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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1162
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Posted - 2014.11.28 09:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Rattati, one of the biggest problems with Minmatar assault is that it is suppose to be a hit and run but it behaves more like a fast armor tanked suit. The regen is low, delay is long.
To give you an example of how bad the regen is, my Amarr Assault suit has over 735 armor and 24 armor repairs per second. My Minmatar Assault can get a maximum of 552 shields (approximately 185 less shield HP) but with 25 shield regen per second. You would expect a suit like the Minmatar assault (lowest HP on Assault suit) to have much higher regen capebilities than an Armor suit.
Now don't forget, the 25 shield regen per second also has a 5 second delay. It takes an armor tanking suit that is supposedly suppose to have the lowest regen capabilities in the game 5 seconds to get 120 hp whereas it takes supposedly the best hit an run suit 9-10 seconds to get 125 HP.
Now I get I can use rechargers and regulators. But still after one complex regulator, I give up 72 shields for only 12 more shield repair for second. Now instead of taking 10 seconds to get 120 EHP, It takes 8.5.
This is unacceptable, the armor regen suits being able to out regen shields.
Proposal: Buff hit an run capabilities of Minmatar assault. It's regen should be far superior than the regen of an Amarr Assault. Not to mention, a suit with low HP and especially a shield suit should wipe the floor when it comes to regen and not be beat by an Amarr assault.
Amarr assault used as an example in this thread for comparison reasons.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1162
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Posted - 2014.11.28 09:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dead Cavino wrote:Oh, how how I miss that 5th high slot...
So true, It is literally mandatory to use recharger on Minmatar assault if you want to have semi good regen. I mean, the Caldari scout can get 453 HP with 50 shield regen and 3 sec delay where as my MinAss gets 37.5 regen, 480 shields and 3 sec delay (That is if I use rechargers, and two regulators where as the cal scout doesn't even need to lift a finger)
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1166
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Posted - 2014.11.28 10:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
Jebus McKing wrote:I think the most interesting thing we could do for the minmatar suits is give them the best delay. It doesn't make sense that they are worse than caldari in total shields, regen, and delay. It doesn't have to be buffed a lot, just slightly better than caldari or at least on par with them.
They already have a lot of other advantages, like movement speed, hacking speed, stamina regen. Though most of those aren't really combat related (except for the movement speed).
Well, to be honest with you, the movement speed isn't to extreme. You can put kin cats on other assaults too except they also have a easier time fitting kin cats than Minmatar Assault. The hack speed in minuscule over the other Assaults but that staminna regen is niceeeeee. That is something I would expect out of a hit and run playstyle suit.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1166
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 11:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
DeathwindRising wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:CCP Rattati, one of the biggest problems with Minmatar assault is that it is suppose to be a hit and run but it behaves more like a fast armor tanked suit. The regen is low, delay is long.
To give you an example of how bad the regen is, my Amarr Assault suit has over 735 armor and 24 armor repairs per second. My Minmatar Assault can get a maximum of 552 shields (approximately 185 less shield HP) but with 25 shield regen per second. You would expect a suit like the Minmatar assault (lowest HP on Assault suit) to have much higher regen capebilities than an Armor suit.
Now don't forget, the 25 shield regen per second also has a 5 second delay. It takes an armor tanking suit that is supposedly suppose to have the lowest regen capabilities in the game 5 seconds to get 120 hp whereas it takes supposedly the best hit an run suit 9-10 seconds to get 125 HP.
Now I get I can use rechargers and regulators. But still after one complex regulator, I give up 72 shields for only 12 more shield repair for second. Now instead of taking 10 seconds to get 120 EHP, It takes 8.5.
This is unacceptable, the armor regen suits being able to out regen shields.
Proposal: Buff hit an run capabilities of Minmatar assault. It's regen should be far superior than the regen of an Amarr Assault. Not to mention, a suit with low HP and especially a shield suit should wipe the floor when it comes to regen and not be beat by an Amarr assault.
