Scotsman Ck.0. That is my rebuttal.

Excellent rebuttal.

Guys, it's lack of understanding such as this that makes people disrespect the Gallente.

You do know that Rattati's preffered race is Gallente right? He even said so when he was introduced as the new Dev responsible for Dust's management. So yeah, if there is going to be a suit dedicated to Rattati of course it should be Gallente

shields work well if you play as intended with caldari/minmatar.

Caldari, Primary racial enemy is Gallente specialize in short range high damage weaponry. keep at range and receive small amounts of damge from your enemys wepaons as you're outside their optimal range.

Minmatar, Primary racial enemy Amarr. slow dumb, cumbersome opponents, use fast hit/run tactics taking short amounts of high damage with fast recharges of shields.

yeah soemtimes a suit doesn't have the racial weaponry but if you see a lot of reds using Combat rifles, change to heavy shields, if they're using BAR change to armour tanked rail rifle. as i've said in many posts before. DUST is rock, paper, scissors (lizzard, spock) don't come QQ'ing because your scrub FOTM is gettign its ass kicked, look at whats killing you and find the rock to crush their scissors

Or maybe he hates the scruby rail rifle and loves the balanced AR

Strafing>armor

To put this into perspective

I have my Gallente Assault suit into level 4 and my Caldari Assault into level 1.

All armor skills for infantry in level 5 and all shield skills in infantry level 3.

Last week I got a 'Pyrus' ADV Cal suit. Since it is an Aurum suit I could use it even if I have level 1 in CalAssault.

I slapped in an ADV Rail Rifle toppled with 2 Enhanced Shield Extenders and 1 enhanced energizer and 1 enhanced recharger. On lows I put 2 enhanced regulators.

I went 20/1 with that suit sticking to it's supposed fighting style which is long range.

On my GalAssault I the most I can get in an average match is 15, on a good match is 20+ but also dying 5+ times

If you want to use a Caldari suit for close range combat then you will be at a disadvantage ofcourse.

Now, I will admit that Skirmish and Domination game modes are not good for the suit because if you want to win you gotta hack the objective. In Ambush these suits shine a little more since the only objective is too kill.

Now, I believe that when Skirmish 1.0 makes its long awaited return, Caldari suits would start to shine even better.

But for now also look at the kill feed. All you see is:
Combat Rifles
Rail Rifles
Assault Rail Rifles
HMGs
Breach ARs
Shotguns

Now, 4 of those are anti-armor weapons and absolutely wreak armor.
2 of them are Anti-Shield but one needs for you to get extremely close and the other well, it's not that OP.


Now, you should feel ashamed that I can use shield suits better than you, and I have been running all armor suits and Gallente suits 90% of the time ever since Uprising launched.

i've cut through plenty armour tankers with my caldari assault/commandos even with a basic RR. a breach or AR has its limits and yes caldari are supposed to sit at range and camp and yes technically this is EVE. the racial profiles and playstyles of the 4 races have been outlined fo rthe past 11yrs. get used to it, play the way that benefits the race and adapt to the enemy. pick your fights and run when you have to, seriously its not rocket science. your one suit can't take on the world, it takes time but if your racial preference is leavign you short then begin killign into a complimentary race.
if you're caldari and need close quarters then choose minmatar for CQC weapons that can also use the shield skills you already have on their suits.

as for caldari never capping an objective well if only there was 15 other players in the game with other suits/races they could use to run in and hack an objective while your caldari stays at range laying down cover fire... that'd just be frickin crazy wouldn't it?

The only acceptable argument I have encountered in my forum days: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2537950#post2537950

If i can go 19/5/3 (K/A/D) with a STD bpo suit that has 612 shields and only 90 armour and using a basic RR and bolt pistol on it then they can't be all that bad
Do i think they can be improved? of course, personally i've said that the shield upgrade skill (that increases HP of shield plates) needs bumping from 2% per level to 3% or maybe even 5% to brign them a little more in line, but, thanks to damage profile changes the suits and weapons are finally beginning to fall into place and work in a good way and me saying that its a caldari's role to sit back isn't making the point that shields are weak. its making the point you're too dumb to realize you have to play in a role that the suit/weapon you pick, offers you. the advantages you have over your armour tanking counterparts is quicker speed and range. sure armour is pretty good and gives you high HP and if you have a good rep module its 'always on' but a caldari assault properly fitted out can literally run rings around an amarr heavy at 60m away and slaughter the poor s.o.b as he tries to turn to kill you and if he wants to run away well he doesn't stand a chance because he's so slow from being tanked out.
if you use the right tool for the job then you'd find that for the first time in over 2yrs things are actually pretty balanced in this game.
shields have always been about quick short fast engagements, duckin for cover, recharging, popping back up and so on.

