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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
704
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Posted - 2015.01.07 23:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
*yawn*
LOL
Good.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
707
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Posted - 2015.01.08 00:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
TIGER SHARK1501 wrote:
Who babysits a drop uplink??
SpawnCampers.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
708
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Posted - 2015.01.08 17:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
Jay Westen wrote:Hate to say it clone d, but after your previous rant about logistics getting to many warpoints and it being a simpletons class. I outright refuse to support you.
And here we have the Golden Heart of the matter. For the Algebraically inclined who missed the formula, here it is:
x= talking **** about Logis/Logistics
y= BandWidth limits forced on Logis
z=Logi suits being largely underpowered
W= fewer people giving a **** about supporting scrubs.
W= x(z+y)
Tears for everyone!!
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
708
|
Posted - 2015.01.08 17:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Clone D wrote:Jay Westen wrote:Hate to say it clone d, but after your previous rant about logistics getting to many warpoints and it being a simpletons class. I outright refuse to support you. That is fine. I don't need your support. But the team does. Don't neglect everyone else please. Keep your lack of support between us. Thanks.
Maybe you should slay more, faster, so that the little support you do get isn't squandered.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
708
|
Posted - 2015.01.08 17:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
Clone D wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:Clone D wrote:
If there are no logis on the team, then I must bite the bullet, admit that there is a need and I have the potential to meet that need, so I ... must ... ... logi because the needs of the many are greater than the needs of the few or the one. But I just got suckered into playing a role that I do not want to play for the remainder of the match.
So, now we finally come to the real issue. It's not that "logis aren't doing their jobs" it's that there aren't enough people actually playing logi. Or at least, based on my experience, not enough people not running some ****** APEX (logi) suit. Oh, I know that there are plenty of matches where very little equipment is placed. But while bandwidth has limited some of the previous logi tourism, it is pretty obvious that so many people running APEX suits (and it wouldn't surprise me if logistics commit this sin more than any other role, for obvious reasons) has a lot to do with it as well. Exactly, so since there are a shortage of logis, we need to add some bandwidth buffer to other roles in order for them to help logis deploy a little extra equipment on the field. Not a lot, just one additional uplink or so ought to do it. That way, all other roles aren't sacrificing the equipment that they need in order to perform their role just to help logis distribute equipment.
No, because SPAM. And tourists. And crappy slayer tears are actually good.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
711
|
Posted - 2015.01.08 18:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:Ok, let's try this, OP.
Lets say we buff proxies and change the BW to 1. RE's also get a BW cost of 1.
Now whats your opinion?
More scout RE spam, YAY!! Munson be praised!!!
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
716
|
Posted - 2015.01.08 18:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Clone D wrote:Nothing Certain wrote:Proxies are one option, one that to be effective requires as many proxies as you can lay down, meaning no links, hives or remotes. It seens like a poor tradeoff for a logi to do this. Who is supposed to lay proxies now? Can you describe a strategy that makes sense?
Amarr AV Logis. Close the Gates! Ignite the Moat!!
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
723
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 19:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
RayRay James wrote:Combat oriented people pushed to have the needle nerf installed. Sure WP Farming happened, but get over it.
People stopped playing logi because of it.
Bandwidth was introduced because CCP wanted it, not Logi's
Loss of logis from previous nerfs means less logis on the field.
I still run a link, needle, rep milita suit as my main and a pro logi when I want to have fun. I have droplink suits, nanohive suits, and every kind of equipment suit a logi should have for any ocassion. I can bring out the droplink suit, get dead, and spawn in with a different fit because bandwidth transfers over.
Ultimately, the problem isn't any of the changes. It's that the changes made people leave the role. Less logis = less equipment.
Also, assaults and scouts have equipment slots. suck it up and use them. Us logis wont mind an extra droplink or hive.
This I don't think is too far off.
D, you have the ability to "perform" any role from any suit now, as BW is.
Are you as effective at it than suits designed to optimize that role? No, and you shouldn't be. Thats why suit base specialization exists.
As far as raising the BW limits for SAC, why? They have enough to self-support at a basic level OR weaponize further, as you've proven repeatedly. It just isn't enough BW to do both, simultaneously. Just like how none of my Logi suits can generate passive scans low enough and far enough to detect dampened scouts. If I want to do that, I need a scout frame and to sacrifice most of my Logi gear.
And remember, I am the guy who argued vehemently against BW being added the minute the topic was bluestickied.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
723
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 19:22:00 -
[9] - Quote
RayRay James wrote:Clone D wrote:Nothing Certain wrote:Proxies are one option, one that to be effective requires as many proxies as you can lay down, meaning no links, hives or remotes. It seens like a poor tradeoff for a logi to do this. Who is supposed to lay proxies now? Can you describe a strategy that makes sense? My logi with proto proxies, RE and nanohive work great in certain scenarios. Get me on the bridge map with that suit and unless the tank is paying fantastic attention there's no more tank.
Amen to that ^^^^^^
#AVLogiMafiaSinceMurderTaxi514.1.3
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
723
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 19:49:00 -
[10] - Quote
Clone D wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:D, you have the ability to "perform" any role from any suit now, as BW is.