Amarr assault used as an example in this thread for comparison reasons. I take it that you're deliberately choosing NOT to take advantage of the minmatar assault suits high movement speed, high sprint speed, high stamina regen, the ability to have more armor than caldari and more shields than amarr or gallente? There are a lot of benefits to minmatar assault suit. If you choose not to take advantage of them, that's your choice, but please don't say the suit is underpowered. It's intended to not be as good a shield tanker as caldari or amarr and gallente, but more balanced. It is the most versatile suit available. If you're new, then I can understand how you may not know this. Ask around for some help with fits and tactics. I can't help because I'm caldari
This thread is not about how good the Minmatar Assault is, It is about the flaws that it shouldn't have according to the type of Minmatar play style. If a suit is going to be a hit and sun suit, it needs to have fast fast regen (which is doesn't) and low HP ( which is does compared to the other assaults).
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1166
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Posted - 2014.11.28 11:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jebus McKing wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:Jebus McKing wrote:I think the most interesting thing we could do for the minmatar suits is give them the best delay. It doesn't make sense that they are worse than caldari in total shields, regen, and delay. It doesn't have to be buffed a lot, just slightly better than caldari or at least on par with them.
They already have a lot of other advantages, like movement speed, hacking speed, stamina regen. Though most of those aren't really combat related (except for the movement speed). Well, to be honest with you, the movement speed isn't to extreme. You can put kin cats on other assaults too except they also have a easier time fitting kin cats than Minmatar Assault. The hack speed in minuscule over the other Assaults but that staminna regen is niceeeeee. That is something I would expect out of a hit and run playstyle suit. I was more thinking about actual movement/strafe speed rather than sprint speed. Broken hit detection helps too. 
Aim Assist takes care of that.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1166
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 13:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
Killer's Coys wrote:Wow! Calm down!
Minmatar are shield and armor users. So it's normal they don't a good regen in both.
What you want is fine too minm the sale shield regen as the Caldari?
So the Caldari is useless..
No, minmatar are good in biotic, cardiac and double tanking bit not in double regen.
If you wanna a good shield tanked and regen, go to Caldari
No, No, No, you have it all wrong, in this game their shield recharge abilities are more close to Amarr than Caldari, their armor regen abilities are more close to Amarr than Gallante. Moral of story, Amarr has the Worst regen. Minmatar is actually suppose to have one of best in shields. Minmatar is not suppose to tank high in shields or high in armor. It is suppose to be a pure regen king (between the two big powers like Gallante and Caldari). Truthfully, Caldari is suppose to have huge amounts of shields (CalAss can get up to 700+) but slower regen. Gallante is to regeneration vs Amarr, as Minmatar is to regeneration vs Caldari.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1166
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 14:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:I run 2x complex regulators, 1complex kin-cat 2complex shield ext, 1complex shield energizer on my advanced min-sault for some speedy fun times.
But, when it comes to brawly fun times, I triple tank, 2 shield extenders, 1 energizer, 1complex armor rep, 1 complex kin cat, 1 complex regulator on my adv minsault. Run in, blap, run awaaay, blap if heavy. zoooom zoom zoooooom
Shield tank + Armor rep tank + Speed Tank
I run one complex regulator, energizer(or recharge), 3x complex shield extenders, 2x kin cats, one complex 75 hp 0% speed penalty plate.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1170
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Posted - 2014.11.28 15:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Killer's Coys wrote:Yeah,
Caldari is the best should tanker AND has the best regen
Minmatar has the second. That always was like this and I don't know why it would change...
Minmatar have the 5hp/s less shield regen, that's not a lot, but they can have more hp armor, more armor regen, more stamina, more speed, more strafe.
I really don't know how do you see a problem.
And if minmatar must have the best regen in armor and shield (what I find ridiculous), need the hp and the speed.
Haha I find you topic like "I wanna an OP minmatar assault!"
Actually assaults are perfectly balanced (between us) juste the Caldari and the Gallente assault bonus which are a bit underpowered... So for me, any change needed.
Ho and if you wanna have a good minmatar :
2 complex shield
2 complex eneegizers
You have +450hp and 75hp regen/sec.....