To OP.
Rattati prefers gallente. That's all.

Ps. But guess what suit is shown [theme] when you select Dust on your ps3. That's right. It's Caldari Scout.

Yeah with NO PLATES. And even if the gal was rep tanked he still doesn't have the regen of a cals shields.
Speed is where its at right now.

That also doesn't mean anything.
He chose gal, cuz he like them. Use your brain.
Atleast once.

In other words, shield or armor doesn't matter if you have multiple people shooting at you
but if you can haul ass out of there you'll live
Speed>armor

You know Rattati preferred Gallente back when most Gallente stuff was ****.


Hell, he brought Gallente out of the Dark ages of complete ****** weapons and suits.

Plasma Cannon, fixed.
Assault Rifles, improved.
Suits, improved.
Regen, installed.

Now, if you wanted to make an argument for favorites I should direct you to the race that have the most BPOs. This race has damn near more BPOs than all the other races combined.

Now that's some hardcore favoritism.

But you don't have superior mobility if you armour tank. And if you opt for ferroscales you don't have superior repairing power or greatly superior eHP values.

Because he's Gallente?
You do understand he's been playing the game for a very long time?
Including the time that Armor was a POS and everyone was in shield based suits?

You are making the assumption I am using a triage nanohive. Not everyone does this. I do not like to be pinned to one position and reliant on a single piece of equipment.

Furthermore if we are to make biased assumption to prove our points what if I ran out of triage nano hives? What If my opponent was an armour tanked caldari suit in addition to the shields, what if he was standing on a triage nanohive and also have 5 logi's supporting him?

No you haven't, the average argument involved the fact that armor has no regen delays.

Also, you clearly don't understand his point about the 1v1 faceoff.
Armor and Shields are balanced on the micro level, but there are more support gadgets to help armor and as such a team working together can support each other better.

Every imbalance in armor vs shields can be very simply solved by adding a few shield logi tools.

You are comparing 50hp/s with a quick delay vs 70hp/s that forces you to stand in a 7m radius.

I hope you realize why I laugh at Triage hive users.

Piercing has ONLY said that.
He is saying that armor is balanced vs shields on a 1v1 scale, suit by suit basis.
You're claiming that it's not, you're claiming that it's imbalanced everywhere, both the micro and the macro.

Also, FFS, you do realize that damage mods take slots right?
This isn't free damage, I could be using it to brick shields and.... brick more shields... And myo stims?
Yeah, not much to do aside from damage and shields.

I have even stopped using a second damage mod on all of my fits, I switched to only using one and instead having two shield extenders.
Works better against the onslaught of HMG's.

I use an active scanner.

Couple this with my 8m/s movement speed and Scrambler Rifle/BrSMG combo I kite around the edges of the conflict zones picking off the stragglers, locating spawn points, and providing scans and flanks for my squad.

It's the Imperial Navy Slicer of ground troops.

So you're saying that armor is balanced on a 1v1 basis?
Because you clearly aren't from this thread alone.

It'd be cool is Shields had an active equipment that kickstarted shield Regeneration. No direct hp given but just to bypass the delay and depletion delay.

As far as everything else goes.

git gud

Then give us Kinetic Catalyzers and Cardiac Regulators like it should have been.

Then give me kin cats, regulators, codebreakers, CPU mods, PG mods and dampeners in high slots.
The grass doesn't look so green now does it?

I would also like to know why your argument that having damage mods without sacrificing your main tank slots is OP doesn't apply to shields

Ha
Hahaha
Hahahahahahaha

Oh how mistaken you are.

You probably already did multiple times, but didn't even take note.

Scout superiority doesn't come just from EWAR ya know.

Dude what part of "the ability to rapidly redeploy oneself or escape harm" do you not understand?

Yup mine is from 50m away shooting them in the back. Who the **** actually rushes someone head on that sounds incredibly stupid.

I actually very much enjoy shields. I respecced into Gallente stuff because I just prefer Gallente, but shields very much suit my playstyle. Specifically, Caldari Shields. Besides all the range-involved stuff and weapon damage types and whatnot, Caldari Shielding very much encourages a playstyle that's not so much hit-and-run as it is stay in cover and fire at the right moment. In my experience, at least.

Minmatar, however, was more hit-and-run, of course. Both would do excellently with proficient use of cover, but Minmatar just don't have enough eHP to stay OUT of cover for longer (AKA longer periods of fire before ducking again).

That said, Armor is beastly. I speced back into Gallente tech, and I have to say I almost wish I didn't (not really though, Gallente Scout lyfe). The Gallente Assault is just SO strong. I have over 1000 eHP, and over 90% of it is armor. I get treated like a heavy by my teammates. I've missed armor. A lot.