Are you as effective at it than suits designed to optimize that role? No, and you shouldn't be. Thats why suit base specialization exists.
As far as raising the BW limits for SAC, why? They have enough to self-support at a basic level OR weaponize further, as you've proven repeatedly. It just isn't enough BW to do both, simultaneously. Just like how none of my Logi suits can generate passive scans low enough and far enough to detect dampened scouts. If I want to do that, I need a scout frame and to sacrifice most of my Logi gear. My position is this: bandwidth is fine, but it was implemented in an extreme way, resulting in a conundrum of mutual exclusivity: AssaultContemplator wrote:Do I help my team with that uplink right now, or do I perform my job better with an RE? Someone who has used their SP to spec into assault should ideally be able to focus on assaulting, not sacrifice their hard earned suit bandwidth because there aren't enough logis in the player base. This is where I say, a role should be able to perform the duties related to that role at a peak level. Due to the lack of logis, we should all be able to lend a hand and contribute above and beyond by only a minimal amount. But then we should be able to return to our role and perform it fully without the loss of job effectiveness. In terms of bandwidth, this would mean relaxing it by about 4 bw per dropsuit.
But this, again, already proves the point contrary to your arguement.
That assault, if absolutley need be, CAN drop that precious link should his discretion determine its neccessity.
Does that commit his equipment capability? Yes.
Does that subsequently render him battlefield useless? No. He still has his LW, his SA and his G. In addition to whatever his base+mods stats create. He can continue assaulting, minus the committed equipment.
Try it like this:
Assault Dilemma wrote: Hm.....
Should I run my AR, and gain range but reduced alpha damage in CQ OR
Should I run my SG and be **** at range but a scythe in CQ??
Decisons, decisions...
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
723
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 19:52:00 -
[11] - Quote
Omega Black Zero wrote:Commando has best the AV specialization potential, double swarm launchers... swarm launcher and plasma cannon...if you're just going to camp one area like a ****** and hope that a dropship flies near.
I do agree, however, that each role (with the exception of Sentinels) should be providing a minor degree of support alongside the logi. The logi is intended to be the beast of burden, taking the main load of support, but easing that load puts your team in a better position to succeed if everyone can provide minor support. One logi is just one man, and you aren't always going to have more than one, at least in pubs and FW
FTFY XD
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
723
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 20:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
Except that should any individual find themselves without ammo or a spawnpoint they have the option of hacking a CRU or Supply Depot.
Just like if there isn't enough AV on the field, any individual has the option of acking and using a turret.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
|
el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
724
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 20:36:00 -
[13] - Quote
RayRay James wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:RayRay James wrote:Combat oriented people pushed to have the needle nerf installed. Sure WP Farming happened, but get over it.
People stopped playing logi because of it.
Bandwidth was introduced because CCP wanted it, not Logi's
Loss of logis from previous nerfs means less logis on the field.
I still run a link, needle, rep milita suit as my main and a pro logi when I want to have fun. I have droplink suits, nanohive suits, and every kind of equipment suit a logi should have for any ocassion. I can bring out the droplink suit, get dead, and spawn in with a different fit because bandwidth transfers over.
Ultimately, the problem isn't any of the changes. It's that the changes made people leave the role. Less logis = less equipment.
Also, assaults and scouts have equipment slots. suck it up and use them. Us logis wont mind an extra droplink or hive. This I don't think is too far off. D, you have the ability to "perform" any role from any suit now, as BW is. Are you as effective at it than suits designed to optimize that role? No, and you shouldn't be. Thats why suit base specialization exists. As far as raising the BW limits for SAC, why? They have enough to self-support at a basic level OR weaponize further, as you've proven repeatedly. It just isn't enough BW to do both, simultaneously. Just like how none of my Logi suits can generate passive scans low enough and far enough to detect dampened scouts. If I want to do that, I need a scout frame and to sacrifice most of my Logi gear. And remember, I am the guy who argued vehemently against BW being added the minute the topic was bluestickied. Actually, I have a logi suit that gets down to 27dB. Doesn't get everything, but most people don't go for true damp scouts. If they do, they win. If they don't, I win.
Exactly my point.
Sacrifice made, gain =/= to performance of optimized suit for role.
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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el OPERATOR
Capital Acquisitions LLC
Bad Intention
724
|
Posted - 2015.01.09 20:42:00 -
[14] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:And remember, I am the guy who argued vehemently against BW being added the minute the topic was bluestickied.
Ahh.. That made my day, Thank you! Anyway; Back to this guy...
LOL, then or now? Either way, I'm glad to hear you're stoked a little and want to ensure you aren't getting my position twisted:
I ******* hate ******* bandwidth.
But I don't agree with D in tweaking the values, aside from buffing the **** out of Logi BW.
Title this thread, "**** Bandwidth, it HAS to GO" and all I would post would be, "Signed, +1".
Open-Beta Vet.
Drunk Night Tree Burner.
This is my Main and Original.
DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
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