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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
977
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Posted - 2015.01.02 00:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:
I treat Logibro's with the same respect as a doormat. You wipe your feet with it, and then forget it ever existed.
Yep.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
978
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Posted - 2015.01.02 00:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:
I treat Logibro's with the same respect as a doormat. You wipe your feet with it, and then forget it ever existed.
Yep. You are officially on Zaria's **** list. I doubt he cares... I am just a logi, after all.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
978
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Posted - 2015.01.02 08:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Ydubbs81 wrote:I think this mechanic allows for so much abuse. Amarr heavies with 1200hp+ with resistance to weapons coupled with (sometimes) 2 logis repping them at once. Someone, somewhere has to believe that there is something wrong with this, no? This game is supposed to be based on skill, right?
At first, it seemed ok but players started abusing it and something just didn't feel right about that mechanic. Especially when there is nothing like that for shield infantry (esp. heavies)
I'm thinking that the rep tool should be at 100% efficiency when the person is not taking any damage. And then perhaps 50% efficiency when the person is taking damage (for the people who want to continue to abuse this) Given that even 2 fully maxed Logistics suits repping a Sentinel at the same time can't out-rep the DPS of a single Assault Rifle, the only thing they're giving that Sentinel is more time to defend himself, and only by a few seconds. There is NO way in hell you can stack enough reps on one person to let them resist even a single rifle without being a complete waste as far as the team is concerned. The fact that armor tanking allows for team-coordination based tactics and shield tanking currently does not does not mean we need to start looking for ways to nerf teamwork. Not that I'm buying into Ydubbs81's perpetual feeling of armor being OP (when it isn't) but you also have to take into account how many rounds the AR has in the mag, it's reload time, etc. The 'resistances' argument was flawed considering that the Amarr Sentinel only has resistances toward Projectile and Rail weaponry, so it's an edge case against only a handful of weapons that I'll likely plot out later. In the case of the AR, however... It's actually impossible to kill an Amarr Sentinel in those conditions, even with an AR. Not because of the DPS, the DPS actually outclasses the repair rate, but the reason why it's a viable option is because the AR doesn't have an infinite magazine and in the 2.55s it takes you reload the thing, the Amarr Sentinel would be back at full armor. Even with it's shields at 0, you still wouldn't have enough rounds in the magazine to kill it. Going to do the Assault Combat Rifle next, see if there's a different result. It's a fair point. However... I don't really see the issue with one (1) assault with a rifle being unable to beat a group of 2-4 people working together... which is the scenario here. How do the numbers look with, say, 2 proto ARs unloading into that Amarr heavy with 1 proto rep on him? Or even more sensibly, 2 ARs first taking down 1 logi and then focus firing on the now repless sentinel? Maybe the scenario is now more acceptable for the assaults?
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
978
|
Posted - 2015.01.02 08:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Ydubbs81 wrote:I think this mechanic allows for so much abuse. Amarr heavies with 1200hp+ with resistance to weapons coupled with (sometimes) 2 logis repping them at once. Someone, somewhere has to believe that there is something wrong with this, no? This game is supposed to be based on skill, right?
At first, it seemed ok but players started abusing it and something just didn't feel right about that mechanic. Especially when there is nothing like that for shield infantry (esp. heavies)
I'm thinking that the rep tool should be at 100% efficiency when the person is not taking any damage. And then perhaps 50% efficiency when the person is taking damage (for the people who want to continue to abuse this) Given that even 2 fully maxed Logistics suits repping a Sentinel at the same time can't out-rep the DPS of a single Assault Rifle, the only thing they're giving that Sentinel is more time to defend himself, and only by a few seconds. There is NO way in hell you can stack enough reps on one person to let them resist even a single rifle without being a complete waste as far as the team is concerned. The fact that armor tanking allows for team-coordination based tactics and shield tanking currently does not does not mean we need to start looking for ways to nerf teamwork. Not that I'm buying into Ydubbs81's perpetual feeling of armor being OP (when it isn't) but you also have to take into account how many rounds the AR has in the mag, it's reload time, etc. The 'resistances' argument was flawed considering that the Amarr Sentinel only has resistances toward Projectile and Rail weaponry, so it's an edge case against only a handful of weapons that I'll likely plot out later. In the case of the AR, however... It's actually impossible to kill an Amarr Sentinel in those conditions, even with an AR. Not because of the DPS, the DPS actually outclasses the repair rate, but the reason why it's a viable option is because the AR doesn't have an infinite magazine and in the 2.55s it takes you reload the thing, the Amarr Sentinel would be back at full armor. Even with it's shields at 0, you still wouldn't have enough rounds in the magazine to kill it. Going to do the Assault Combat Rifle next, see if there's a different result. It's a fair point. However... I don't really see the issue with one (1) assault with a rifle being unable to beat a group of 2-4 people working together... which is the scenario here. How do the numbers look with, say, 2 proto ARs unloading into that Amarr heavy with 1 proto reptool on him? Or even more sensibly, 2 ARs first taking down 1 logi and then focus firing on the now (basically) repless sentinel? Maybe the scenario is now more acceptable for the assaults? Right. Which is the logical thing to do. I'm not going to fire at the Sentinel who is going to take forever to kill, I'm going to kill the Logi's. I was just providing backing to what Ydubbs81's argument is here in the context provided, whether or not someone is stupid enough to try and go toe-to-toe with an unkillable Sentinel is their prerogative. Now, as promised, I re-did the numbers for the ACR and it is certifiably impossible to out-DPS that kind of repair. Not that you should ever try to begin with but for the sake of argument, the math backs up Ydubbs81 in this case. Well, obviously. I am just trying to underline the fact that I don't think it entirely reasonable to demand nerfs to a mechanic that requires the cooperation of multiple people solely based on the fact that it is, on paper at least, unbeatable by a SOLO player. I say on paper simply because circumstances vary, not all situations are equal.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
979
|
Posted - 2015.01.02 15:09:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote: In all of these situations you should NOT be running straight at the Sentinel while trying to kill his support. Most of the time those people will be in a squad together. If you're solo and trying to take on a group of players communicating with each other from the front, you're almost never going to win. Use the available terrain and cover to your advantage, break contact, and try to flank around. If that doesn't work, try and shadow the Sentinel until he engages another guy on your team, and then hit the Logi. It'll take the Sentinel a second or so to break off and switch targets, and in that time you can waste his support and leave him vulnerable.
