DUST Search - Lets take a look at some of the new features in Dust 514

RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

Z3dog wrote:

If you payed to get there faster then you payed to get there before someone else and if you payed to get there before someone else then you payed to beat them.

I see a critical flaw in that logic of yours. You may have payed to get there faster before someone else (ie: Boosters), but eventually the players who don't pay will get to your level as well and the universe balances itself out as a result. But remember, getting the SP sooner to use proto gear using boosters doesn't guarantee a win in an actual 1v1 encounter. There are players out there who can wreck protos with militia if they have sufficient gameplay experience and know what they're doing.

Also, you can officially disqualify boosters as part of this argument because now with Daily Missions you can get 1-Day Active Boosters (whether regular or Omega) for free if you grind enough missions. In this one week alone since 1.10 deployed, I managed to earn a 1-Day Omega Active Booster and a 1-Day Active Booster without paying any AUR in any way, shape, or form. For anyone who can grind for a long time in a single day, this is a great way to progress quickly without paying anything. You still can't get the 3-Day, 7-Day, or 30-Day variants for free, but at least it helps those players who are strapped for cash but willing to grind.

There's a weekly cap anyway so it is completely flawed and moot.

Nothing but ramblings from some kid or skint hooray who doesn't have a clue.


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Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10460	Posted - 2014.12.14 00:19:00 - [1] - Quote Z3dog wrote: Megaman Trigger wrote: I'll have to argue against points 1 and 2 to a degree. The ranking can go up just by logging in, winning games etc with no need to buy Aurum. Likewise, Apex suits can be earned in Factional Warfare. Aurum just makes them easier. A bigger point would be Boosters and the lack of an ISK variant, even if it was a lesser variant. The ranking CAN go up just be logging in, winning games etc. The point is someone who doesn't buy Aurum has no chance of competing with someone who does. Apex suits CAN be earned in factional warfare, however it is difficult to extremely difficult depending on what faction you're fighting for. Meanwhile a wallet warrior can not only get one apex suit instantaneously, they can get many across all classes and all races. Regarding your first point, I have to disagree about non-AUR players having no advantage over AUR players. Player A who never spent AUR can still beat the crap out of Player B (who spend AUR) just by using ISK-variant gear in a given match. AUR doesn't guarantee a win. Regarding your second point, I agree. But here comes the "BUT". I have encountered matches in FW where the Gallente and Minmatar would get their asses handed to them by the Amarr and Caldari. These kind of matches, ever since 1.10 came around, are no longer rare from the looks of it. It can depend on the time of day as well. In my case, since I live in the US EST, I see Gallente and Minmatar winning a lot in the day but then get stomped on their faces late at night by the opposing factions. I would know as I have had to grind a lot to get the Federation 'Serpent' Scout. I'm going for the Republic 'Tiger' Scout now but even now in the day time I'm encountering stiff opposition coming from the Amarr side. But overall, I never spent a single AUR to get my faction-variant APEX suit. I feel better and more accomplished getting the faction-variant APEX despite being able to afford the AUR-variant APEX right from the start. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10475	Posted - 2014.12.14 21:31:00 - [2] - Quote G Felix wrote: Strongboxes are basically slot machines, and generally a poor use of Aurum. Apex suits are anywhere from mediocre to poor fits with absolutely no customization or adaptation options, and can also be earned through FW. The only real feature that I will grant the OP lies behind a pay wall is obtaining a high loyalty rank, where Aurum purchases make a significant difference. But consider the very menial gains to SP and ISK % granted by these ranks. For a free to play game, CCP has actually managed to do a very good job keeping players who put quarters into their PS3's happy with the added content without giving them any meaningful tactical advantage over a player who creates fits purely with ISK. Even then I wouldn't go so far as to even call it a "pay wall". Pay Walls are generally defined or viewed by the gaming industry as barriers in a game where you are totally incapable of progressing any further if you don't pay any cash. By that definition, the Loyalty Rank system doesn't qualify as a Pay Wall. With enough winning matches, with enough daily logins, and with enough other non-AUR related activities, you will be able to reach Loyalty Rank 15 without paying a single AUR. It's a MASSIVE GRIND to do so but eventually you'll get there. In other words, a true Pay Wall is like an impenetrable wall that not even Superman can break through if he's broke as a hobo while the Loyalty Rank system is like a flimsy grid-iron frence that's rusty and loose in a few places and if you're willing to ignore the "No Trespassing" signs on it, you'll get through without paying the guard that's on duty. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10475	Posted - 2014.12.14 21:35:00 - [3] - Quote I have a question to the OP. At what point is the line drawn where supporting a game with cash becomes outright milking of the wallets? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10475	Posted - 2014.12.14 21:48:00 - [4] - Quote Z3dog wrote: If you payed to get there faster then you payed to get there before someone else and if you payed to get there before someone else then you payed to beat them. I see a critical flaw in that logic of yours. You may have payed to get there faster before someone else (ie: Boosters), but eventually the players who don't pay will get to your level as well and the universe balances itself out as a result. But remember, getting the SP sooner to use proto gear using boosters doesn't guarantee a win in an actual 1v1 encounter. There are players out there who can wreck protos with militia if they have sufficient gameplay experience and know what they're doing. Also, you can officially disqualify boosters as part of this argument because now with Daily Missions you can get 1-Day Active Boosters (whether regular or Omega) for free if you grind enough missions. In this one week alone since 1.10 deployed, I managed to earn a 1-Day Omega Active Booster and a 1-Day Active Booster without paying any AUR in any way, shape, or form. For anyone who can grind for a long time in a single day, this is a great way to progress quickly without paying anything. You still can't get the 3-Day, 7-Day, or 30-Day variants for free, but at least it helps those players who are strapped for cash but willing to grind. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10476	Posted - 2014.12.14 21:54:00 - [5] - Quote Immortal John Ripper wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: I support this by saying CCP is a business and this game needed a justification to stay around. I suspect CCP told Rattatti, increase revenue or the game gets unplugged. Then we got balance hotfixes which stabilized the player base and started to generate a small number of return players. That wasn't enough though, so Ratatatatata convinced CCP to allow more client side patches, but there had to a monetary incentive to do so - after all CCP has to pay Sony for each patch deployed so you see what we get - a patch that generates revenue to justify the deployment; you get AUR stuffs as well in the market. It's not a conspiracy at all - it's business and I have no problem with a business generating revenue. I work for a business - if my company generates revenue I keep my job. Nuff said. EDIT: Not saying this applies to the OP; I don't understand people that expect CCP to give away their intellectual property for free. To me, its' enough you can play the game without spending a dime, and if you decide to spend money that is a great thing. You don't get pay to win - most of these changes are side grades to save the time sinks. how do you know ccp has to pay money for every patch deployed? source or are you just making stuff up? Have you even read the standard contract that sony offers most 3rd party developers? I have read it before and i do not remember anything about charging for patches. From what I last heard from CCP, they don't get charged at all from the looks of it. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10476	Posted - 2014.12.14 21:59:00 - [6] - Quote RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Z3dog wrote: If you payed to get there faster then you payed to get there before someone else and if you payed to get there before someone else then you payed to beat them. I see a critical flaw in that logic of yours. You may have payed to get there faster before someone else (ie: Boosters), but eventually the players who don't pay will get to your level as well and the universe balances itself out as a result. But remember, getting the SP sooner to use proto gear using boosters doesn't guarantee a win in an actual 1v1 encounter. There are players out there who can wreck protos with militia if they have sufficient gameplay experience and know what they're doing. Also, you can officially disqualify boosters as part of this argument because now with Daily Missions you can get 1-Day Active Boosters (whether regular or Omega) for free if you grind enough missions. In this one week alone since 1.10 deployed, I managed to earn a 1-Day Omega Active Booster and a 1-Day Active Booster without paying any AUR in any way, shape, or form. For anyone who can grind for a long time in a single day, this is a great way to progress quickly without paying anything. You still can't get the 3-Day, 7-Day, or 30-Day variants for free, but at least it helps those players who are strapped for cash but willing to grind. There's a weekly cap anyway so it is completely flawed and moot. Nothing but ramblings from some kid or skint hooray who doesn't have a clue. I wouldn't call him names. He does have a concern that he is entitled to speak his mind about. All I did was point out a flaw or two in his argument which I'm also entitled to do. Besides, I don't want this thread to devolve into name-calling. Otherwise it will get locked and that will be a shame. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10476	Posted - 2014.12.14 22:05:00 - [7] - Quote RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: Even if they don't have to pay anything to SONY, anyone who thinks some guys are going to put time into a game for nothing are completely detached from reality. There are costs anyway. Electric isn't free and people don't work for nothing last time i checked and there will be more. You can be as sure about that as we are about the law of thermodynamics, nothing is free. True enough. There is overhead to consider such as Payroll Expense, Utilities, Health Insurance (if any), Travel Expense, etc. I have done a lot of bookkeeping in my youth for various businesses and I will tell you that businesses need to make a lot of money just to stay afloat. You will be amazed at the expenses. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10476	Posted - 2014.12.14 22:15:00 - [8] - Quote Spademan wrote: I'm happy that CCP is finding new ways to make money of other players, because it means I can still sponge a free game off them. Which is great for non-paying players. They try out AUR gear or boosters or even try out using the Hacked Encryption Keys without paying anything if they grind the Daily Missions enough and see for themselves before actually spending money on it. The expanded payment options also helped Dust secure its own future by no longer having to depend so heavily on research and development funding. EDIT: My only beef with the keys is that the free ones are really rare compared to the AUR ones. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.