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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2338
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Posted - 2014.12.25 17:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
Typing on a phone, so forgive me if this has weird typos.
So one huge point of contention between shields/armor is damage mods. Armor not only has high health and team support through triage hives and rep tools, but they also have higher damage than shields. These 3 advantages compete against shields 1 advantage, high regen. This is why we have an armor meta. Armor has nearly everything going for it, and with a little assistance, I can easily match, and even greatly surpass, shield regen with armor. I believe damage mods are at the crux of this issue. Therefore, I propose several things.
First off, move damage mods to lows. Shields are supposed to be skirmish fighters; get in, hit hard, get out. Damage mods in the lows allow shields to have two advantages over armor, high regen and high damage. Now shields can be effective skirmishers, able to more easily whittle away at armors high health, and have a better chance of breaking through armor's ability to team support.
But with this change, armor is left with little to use in their high slots. They would have shields mods (dual tanking is a sin) or precision enhancers. This should not stand. So, let's move all biotics to the highs. Kincats, cardios, everything. And let's also move utility to the highs; codebreakers and range amps and the like. Now, armor has a new advantage: better utility. They may not do as much damage as shields, but they can compensate for their plate penalty easier, hack faster, "see" farther and better (on tacnet) in addition to having high health and team support.
However, I'm sure plenty of armor tankers will feel this isn't enough. High damage, especially with shields high regen, would become the next FOTM! (I disagree, but I digress) and I am also a fan of bringing Eve modules into Dust. Therefore, I propose a new module be made. I call it:
The Weapon Stabilizer. Armor ships in Eve have access to the tracking computer: while it doesn't increase damage directly, it allows easier damage application through increased optimal range and turret tracking speed (turrets can hit faster targets) now a module that increases optimal range I believe could be very easily abused. Therefore, weapon stabilization would instead decrease dispersion and/or reduce recoil. As I don't know how numbers affect dispersion and recoil, I won't give hard figures, but copying the percentages from damage mods would be a starting point. This means that armor may not be able to match the damage of shields without sacrificing tank, but they can more easily apply their damage than shields can, again without shield sacrificing tank.
In effect, these changes not o my add variety and give a wider range of fitting options, but adds in a new module to really change the dynamic of how shield and armor tanks interact. It would also help with dual tanking; I doubt shields would prefer armor over damage, and armor would have more options for their highs to either overcome their tanks weakness, or help them apply damage easier. In this situation, shields become PC viable, being effective skirmishers harassing defenders, while armor lose some offensive capabity while gaining better utility, and compensating for the loss of damage mods with damage application mods.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2339
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Posted - 2014.12.28 08:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Bumping for visibility after the holidays.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
16316
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Posted - 2014.12.28 09:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Firstly before you go any further.
HELL YEAH LETS PUT DAMAGE MODS IN LOWS! They always should have been in there.
Secondly Low Slots have a module called a Tracking Enhancer. This is a passive tracking module.
The Tracking Computer is an Active Medium (high) Slot module.
*"He spoke, and we made it so all worlds were one, all peoples were one, all faiths, creeds, and nationalities were one.
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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2339
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Posted - 2014.12.28 10:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Firstly before you go any further.
HELL YEAH LETS PUT DAMAGE MODS IN LOWS! They always should have been in there.
Secondly Low Slots have a module called a Tracking Enhancer. This is a passive tracking module.
The Tracking Computer is an Active Medium (high) Slot module.
This is true. However, as dust doesn't have tracking in the Eve sense, weapon stabilization is analogous to this.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
1426
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Posted - 2014.12.28 11:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Why not just have a ROF or dmg mod that fits either low or high slot depending on race? That said, I generally agree that low slots are the place for damage mods.
My bigger desire would be able to have rig slots for the dropsuit since that's really where you can really get into customization and trade offs. It also supplies a nice Sp sink for veteran players.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2339
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Posted - 2014.12.28 11:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Why not just have a ROF or dmg mod that fits either low or high slot depending on race? That said, I generally agree that low slots are the place for damage mods.
My bigger desire would be able to have rig slots for the dropsuit since that's really where you can really get into customization and trade offs. It also supplies a nice Sp sink for veteran players.
I've actually given thought to rig slots. For instance, rigs could do things like make armor repairers 10% more efficient, and other bonuses along the lines of boosting fitted mods.
But as to my proposal, I feel like having damage mods based on race is a little redundant and doesnt solve the issue of armor having high health AND high damage. Armor should definitely have high damage application however.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
1426
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Posted - 2014.12.28 13:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Why not just have a ROF or dmg mod that fits either low or high slot depending on race? That said, I generally agree that low slots are the place for damage mods.
My bigger desire would be able to have rig slots for the dropsuit since that's really where you can really get into customization and trade offs. It also supplies a nice Sp sink for veteran players. I've actually given thought to rig slots. For instance, rigs could do things like make armor repairers 10% more efficient, and other bonuses along the lines of boosting fitted mods. But as to my proposal, I feel like having damage mods based on race is a little redundant and doesnt solve the issue of armor having high health AND high damage. Armor should definitely have high damage application however.
We agree that the armor & high damage has directly contributed to imbalance. The current dmg mod construct also pushes folks to dual tanking very quickly.
Until we see an offensive module in a low slot and armor tankers making hp vs dmg choices having versions of damage mods that work in either slot is an option. Armor tankers should not be the sole keeper of high DPS application. I would offer that high raw DPS is the realm of the armor brawler and high damage application should be the preview off shield tanker that fights to control distance. Those are two different things.
I like the recoil reduction module idea but that only really works on something like the breach AR or RR / ARR. The SCR would only benefit from a heat sink type module since it has no recoild or dispersion.
What you may have struck on is simply getting a wider range of offensive support mods that can effect things from dmg, dmg type, ROF, heat, and charge time.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2339
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Posted - 2014.12.28 14:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
To be fair, you have a point about recoil reduction benefitting the ARR more. But I feel like armor should have lower raw damage without sacrificing tank, especially since the armor races have access to the highest DPS items in the game (ScR and AR) With shields having lower health and no team support, I think having higher damage is a fair gain for them, while armor can gain easier damage application. Having good damage application doesn't mean much when you are not only out tanked and have no team support but are outgunned simply because you cannot afford to run damage without compromising tank.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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