that these stats would become skewed by match making doing its job thus negating itself exactly in the way that happened.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1872	Posted - 2015.01.25 04:56:00 - [2] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: deezy dabest wrote: Smaller squads are only going to lead to more LOL stomping. I'd expect we'd observe the opposite. How do you figure this will happen? Proto stomping is not caused by 6 people in a squad it is caused by 6 people in a squad versus 16 people that are as a whole not communicating at all. Just because you lower it to 4 people that does not mean that they are going against people that are suddenly organized. Also no one uses team chat so now instead of having possibly a squad of 6 communicating to fight the stompers you max out at 4. Less coordination only feeds to the problem stated above. Less chance for newbies to gain orbitals just to cost proto stompers money. Many of us talked about this when the OB cap was first raised. Making more things accessible to only the proto stompers does not help proto stomping. This is likely to be changed soon after squad size is changed but it still is what it is. This one is only a hypothetical but it has a chance of increasing the ability to Q sync in pubs. Obviously this depends on MU application. 4 squads fitting instead of 2 (assuming they are both full) increases the chances of being able to land squads on the same side. Again something that may be blocked but a possibility. The issue here is not squad size it is SP disparity, ISK disparity, and absolute lack of communication among the team. Putting a bunch of solo players against squads is going to result in stomping no matter what. About match making There should be 2 matchmaking queues where in one squads take priority and in the other solos take priority. Only when the search crosses a certain threshold is one used to fill in the other. MU should be based off of actual useful things. Lifetime time in battle / lifetime WP is something that can tell a great deal of information if used correctly. AFKers for example would quickly end up at the bottom of this list thus stopping them from ruining what could have been a good match. Overall lifetime of character / lifetime WP puts a spotlight on newbies who are learning quickly while taking it away veterans who have been doing nothing but coasting for a while. Warpoints / Death can quickly separate the logis and slayers from the rest of the pack. [b]Lifetime Kills / Lifetime kill assists[b] would take a little bit of study on how to apply but I think this stands to show very well whether a person is a team player or a solo slayer. These are just a few examples of things that could work far better than W/L or K/D because they are slow evolving stats that truly identify a player as oppose to what he has done over the past few matches. Yes, I understand that W/L and K/D are only part of the formula but they become normalized as match making improves until we reach a point that only the rest of the formula matters making the overall effect much worse than where we started.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1872	Posted - 2015.01.25 05:17:00 - [3] - Quote Mejt0 wrote: [To deezy dabset] It's more about will to fight. Single veteran can easly change the course of the battle, but these 15 random players have to spawn and fight. You are totally right which is exactly what got me thinking and made me decide to create this thread while you were posting. [IDEA] Stat to be included in matchmaking. Another thing is the fact that one player can have all the will to fight in the world but in this game where your finances determine what you can do having absolutely no support is going to quickly lead you to either run around shooting stray players or sitting in the redline with everyone else. The people who do not have financial limitations are already in a squad and most likely on the opposite team.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1874	Posted - 2015.01.25 05:33:00 - [4] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: I believe your fundamental assumptions are wrong, Deezy. Stomps have everything to do with lopsided teams. Newbros and assorted randoms on one side, even if expertly coordinated, have very low odds against a large group of organized veterans. It'd be tougher to stomp a match with a group of 4 than a group of 6. Obviously this depends on what the composition of the team out side of that 6 is. You could very easily be right or very easily be wrong depending on the number of squads in the battle and the number of AFKers. Also just because they have a squad of guys spamming proto does not mean they have 6. Currently a proto squad can go a man or two down and still go in. In this case a squad of 6 has a good chance against them As far as the syncing thing I would just like to say again that there is no evidence this will take place. I am simply stating the fact that if nothing is done specifically to stop it then the uniformly smaller squad sizes increases the probability that it will happen.