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Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
549
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Posted - 2015.01.20 13:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
1. How about injecting some skill and more importantly aim into the SL |
Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
549
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 14:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Atiim wrote:So basically make the Swarm Launcher's progression through tiers broken? I fail to see what this proposal would do beyond making the lower tiered SLs underperform even more than they already do. MINA Longstrike wrote: The problem is largely that it's way too easy to get too many volleys of incredibly high damage swarms in the air, too fast before a pilot can react. Swarms are overperforming in terms of dps, alpha damage and ease of use, massively beating out forges and plasma cannons in almost all aspects. This is compounded with commando suits reload bonus, and the damage bonus minmatar (shouldn't) get to swarms.
Confirmed for not knowing what their talking about. Swarms "massively beat out Forges in almost all aspects" yet they have only 50% of the range, slightly lower DPS, require a direct FOV to hit, slower projectile speed, and can't attack Infantry. The fact that you mentioned PLCs is appalling, of course it's going to under-perform when compared to AV weapons which aren't terrible. The Commando's Damage bonus has no effect on the Swarm Launchers TTK (as confirmed here), so removing it won't do anything to cater to nerf Swarms campaign. As for not being able to react in time, the average human reacts at .215s and yet it takes (at least) 2.2s to launch 2 volleys, giving you ample time to react. MINA Longstrike wrote:Swarms probably need their locking time increased and that would make them considerably more balanced. "Considerably more balanced" or objectively inferior? Not that the latter doesn't mean the former to Pilots but stating your actual intentions would save both of us a lot of time.
1. This is a bait post but il bite
2. All 3 volleys gone at 4seconds 2a. All volleys will be fired before he is out of lock range 2b. 50% of 400m is 200m atiim because that is the missile max range, the FG can only fire to 300m 2c. Require a direct FOV of target - False - I can lock on through cover/terrain and fire while not looking at the target 2d. Slower projectile speed - Maybe but a ADS finds it hard to outrun the missiles so they are not that slow considering they recently got a speed buff and do not deaccelerate only move at top speed and top speed settings 2e. 10% off the bat from a suit - That is better than a complex damage module so it will effect the SL 2f. 2 seconds to react is fine? - But i ask how can you react when invisible swarms hit you? You can only react when you see the danger and as a ADS pilot not everything renders and infantry are invisible from 100m up and sometimes do not render till you are skiming the ground - Before you mention the FG and that instantly hitting at least they have to aim and not have a weapon that will always hit so i have a chance to dodge the FG where as with the SL you have already fired 3 volleys which will hit |
Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
549
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 15:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Lazer Fo Cused wrote:1. This is a bait post but il bite
2. All 3 volleys gone at 4seconds 2a. All volleys will be fired before he is out of lock range 2b. 50% of 400m is 200m atiim because that is the missile max range, the FG can only fire to 300m 2c. Require a direct FOV of target - False - I can lock on through cover/terrain and fire while not looking at the target 2d. Slower projectile speed - Maybe but a ADS finds it hard to outrun the missiles so they are not that slow considering they recently got a speed buff and do not deaccelerate only move at top speed and top speed settings 2e. 10% off the bat from a suit - That is better than a complex damage module so it will effect the SL 2f. 2 seconds to react is fine? - But i ask how can you react when invisible swarms hit you? You can only react when you see the danger and as a ADS pilot not everything renders and infantry are invisible from 100m up and sometimes do not render till you are skiming the ground - Before you mention the FG and that instantly hitting at least they have to aim and not have a weapon that will always hit so i have a chance to dodge the FG where as with the SL you have already fired 3 volleys which will hit [...] 2. Means nothing, 3 volleys only kills LAVs and vehicles with Base HP. Even if it didn't 4s is ample time to react. 3. Depends on the vehicle, but ADSs can travel further than 175m in 4s and that's assuming they start from 0m away. 4. False, SL locks require a direct FOV and I've tested this myself. 5. My statement is true, yours has nothing to do with a comparison to FGs so it's irrelevant. 6. Forgot to link, see evidence here. 7. Swarms are rarely invisible, even if they were you can still hear them. Even if you couldn't hear them you still have time to react once the first volley is fired.
2. I can basically kill most vehicles or scare them off for a good 30seconds
3. No they cannot unless they are already moving
4. Wrong again - I can lock on through cover and terrain and have done mulitple times in a match
5. Its false
6. 3.5% is better than nothing and adds more damage
7. They still are invisible 7a. I can only hear them if i am close enough to the launch and if i hear them as they approch the vehicle its too late they will hit me 100% 7b. Only if i see them can i react but the fact it the 1st volley will always hit |
Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
551
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 17:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 2. I can basically kill most vehicles or scare them off for a good 30seconds
3. No they cannot unless they are already moving
4. Wrong again - I can lock on through cover and terrain and have done mulitple times in a match
5. Its false
6. 3.5% is better than nothing and adds more damage
7. They still are invisible 7a. I can only hear them if i am close enough to the launch and if i hear them as they approch the vehicle its too late they will hit me 100% 7b. Only if i see them can i react but the fact it the 1st volley will always hit
2. Most vehicles in 3 volleys? Give me some builds. 3. Yes, they can. 4. Show me a video of you locking onto a vehicle behind a wall. 5. No, it's true and common knowledge. The FG's projectile travels much faster than the SL's volley. 6. That 3.5% damage still has no changes on the amount of volleys needed to destroy an HAV, therefore irrelevant.
