DUST Search - Logi is now irrelevant outside of PC.

Joseph Ridgeson wrote:

I have noticed the exact opposite of everything you have listed. I have Minmatar Logistics 5 and max on all equipment other than Scanner.

1. I have never had a game where Heavies were rare. I always find some fat bastard to rep and assist in their killing spree.
2. Uplinks were nerfed a while ago and for good reason. It was a little bit too fast to spawn in with no detriment from a Militia Uplink. Stating that there is no reason to level them up is far from the truth. Militia Uplinks give off a 15 second spawn time. My Viziam Flux Uplinks throw out mercs every 8 seconds. Twice as fast is certainly worth it to me.
3. A 300k suit is extravagant. Why would you use that if you are only going to average 1,000 WP and/or not in a serious fight? My go to is a Basic Minmatar with Core Repair, Viziam Flux Uplink, and Advanced Rep Hive. Costs less than 70k, I think around 65 if I recall correctly. It's purpose is to help my team get to the objective faster and to stay on it with fast Spawn Time and Repair. I pull some pretty good numbers when I do it and feel like I was a valuable member of the team.

In truth, my WP's have gone up since Bandwidth as I was one to always stay as Logistics rather than throw Uplinks everywhere and go Heavy. I am mostly coming from non-Skirmish but I haven't seen any real problems. I am very curious what matches you are playing if you are stating that Sentinels are rare.