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1874	Posted - 2015.01.25 05:42:00 - [5] - Quote One thing I THINK we could all agree on is the fact that CCP has tried so much in the past to limit proto stompers and it simply did not work. Maybe instead they should look at it from a perspective of empowering the ones that are not proto stomping. I really do not think limiting coordination abilities of every one does any thing to put proto stompers at a disadvantage. It is possible that this will do something to make matchmaking better in which case this fix will be good in the long term.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1874	Posted - 2015.01.25 05:49:00 - [6] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Wow. How naive do you have to be to think reducing squad size is gonna stop stomps? The problem isn't squads, its matchmaking one side gets the squaded group and the other gets 16 randoms that run about like lemons. CCP Rattati wrote: I think it [reducing squad size] is one of the simplest way to alleviate pubstomping ^ You callin' this guy naive? I would not go as far as say naive but saying that this would alleviate pub stomping is being a bit too confident in an idea. Obviously he has more facts than us but with what we know I see absolutely zero evidence that it will alleviate or even slow down pub stomping.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1877	Posted - 2015.01.25 13:44:00 - [7] - Quote LHughes wrote: deezy dabest wrote: LHughes wrote: Smaller squad will be the only true fix to making games even 6 vets (& the worse10) vs the next 16 best players in the match = Vets will win. 4man squads for pubs was 10x better in closed beta Smaller squads are only going to lead to more LOL stomping. In closed beta you did not have players at 70 - 80 million SP with hundreds of millions of ISK. Maybe instead of more band aids someone should understand that you can not do match making based on K/D and W/L. It is really common sense that these stats would become skewed by match making doing its job thus negating itself exactly in the way that happened. If you think SP and ISK come close to player skill you're an idiot. As I do with everyone that writes a pathetic comment I checked your stats. KD = 1.08 WL = 1.13 Total Kills = 39k Total WP = 5.1mill So you're probably a logi (getting there before you do as every crap player uses that excuse) You've clearly played the game for over a year and probably have around 20-30mill SP (which is more than enough) yet you're still doing average so you look for an excuse and the only one you can think of is SP and Isk diferences? I pity you. I have created a few alts over the last 2 years and I get similiar scores to what I do on this account (136k kills 66mill SP) I am at roughly 53 million life time SP. Not that I need to explain my stats to you but I ran nothing but Templar suits before and now Imperial BPOs because my favorite part of this game is growing my wallet in hopes that some day it will matter. I did not compare SP/ISK to player skill. What SP and ISK are is empowering for proto stompers. Make all the excuses you want but these play a very real factor in this game. They do not take the place of skill but they sure make you benefit a lot more from your skill.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1877	Posted - 2015.01.25 13:46:00 - [8] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: LHughes wrote: deezy dabest wrote: LHughes wrote: Smaller squad will be the only true fix to making games even 6 vets (& the worse10) vs the next 16 best players in the match = Vets will win. 4man squads for pubs was 10x better in closed beta Smaller squads are only going to lead to more LOL stomping. In closed beta you did not have players at 70 - 80 million SP with hundreds of millions of ISK. Maybe instead of more band aids someone should understand that you can not do match making based on K/D and W/L. It is really common sense that these stats would become skewed by match making doing its job thus negating itself exactly in the way that happened. If you think SP and ISK come close to player skill you're an idiot. As I do with everyone that writes a pathetic comment I checked your stats. KD = 1.08 WL = 1.13 Total Kills = 39k Total WP = 5.1mill So you're probably a logi (getting there before you do as every crap player uses that excuse) You've clearly played the game for over a year and probably have around 20-30mill SP (which is more than enough) yet you're still doing average so you look for an excuse and the only one you can think of is SP and Isk diferences? I pity you. I have created a few alts over the last 2 years and I get similiar scores to what I do on this account (136k kills 66mill SP) I am at roughly 53 million life time SP. Not that I need to explain my stats to you but I ran nothing but Templar suits before and now Imperial BPOs because my favorite part of this game is growing my wallet in hopes that some day it will matter. I did not compare SP/ISK to player skill. What SP and ISK are is empowering for proto stompers. Make all the excuses you want but these play a very real factor in this game. They do not take the place of skill but they sure make you benefit a lot more from your skill. I would be more than happy to meet up against you or you and a squad and settle the score on what I need to make excuses for.