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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2265
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Posted - 2014.12.13 17:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
You mention here that the ASCR needs a buff. You can't think of anything except armor meta being wrong with it, so let's look into an analysis of the ASCR, and Compare it to the SCR and see what we find. All numbers are proto level.
The ASCR does 34.10 damage at 705.88 RPM, for a DPS of 401.17. It appears to have an optimal of 57m. Testing was done by aiming at an installation with an efficiency of 20% and backing up until the efficiency dropped to 19%. The breaking point was considered the optimal. I have proficiency 4 in scramblers, so this may have affected data somewhat (ie: possible that my efficiency dropoff began sooner and the game rounded to 20%, meaning the optimal may be shorter than the test indicated.) With no proficiency, the ASCR does 481.41 DPS. Armor DPS is 320.94.
Now the SCR. Damage of 71.5 and potential ROF of 600 gives us a DPS of 715. Optimal appears to be 75m. Testing was done by aiming at an installation with an efficiency of 20% and backing up until the efficiency dropped to 19%. The breaking point was considered the optimal. I have proficiency 4 in scramblers, so this may have affected data somewhat (ie: possible that my efficiency dropoff began sooner and the game rounded to 20%, meaning the optimal may be shorter than the test indicated.) With no proficiency, the SCR does 858 DPS to shields, and 572 DPS to armor.
Now of course, the POTENTIAL DPS for the SCR and its ACTUAL DPS are wildly different, dependent on player skill. However fast you can pull the trigger affects how much DPS you can do. If I can't pull the trigger faster than 400 RPM, then any calculations higher than that are moot; my DPS will never go above 476.66. Now, here's the problem with the ASCR as the numbers show it; in order to match the DPS of the ASCR, the SCR needs a ROF of 336.64 to match it at 401.17 DPS. This is a little over half the SCR ROF, or about 5.6 trigger pulls per second. I tested my personal max ROF thus:
I got an online metronome (device used to help musicians keep track of tempo) and set it to 60, or one beat per second. After getting the rhythm in my mind, I fired off as many shots as I could in the space of one second. I ran this test about 8-10 times. My best was 9 shots, with an average of 7. I also did the firing while moving around and jumping, to get as close to battle conditions as possible. This is anecdotal evidence at best. However, to put it simply, it is relatively easy for the SCR to surpass the DPS of the ASCR, and part of the reason it isn't used. I can outDPS it, outrange it, and have charge shots besides with the standard version.
In addition, the SCR also has a far lower TTK because of it's much higher damage taking off more health per shot than the ASCR. Let's do a race to chew through 800 damage in a white-room scenario. Proficiency will be excluded for this test. The SCR finishes in 12 shots. ASCR takes 24 shots to finish. A full double the SCR. So not only does the SCR have the potential to outDPS the ASCR, but it can also kill in about half the shots. Here is another part of its lack of presence. I simply need less ammo with the SCR.
There are two ways we can fix this:
1. Change the SCR's function
2. Buff the ASCR.
Personally, I am a big fan of option 1. I have had this idea for awhile, but it is a real shakeup to the base function of the SCR. However, I believe it has the potential to fix the issue without harming balance with the other rifles. Option 2 is simpler, but far more tricky. We can buff it to where it's competitive, but that means it treads on the toes of its assault counterparts very quickly. We could end up in a situation where the ASCR quickly becomes OP, and then gets nerfed again. Whichever option you wish to explore, I can create spreadsheets for. I would love to hear your thoughts Rattati.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command
880
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Posted - 2014.12.13 19:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Before anyone raises the argument that we shouldn't compare the AScR with the ScR:
1. The AScR is different from the other assault variants because of its uniquely extreme damage profile.
2. One might raise the counter-argument that this can't be the true reason for its lack of performance because the ScR works despite having the same damage profile.
3. We therefore need to discuss why the ScR is competitive in an environment where it applies only 80% damage against almost everything while the AScR doesn't.
Personally I've come to the conclusion that the AScR is in a good spot right now, except that it has a dangerous damage profile. Buffing its DPS to compensate for the AScR's lack of effect against armor will merely contribute to the uselessness of shield-tanking.
By the way, I very much enjoy the AScR's overheat mechanic, amount of ammo per magazine and kick in ADS and hipfire. The 'nerf-dart' feeling fits a laser-weapon very well. So in my opinion there shouldn't be any changes of the weapon's handling. |
Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
1389
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Posted - 2014.12.13 19:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
As noted in other threads...I think if the recoil and muzzle flash were toned down significantly it would help quite a bit.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Atiim
Titans of Phoenix
14422
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Posted - 2014.12.13 19:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
Stefan Stahl wrote:Before anyone raises the argument that we shouldn't compare the AScR with the ScR:
1. The AScR is different from the other assault variants because of its uniquely extreme damage profile.
No it's not, as the ACR also has an extreme damage profile (15/15).
The 1st Matari Commando
-HAND
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Nocturnal Soul
Primordial Threat
4778
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Posted - 2014.12.13 21:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
What if we just buffed the rof
(Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ.
LASERS BTCH!!!!!!
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Zindorak
G0DS AM0NG MEN
General Tso's Alliance
1397
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Posted - 2014.12.13 23:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
How about buff the ROF.
Pokemon master and Tekken Lord
Give me da iskiez
Gk0 Scout yay :)
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Sardonk Eternia
Tiny Universe
284
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Posted - 2014.12.15 02:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
Let's buff the ROF |
Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2272
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Posted - 2014.12.15 03:53:00 -
[8] - Quote
Buffing ROF seems to be the consensus. LEt's run a few options.
750 RPM will give us 426.25 DPS
775 RPM gives us 440.45 DPS
800 RPM gives us 454.67 DPS
Any of these sound balanced?
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Fizzer XCIV
Heaven's Lost Property
Negative-Feedback
1355
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Posted - 2014.12.15 04:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:Buffing ROF seems to be the consensus. LEt's run a few options.
750 RPM will give us 426.25 DPS
775 RPM gives us 440.45 DPS
800 RPM gives us 454.67 DPS
Any of these sound balanced?
Honestly, the DPS/Range/Damage Profile stats seem to be fine for the weapon. In a scenario where I find an unmoving player or in extreme CQC, it kills at at good rate.
The problem to me seems to be the very jarring shaking and flashing that happens when you fire. Its just too much visual imput, and it feels like I am holding a gun-shaped techno club.
Compared to pretty much every other weapon, it just feels very unwieldy and wild.
Increasing the RoF just seems like it would increase the awkwardness of the weapon. I'm personally against it for that reason, but not only that reason.
Increasing the RoF would mess up the currently balanced heat meter the weapon has. This is the problem with a heat over time system instead of a heat per shot system that I've personally pushed for. Increasing the RoF will end up just making the fix more complicated that it really needs to be.
I'd say that nearly removing the muzze flash and making it not vibrate so much would be the perfect fix.
Another little thing I'd like to see done as long as they plan on working on the ScR/AScR would be for them to remove the yellow tint that the glass on the sights has. Or at least make it not so harsh. Right now it only compounds on the flashiness and shakiness of the weapon. It honestly seems silly that any spacefaring civilization wouldn't know how to make clear glass, especially one that primarily uses directed energy weapons.
Please, make my Opus pretty...
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