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Big Burns Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 321	Posted - 2015.01.19 10:06:00 - [1] - Quote Due to bandwidth and the rarity of heavies, logis have become obsolete. It is no longer worth skilling into or spending 300k isk per suit just to average 1000wp's per game. I often find myself wasting nanohives or other equipment that I lay down, just for some scout to barely use it's capacity. Most of my equipment is left on the battlefield in a random place on the map. Given the scarcity of CQC, logis can barely find heavies to rep. Most of the time I find myself repping scouts while running 300+ meters to the next battle/objective. They don't even need me to rep them because every suit has armor repair now, and they would have recovered by the time they made it to the next scenario anyway. Uplinks got nerfed to hell and are only useful if your skilled into amarr. Otherwise you'd be better off saving the 700k SP and just using militia or standard. The majority of my Wp's come from reviving mercs, but that's harder to do now that 70% of the maps are open space. I spend 30 seconds running to revive them and they bleed out before I can get to them or get shot from some player camping the supply depot with a rail rifle. It's really ridiculous though when it comes down to how inefficient the logis equipment has become. I get what CCP was going for by making these maps spacious, with vast open space for vehicles and certain locations reserved for compounds or CQC, and how in their minds they picture a squad moving from compound/objective to another location with all of this empty space in between, but that's not how it actually plays out. And we all know this. So we are left with scouts and assaults running around camping the objectives and spraying out into the open areas safe from counter fire. All the mean while billy bob solo keeps dying out in the open trying to push towards these "fortified" points with no cover or a squad to back him up. And so the idea crumbles. And so you are forced to not push other objectives and just camp your own, or cloak up and sneak all the way around the other side and flank them which takes a lot of time and in any case you have to join the bandwagon because there is no other way around this problem as a solo player or small squadron. And so as I said before you have to play scout or assault when pushing a point or in other words, just trying to play the game the way it was intended. To push points and capture objectives. And this is why you don't see a lot of heavies anymore and why logis are pretty much useless unless they are dropping equipment for themselves. I'm a try-hard, because half my team sits in the MCC.
pumping up Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2015.01.19 10:16:00 - [2] - Quote Rattati already said that they will increase the max carried amount of equipments. So you will be able to replenish them at new places more often. Logi equipment became inefficent? Nanite injector revives with shields now... there's a 100% available. Can't say much about the others. PS. When I go logi in pubs, usually end up with good amount of WPs.
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6585	Posted - 2015.01.19 10:36:00 - [3] - Quote I haven't exactly found heavies to be rare in pubs. The ones there tend to be highly aggressive and less prone to point camping than before though. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 4712	Posted - 2015.01.19 10:46:00 - [4] - Quote Heavies... rare? Jeezus, when was the last time you played Domination?!
rpastry Dead Man's Game 258	Posted - 2015.01.19 11:04:00 - [5] - Quote dunno what game you're playing but its still **** easy to go top wp in a game running links/needle/repper. just not 4x everyone else every time. and THANK FECK equipment spam is over. no more brain dead morons spamming links and hives next to a supply depot the entire match. [Removed ASCII Art - CCP Logibro]
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1845	Posted - 2015.01.19 11:12:00 - [6] - Quote Big Burns wrote: the rarity of heavies hahaha hohoho hihihi hehehe if you thing logis are irrelevant than you are doing it wrong. min logi setup with nano, needle, uplink and rep => your team will love you and you get easy 3k WP every game gal logi, start game with uplinks, hop into LAV/dropship, place them all around the map, return to depot and switch to scanner fit => your team will love you and you get easy 3k WP every game
Kuruld Sengar Y.A.M.A.H 157	Posted - 2015.01.19 12:35:00 - [7] - Quote At this point running solo has become hopelessly obsolete as people get settled into, and familiar with, their squad of choice.
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 3144	Posted - 2015.01.19 12:41:00 - [8] - Quote I have noticed the exact opposite of everything you have listed. I have Minmatar Logistics 5 and max on all equipment other than Scanner. 1. I have never had a game where Heavies were rare. I always find some fat bastard to rep and assist in their killing spree. 2. Uplinks were nerfed a while ago and for good reason. It was a little bit too fast to spawn in with no detriment from a Militia Uplink. Stating that there is no reason to level them up is far from the truth. Militia Uplinks give off a 15 second spawn time. My Viziam Flux Uplinks throw out mercs every 8 seconds. Twice as fast is certainly worth it to me. 3. A 300k suit is extravagant. Why would you use that if you are only going to average 1,000 WP and/or not in a serious fight? My go to is a Basic Minmatar with Core Repair, Viziam Flux Uplink, and Advanced Rep Hive. Costs less than 70k, I think around 65 if I recall correctly. It's purpose is to help my team get to the objective faster and to stay on it with fast Spawn Time and Repair. I pull some pretty good numbers when I do it and feel like I was a valuable member of the team. In truth, my WP's have gone up since Bandwidth as I was one to always stay as Logistics rather than throw Uplinks everywhere and go Heavy. I am mostly coming from non-Skirmish but I haven't seen any real problems. I am very curious what matches you are playing if you are stating that Sentinels are rare. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
robin williams' ghost whisky tango foxtrot sir 595	Posted - 2015.01.19 12:45:00 - [9] - Quote I think the op believed it was opposite day. Robin Williams endorses this corp
Echo 1991 Titans of Phoenix VP Gaming Alliance 682	Posted - 2015.01.19 12:58:00 - [10] - Quote Joseph Ridgeson wrote: I have noticed the exact opposite of everything you have listed. I have Minmatar Logistics 5 and max on all equipment other than Scanner. 1. I have never had a game where Heavies were rare. I always find some fat bastard to rep and assist in their killing spree. 2. Uplinks were nerfed a while ago and for good reason. It was a little bit too fast to spawn in with no detriment from a Militia Uplink. Stating that there is no reason to level them up is far from the truth. Militia Uplinks give off a 15 second spawn time. My Viziam Flux Uplinks throw out mercs every 8 seconds. Twice as fast is certainly worth it to me. 3. A 300k suit is extravagant. Why would you use that if you are only going to average 1,000 WP and/or not in a serious fight? My go to is a Basic Minmatar with Core Repair, Viziam Flux Uplink, and Advanced Rep Hive. Costs less than 70k, I think around 65 if I recall correctly. It's purpose is to help my team get to the objective faster and to stay on it with fast Spawn Time and Repair. I pull some pretty good numbers when I do it and feel like I was a valuable member of the team. In truth, my WP's have gone up since Bandwidth as I was one to always stay as Logistics rather than throw Uplinks everywhere and go Heavy. I am mostly coming from non-Skirmish but I haven't seen any real problems. I am very curious what matches you are playing if you are stating that Sentinels are rare. That's a bit expensive don't you think? You'll most likely die 3-4 times and lose isk anyway. I think basic and advanced equipment needs to be slightly better.