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1877	Posted - 2015.01.25 13:59:00 - [9] - Quote LHughes wrote: I will but a basic gun on a basic suit with basic with basic mods and post the first match here in an hour or 2 (youtube takes forever) The diference between a new charachter and a 70-80mill characther (in proto suit) is 2-4 bullets. You shoot him 1st you will win (player skill aside) There is no flat difference between players. A maxed out Amarr commando user with a maxed out proficiency in the ScR is going to nearly one shot a basic Caldari suit. I only use this as an example of a case where it is going to make far more difference than what you try to imply.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1877	Posted - 2015.01.25 14:01:00 - [10] - Quote LHughes wrote: I will but a basic gun on a basic suit with basic with basic mods and post the first match here in an hour or 2 (youtube takes forever) The diference between a new charachter and a 70-80mill characther (in proto suit) is 2-4 bullets. You shoot him 1st you will win (player skill aside) Also, good god man how may corps have you been in. A rubber ball does not bounce between that many corps. I found your 1 day stay in "LHUGHES IS A PEDO" to be quite entertaining.

deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1878	Posted - 2015.01.25 15:10:00 - [11] - Quote LHughes wrote: Reserved, Did two games as dont know wether covenant assualt is basic or advanced (i liked it cos it was red) and it was a stacked team on our side I used a militia frame second game and went 9-1 before my laptop power went (forgot to plug it in next too playstation eta 2/3 hours You could just act like a normal streamer and use twitch. I recommend Open Broadcaster Software (OBS) to screen capture your capture software.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1878	Posted - 2015.01.25 15:12:00 - [12] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: LHughes wrote: Reserved, Did two games as dont know wether covenant assualt is basic or advanced (i liked it cos it was red) and it was a stacked team on our side I used a militia frame second game and went 9-1 before my laptop power went (forgot to plug it in next too playstation eta 2/3 hours You could just act like a normal streamer and use twitch. I recommend Open Broadcaster Software (OBS) to screen capture your capture software. Oh and twitch has the option to export directly to youtube. Unless you plan on editing to prove your point? My offer still stands for a battle. I can log on and start my stream right now. Rumor is a successful FW jump start took place today so we can easily 1v1.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1878	Posted - 2015.01.25 15:44:00 - [13] - Quote LHughes wrote: deezy dabest wrote: deezy dabest wrote: LHughes wrote: Reserved, Did two games as dont know wether covenant assualt is basic or advanced (i liked it cos it was red) and it was a stacked team on our side I used a militia frame second game and went 9-1 before my laptop power went (forgot to plug it in next too playstation eta 2/3 hours You could just act like a normal streamer and use twitch. I recommend Open Broadcaster Software (OBS) to screen capture your capture software. Oh and twitch has the option to export directly to youtube. Unless you plan on editing to prove your point? My offer still stands for a battle. I can log on and start my stream right now. Rumor is a successful FW jump start took place today so we can easily 1v1. EDIT: Chat invite sent from Eve before I log into Dust for no reason. Come prove you are willing to defend your point in a live feed. 2 hours? uploading it and dont want to cancel it (I cant play and upload) Sure hop in the channel I sent if you are on Dust still. We can talk stream stuff and BS about the game.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1878	Posted - 2015.01.25 15:57:00 - [14] - Quote About to fight. http://www.twitch.tv/deezy_dabest
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1878	Posted - 2015.01.25 16:20:00 - [15] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: About to fight. http://www.twitch.tv/deezy_dabest GG to Hughes and his nades lol. My gun game has gone to **** since moving to Eve and this seriously proved it.