You're trying to argue common sense to people who are, pretty much, going "nerf teamwork so I can solo better" (thank you for summing that up, whoever did so earlier). I applaud your efforts, but I doubt they will be very fruitful.
"I can't solo a group of people even with my leet gungame QQ" is possibly one of the most inane arguments ever. Yes, having better gungame than most should lead you to win most fair 1v1s... except who the hell expects this game to be a series of gentemanly duels? Really? But if you're going 1v2, 1v3, 1v4, yes, it is entirely possible your superior skills can be enough to make you the winner of that engagement... but if it isn't, maybe consider NOT going headfirst into more 1vmanys? Instead of demanding nerfs to others.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
980
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Posted - 2015.01.02 16:34:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:
Core locus grenades are great, but with proto repair tool ranges being as long as they are, the logi will be far from the blast radius. The sentinel will giggle as your grenade blast tickles his fat rolls.
I probably shouldn't tell you this... but it's not exactly a secret. You know that core locus nade will instakill most logis? If not all? Think outside the box, even though that sentinel is a big, slow, easy target, you might want to try using your brain.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
|
Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
980
|
Posted - 2015.01.02 16:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:I probably shouldn't tell you this... but it's not exactly a secret. You know that core locus nade will instakill most logis? If not all? Think outside the box, even though that sentinel is a big, slow, easy target, you might want to try using your brain. The logi is half a mile down the hallway with his proto rep tool, pumpkin. The sentinel is also probably standing on repair hives, just to be sure. Also, it hurts when I use brain. Burn brain it does.
I guess you just need to unlock grenade throwing proficiency.
And to add to the list of counters to that situation. Massdrivers work wonders on logis, none of that annoying resistance the sentinels get. And shooting a plasma cannon down a straight hallway isn't exactly difficult.
Once again, please don't expect sympathy just because your solo rifle can't easily remove an enmbedded squad from a defensible position.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
|
Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
983
|
Posted - 2015.01.02 17:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:And to add to the list of counters to that situation. Massdrivers work wonders on logis, none of that annoying resistance the sentinels get. My trouble with mass drivers is that tiny clip size and ammo capacity. If the opposing team happens to have a drop uplink in the right spot then they will respawn by the time I dislodge them from their hidey hole. Zaria Min Deir wrote:And shooting a plasma cannon down a straight hallway isn't exactly difficult. Putting a slow-ish moving projectile that requires a brief charge-up into a logi's stomach at 40m while being fired at by a proto HMG sentinel is not happening. Maybe someone will get lucky every so often, but it is not consistent enough to be considered a counter. Zaria Min Deir wrote:Once again, please don't expect sympathy just because your solo rifle can't easily remove an embedded squad from a defensible position. I don't run solo. These are squads trying to take on squads. And, for all of my griping, the HMG sentinel/logi is working "as designed" so I can't fault it too much. The logi keeps his death count low and reaps incredible amounts of WPs, especially if they are within 50m of the objective. The sentinel doesn't die, not that their death count was high to begin with. It's efficient and effective. I just hate being on the other end of it match after match. Well, good for you. That was primarily in response to the sentiment envoked by the OP, to be honest. As that has been the primary argument in this thread, "I can't solo a heavy (or heavies) that have support". And the PLC shot wasn't meant for the logi, duh ;)
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
|
Zaria Min Deir
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
983
|
Posted - 2015.01.02 17:37:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:As that has been the primary argument in this thread, "I can't solo a heavy (or heavies) that have support". Well, technically, any dropsuit is hard to solo when it has support #SquadMasterRace #SoloMoreLikeBozosAmIRight Zaria Min Deir wrote:And the PLC shot wasn't meant for the logi, duh ;) You vastly overestimate my gun game That being said, I have wanted to play around with a Galmando AR + PLC fitting. Maybe it's time to invest the SP... No no, assuming you could hit the logi would have been overestimating your gungame, I mean you should play at your level and aim for the huge slow ************ in front of the logi
And hell to the yes for the Galmando with AR and PLC, that is one bad ass on the field.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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