Slave of MORTE Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 171	Posted - 2015.01.19 13:04:00 - [11] - Quote I have 3 proto logis It's my main role to fun in pubs when drunk You say there are no good heavies you ever heard of the concept called squading up ? Logi isn't really viable as a solo role ..it used to be now it's not ..bring your own heavies Logis are fine ..all use full except the caldari logi Yet another slave of Mortedeamor
Echo 1991 Titans of Phoenix VP Gaming Alliance 682	Posted - 2015.01.19 13:11:00 - [12] - Quote Slave of MORTE wrote: I have 3 proto logis It's my main role to fun in pubs when drunk You say there are no good heavies you ever heard of the concept called squading up ? Logi isn't really viable as a solo role ..it used to be now it's not ..bring your own heavies Logis are fine ..all use full except the caldari logi Cal logi needs a buff, but logis are far from fine. They are far to slow and have such little stamina. I would like to see them have similar stats to the assault (Not HP though). They need something more. I am hoping bonuses get changed and all get a rep tool bonus.
Alaika Arbosa Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 2393	Posted - 2015.01.19 13:14:00 - [13] - Quote <-Logi/Sentinel Mk.0 <-Doesn't PC <-Gives not a single **** what you think of their relevance Amarr/Minmatar vehicles are OP (especially Minmatar speed tanks) ^The reason why CCP is afraid to release them
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1730	Posted - 2015.01.19 14:07:00 - [14] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: They are far to slow and have such little stamina. Yes they do , I had two complex kin cats and complex stamina on a Min logi and still was being outran by a Min assault . That's just stupid and I had no armor besides base . Edit : As far as the heavies go , there are games where you can play matches where there are NO heavies on the team that you might be on and when the opposite team fields them , no one on that team that you might be on , won't .... so I've seen what the OP is talking about . I'm seeing the same amount of scouts , which outnumber all other roles , then more assaults and commando then logi's . I run around looking for a heavy or two on numerous occasions and can find none . This game is starting to become anti-solo and it's mainly from feedback from the community . There should be a choice and options not an absolute " squad up or die " scenario . You do fight for a team and team should come before all . I see a lot of squads that just don't understand the TEAM concept . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1730	Posted - 2015.01.19 14:18:00 - [15] - Quote Hey OP you might not see too many heavies because there are some in the community who are going on a witch hunt to nerf them so those same might just see the writing on the wall and choose to do something else . I started to get tired of seeing the nerf heavies or HMG posts myself , it's like swarm launchers . Can't nerf a role because squad play is excelling and you can't handle it , it kills the game for everyone but these people just don't see that and the solo player suffers . Squads are just killing the game and it's players who squad who complain the most about everything . CCP better do a better job at reading between the lines . That part their just not doing too well . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 3146	Posted - 2015.01.19 14:32:00 - [16] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: That's a bit expensive don't you think? You'll most likely die 3-4 times and lose isk anyway. I think basic and advanced equipment needs to be slightly better. I have generally pulled 300,000 ISK or more when using that fit when I do well so it hasn't been that bad. Equipment is expensive compared to every other module other than weapons though. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
Echo 1991 Titans of Phoenix VP Gaming Alliance 683	Posted - 2015.01.19 14:35:00 - [17] - Quote Joseph Ridgeson wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: That's a bit expensive don't you think? You'll most likely die 3-4 times and lose isk anyway. I think basic and advanced equipment needs to be slightly better. I have generally pulled 300,000 ISK or more when using that fit when I do well so it hasn't been that bad. Equipment is expensive compared to every other module other than weapons though. I know it's not uncommon to get that much, but it is really bad that you would have to run a suit that costs 65k+ to have a decent logi fit.
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 530	Posted - 2015.01.19 14:46:00 - [18] - Quote 1. I told you so 2. Logis are rare along with uplinks and nanohives unless you want to go full proto in a pub match which no one wants to do 3. Heavies are not rare 4. Pubs has got worse due to the rarity of uplinks
Oswald Banecroft II Muteki Armati Virium 35	Posted - 2015.01.19 16:01:00 - [19] - Quote If you cannot find a Sentinel then grab yourself a Commando or someone in an Assault suit and follow them as best you can. I like defending the objective and love any heavy who enjoys doing the same. I hate the ones who run off looking for kills because most of the time it ends up with us losing the objective since the whole team seems to suffer from ADD and being unable to shoot at something for ten seconds drives them mad.
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 3148	Posted - 2015.01.19 16:52:00 - [20] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Joseph Ridgeson wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: That's a bit expensive don't you think? You'll most likely die 3-4 times and lose isk anyway. I think basic and advanced equipment needs to be slightly better. I have generally pulled 300,000 ISK or more when using that fit when I do well so it hasn't been that bad. Equipment is expensive compared to every other module other than weapons though. I know it's not uncommon to get that much, but it is really bad that you would have to run a suit that costs 65k+ to have a decent logi fit. "Would have to run" is probably a bit of a stretch, as well as is my estimation of the price. I was including the Prototype Repair Nanohive which I don't actually use. My actual fit is here. Replace Assault Rifle with Assault Rail Rifle but Protofits doesn't actually have that updated. I believe the total price comes out to less than 43k, though the BPO Sever does certainly save me 3,000 a death. I could rework it to something like this and use my BPO Assault Rifle to kick the cost below 30k. That fit costing 30k, or about 35k for those without BPO, would probably be quite decent overall. But I like having the Repair Nano Hives and having the fastest Uplinks is a War Point Paradise for me, so "having to run a 65k+ fit" is probably a bit out there. However, it is certainly more expensive than my Assault or Scout fit would be given the price of Equipment. Yes, some Equipment does scale quite poorly or at least doesn't scale evenly. It is like the old Shield Extenders (22/33/66). Uplinks: Standard (Hacked/Flux): +35% spawn time Advanced (Flux): +8% spawn time Prototype (Flux): -21.3% spawn time Repair Tool: Standard (Basic): 40 HP/s, 10 meter range Advanced (Basic): 60 HP/s, 15 meter range Prototype (Basic): 70 HP/s, 15 meter range, 2 targets Nanohive: Standard (Basic): 1 Active, 2 Carried, 36 Cluster, 10% Resupply Rate Advanced (Basic): 2 Active, 2 Carried, 48 Cluster, 15% Resupply Rate Prototype (Basic): 2 Active, 3 Carried, 48 Cluster, 30% Resupply Rate Uplinks are the biggest problem; the difference between 13.5 seconds, 11 seconds, and 8 seconds is enormous. That curve should probably be smoothed out. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"

Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 783	Posted - 2015.01.19 16:55:00 - [21] - Quote lol @ that heavys are rare. Thats a good joke. Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
Vash Warren Tankers United Covert Intervention 83	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:09:00 - [22] - Quote If you think heavies are rare than add me as a contact I am always looking for a logi the problem is it seems that if you run a heavy not in squad you take 2nd priority to a guy at full health which is crazy. The game is heavy centered on squad play. Heavy's are the the moving walls of one man that force everything else into retreat. Show some love for Logi Bros.
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2307	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:12:00 - [23] - Quote I'm all for increasing the amount of equipment logis can use. Give them 9000 Bandwidth for all I care. But the bandwidth on other suits needs to stay. No more switching from logi once the links are down. Home at Last <3
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2907	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:33:00 - [24] - Quote I rarely play logi except in PC. Just too expensive and too unappealing of a role for me, personally, as I enjoy killing people rather than helping others kill. That, and all the flashbacks to when it was the only role I could effectively play when I started playing this game with MKB, and the thousands and thousands of deaths and the sub 1.0 KDR that took me a long time to dig my way out of. lol
KING CHECKMATE Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 7076	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:36:00 - [25] - Quote Big Burns wrote: Due to bandwidth and the rarity of heavies. Thats all i read. I LOLd. Byes. Playing as : Calscout + Amarr Assault
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5613	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:47:00 - [26] - Quote "Rarity of heavies" I stopped reading there.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2797	Posted - 2015.01.19 17:50:00 - [27] - Quote I'm having a bit of fun putting down 4 links as a STD Amarr logi and getting a steady stream of WP from spawning people in. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Vitantur Nothus Nos Nothi 1827	Posted - 2015.01.19 18:06:00 - [28] - Quote Rarity of heavies?
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1108	Posted - 2015.01.19 18:15:00 - [29] - Quote As an almost full time logi, I feel very relevant. I wish I could get points for active scans though, it's the one thing I do to help the team I get very little return on. Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance 1108	Posted - 2015.01.19 18:18:00 - [30] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: I'm having a bit of fun putting down 4 links as a STD Amarr logi and getting a steady stream of WP from spawning people in. Std Amarr logi, flux uplinks = profit. Mark a$$ tricks, and bags of dicks....



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