EDIT: All of this from my experience, at least. Also, while cover is advised for ANY tank type, Armor just doesn't do it as well. Armor does better in the middle of a field, murdering everything in sight. They survive longer under pressure. They just don't have as much use for it, I guess. Not as much as Shield Tankers.

Amarr pretty much revolve around kiting at med-long range with their lazors, wreckin' everything from afar. They're slow, but MAN they're built to destroy. I have an Amarr alt, and he does nothing but murder all day long. The trick to the Amarr anything is that they're extremely potent defenders.

Also, as for the "when I just want to kill stuff" comment: I have a fitting specifically for that purpose. Gallente Assault with ~990 armor, Six Kin A-CR (I had 4 million extra SP after all my weapons, suits, and core skills were out of the way, figured I'll go into every rifle), and a Triage Nanohive. Named it the "Grave Digger" just because it's so efficient at... Well, digging graves.

Judging by what he's been posting that's about all he does.

Can't shoot and move at the same time so he gets his squad to stand still in a straight line and fire away like an old timey regiment.

You say that like you think crydubbs is someone to give a **** about.

....

Says your narcissism and flock of sycophants.

Its ok, google will tell you what the big words mean.

Consider it this way: If you're a guy with a spear fighting a bear, you're not going to go toe-to-toe with the bear and expect to win. Use the environment and you're speed to your advantage and that bear will be a pelt.

Well, in the end, whose the one overpopulating the earth.

And I can agree to Aeon's statement.

Gallente Assault is decent but there are much better suits to use for Assault.

Right.

It essentially comes down to this:

Armor tanking is for players who aren't quite experts on strafing and gun-game, and that's totally fine. It creates a bridge between veteran high-intensity FPS players and players who aren't quite as well versed in the fine arts of action game mobility and precision. There's nothing wrong with that and honestly, It took me a while to really pinpoint what my problems with both tanking styles were. As we (the players) become better and more well-versed in our FPS gaming abilities we start to rely less and less on advantages like that which armor stacking gives. We start to learn more advanced techniques that provide opportunities through harder gameplay styles that armor couldn't offer.

One really good example of this that is entirely anecdotal was when I realized (and somewhat taught) that forward/backward movement is much faster than side-to-side movement. However, simply moving forward/back doesn't accomplish much if you're trying to "dodge" (I use that term loosely because it's more metaphysical than anything) gunfire. "V" strafing works better with armor tanking because of the mobility reduction and once you have that down you really start to understand the nuances of how strafing in itself works.

Once we train ourselves in multiple strafing techniques we can experiment with counter strafing (strafing against what our opponent is doing) and we start to have less reliance on armor because we realize that the gains of mobility outweigh the gains of buffer HP.

To put it another way: If there is 100 damage coming at you, which is better? Dodging 35% of the rounds or tanking all of them and having 20% more HP?

Armor HP isn't the issue. The issue arrives when the negations to mobility -from- stacking armor HP are more worthwhile than mobility based gameplay options. This is why strafe speed penalties were applied to armor plates, I feel, because the negations to stacking plates weren't outweighing the benefits of running shield mobility.

EDIT: There are a few exceptions to this sort of meta, however, and it outlines the basis for why so many players have issues with the Shotgun/HMG meta that has perpetuated since earlier in the year. Shotguns, being high alpha damage, often go hand-in-hand with EWAR and cloaking which strafing and mobility cannot defend well against. Neither, then, does it defend well against HMGs which completely negate mobility due to their high rate of fire. Essentially, both of those weapons (and the meta involved with them) put an end to the old era of the Assault / Combat Logi proliferation because it resulted in less gun game and more focus on high alpha/rate of fire to negate those old ideals.

Yeah, no, I wasn't saying that Armor vs Shield is going to win in the 1-v-1. Toe-to-toe? Yes, armor will win, because that is what it is designed for. High buffer with option to fit high damage is a recipe for destruction in the 1-v-1. This is where Armor excels and it is entirely by design.
The only time you can ever say that the Gal Assault has the same speed as Caldari is in the eventuality that you are only using ferroscales and repair modules which not only neuters the amount of buffer you can have it's basically wasting low slots. In any other case (plates/reactives) you are reducing your speed and this is casualty of being an armor tanker. Running ferros and repairers, you'll be able to get similar EHP and speed as a Caldari but no-where near the same kind of regeneration and utility. This is why I get antsy whenever people say "Gal and Cal have the same speed" because it's only true in niche, silly cases where you are basically castrating yourself to suit the argument.