2. If the vehicle doesnt move after 3 volleys its going to be dead
3. No
4. I might just take a picture with the orange lock box on through cover instead because i have no video equipment but anyone can do it
5. The FG has a chance of missing due to aim and the missile never miss and they outrun and catch upto a DS these days so really projectile speed means nothing and you didnt dispute this at all
6. Thats 3.5% more damage which means TTK does change
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Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
565
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 19:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Savage Mangler wrote:I don't get all this QQ about swarms. Do people just stop, bend over and take it when they get hit nowadays? What ever happened to hardener+afterburner/fuel injector and getting the hell out of dodge? As an avid forgegunner who has moonlighted as a swarmer for a long time, any pilot worth his salt usually dips out after taking fire.
1. They nerfed hardener
2. They nerfed afterburner
3. They increased swarm missile speed so its basically impossible to outrun swarms
4. They still havnt fixed the broken SL so trying to avoid invisible missiles which still do happen is impossible and when missiles avoid cover what am i supposed to do? go underground? |
Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
567
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 20:09:00 -
[6] - Quote
Savage Mangler wrote:Lazer Fo Cused wrote:Savage Mangler wrote:I don't get all this QQ about swarms. Do people just stop, bend over and take it when they get hit nowadays? What ever happened to hardener+afterburner/fuel injector and getting the hell out of dodge? As an avid forgegunner who has moonlighted as a swarmer for a long time, any pilot worth his salt usually dips out after taking fire. 1. They nerfed hardener 2. They nerfed afterburner 3. They increased swarm missile speed so its basically impossible to outrun swarms 4. They still havnt fixed the broken SL so trying to avoid invisible missiles which still do happen is impossible and when missiles avoid cover what am i supposed to do? go underground? 1 & 2. Could you be so kind as to refresh my memory of what they nerfed about them exactly? 3. Really? Because I've seen plenty of (A)DS's and tanks eat the first volley, pop their hardener and waltz away just fine. 4. There's a directional damage indicater for reason. When it pops up, regardless of whether you see missles or not, drive/fly the other direction. If your cover isn't covering you, find better cover.
1. Resistance - 60 to 40% but Armr hardeners are worse off from 40% to 25%
2. Activation time and cooldown times
3. Well they hit me fine everytime and i spend half my time in the sky doing sweet FA
4. The directional damage indicator is broken |
Lazer Fo Cused
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
568
|
Posted - 2015.01.20 20:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Savage Mangler wrote:Lazer Fo Cused wrote:Savage Mangler wrote:Lazer Fo Cused wrote:Savage Mangler wrote:I don't get all this QQ about swarms. Do people just stop, bend over and take it when they get hit nowadays? What ever happened to hardener+afterburner/fuel injector and getting the hell out of dodge? As an avid forgegunner who has moonlighted as a swarmer for a long time, any pilot worth his salt usually dips out after taking fire. 1. They nerfed hardener 2. They nerfed afterburner 3. They increased swarm missile speed so its basically impossible to outrun swarms 4. They still havnt fixed the broken SL so trying to avoid invisible missiles which still do happen is impossible and when missiles avoid cover what am i supposed to do? go underground? 1 & 2. Could you be so kind as to refresh my memory of what they nerfed about them exactly? 3. Really? Because I've seen plenty of (A)DS's and tanks eat the first volley, pop their hardener and waltz away just fine. 4. There's a directional damage indicater for reason. When it pops up, regardless of whether you see missles or not, drive/fly the other direction. If your cover isn't covering you, find better cover. 1. Resistance - 60 to 40% but Armr hardeners are worse off from 40% to 25% 2. Activation time and cooldown times 3. Well they hit me fine everytime and i spend half my time in the sky doing sweet FA 4. The directional damage indicator is broken 1. Ok I'll admit that has got to blow for armor vehicles, a small buff to the armor hardeners might be in order. However swarms are +20/-20 so armor isn't ideal in the first place. 2. I can't really make a comment on that one. 3. How do you fit your ship? How many volleys can you take, hardened and unhardened? 4. Broken as in "registers each missile individually and therefore doesn't give good info" or broken as in "completely fails to indicate direction"?
3. If its shield i do not want to take 3 hit unhardened and armor i can take 3 due to more HP but same thing i have to run i cannot dual a SL user at all due to knockback and 4seconds 3 volleys
4. As in it says i got hit from the left and its the right side and im flying towards the direct of the AV user |
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