Nope. 20 shield regen per second is what Amarr assault has and Amarr is suppose to be the absolute worst shield tanking suit possible.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1170
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 15:37:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:No, No, No, you have it all wrong, in this game their shield recharge abilities are more close to Amarr than Caldari, Caldari: 5/6 - 30 Gal/Am: 7/10 - 20 Min: 6/8 - 25 Seems fine to me. Not as good as Caldari, better than both Amarr and Gallente. Sir Dukey wrote:Minmatar is actually suppose to have one of best in shields. Minmatar is not suppose to tank high in shields or high in armor. It is suppose to be a pure regen king It does have one of the best shields: it's #2 out of 4. Only Caldari can get better shields and Minmatar have better low slot support (Armour Plates, KinCats, Regulators) as well as a bevy of base benefits: higher movement/sprint speed, higher natural armour regen (plus the higher base armour) and the advantages brought with better stamina and stamina regen (the latter being incredibly important for effective mobility.) Frankly, the Minmatar Assault is pretty spot on. The only thing it could possibly get is maybe a second off of each delay or a buff to recharge rate. Neither is necessary, since the suit is perfectly legitimate as is.
The recharge rate/delay is not of a hit and run suit like the Minmatar.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1170
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 15:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Killer's Coys wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:Killer's Coys wrote:Yeah,
Caldari is the best should tanker AND has the best regen
Minmatar has the second. That always was like this and I don't know why it would change...
Minmatar have the 5hp/s less shield regen, that's not a lot, but they can have more hp armor, more armor regen, more stamina, more speed, more strafe.
I really don't know how do you see a problem.
And if minmatar must have the best regen in armor and shield (what I find ridiculous), need the hp and the speed.
Haha I find you topic like "I wanna an OP minmatar assault!"
Actually assaults are perfectly balanced (between us) juste the Caldari and the Gallente assault bonus which are a bit underpowered... So for me, any change needed.
Ho and if you wanna have a good minmatar :
2 complex shield
2 complex eneegizers
You have +450hp and 75hp regen/sec..... Nope. 20 shield regen per second is what Amarr assault has and Amarr is suppose to be the absolute worst shield tanking suit possible. And do you see an other assault which has a less shield regen? Nop So 1. Caldari 2. Minmatar 3. Amarr and gallente Done.
6 second delay for 25 shield regen per second and max of 552 shields compared to 24 armor reps per sec no delay+740+ armor. Shields don't look too hot.
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1170
|
Posted - 2014.11.28 15:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:6 second delay for 25 shield regen per second and max of 552 shields compared to 24 armor reps per sec no delay+740+ armor. Shields don't look too hot. Again, the Minmatar Assault is not a pure shield, nor pure regen suit. It has the capacity to fit fast better regenerative armour than the Caldari while fitting an overall comparable buffer in both shields and armour, simultaneously having superior biotics. Yes, its regen is slower than Caldari, but it is not what you think it is. The regen is perfectly reasonable, even when employed as a hit and run suit. Fact of the matter is that the MinAslt is an incredibly flexible platform: you can fit an incredibly effective regen tanker with energisers, regulators and repper; or you can make a brick tanker comparable to the other races with less of the downsides associated with any particular tanking style. The Minmatar Assault's regenerative capabilities are perfectly reasonable considering its place within the realm of all racial Assault suits.
You fail to convince me every time. Let's change the subject, from MinAss to shields. 6 second delay for 25 shield regen per second and max of 552 shields compared to 24 armor reps per sec no delay+740+ armor. Shields don't look too hot.
Since when was it ok for armor to out rep shields?
Chocolate Juice
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Sir Dukey
Murphys-Law
General Tso's Alliance
1175
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Posted - 2014.11.28 19:11:00 -
[12] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Sir Dukey wrote:You fail to convince me every time. Let's change the subject, from MinAss to shields. 6 second delay for 25 shield regen per second and max of 552 shields compared to 24 armor reps per sec no delay+740+ armor. Shields don't look too hot.
Since when was it ok for armor to out rep shields? And you fail to provide a convincing argument every time. And your regen arguments are somewhat disingenuous: while shields have a lower buffer, that is part of DUST, while they can also fit regenerative modules. That 25 HP/s can be brought up to 69 HP/s with the same number of modules as the armour user has. Similarly, fitting those two Energisers still allows for a 408 shield buffer. The difference between those two is the time it takes to reach max health: Armour: 24/s from 0 -> 740 takes 30.8 seconds Shields: 69/s from 0 -> 408 takes 5.9 seconds plus the 9.2 seconds for the delay (not including any regulators) for a total of 15.1 seconds. The difference is that the shield user is returning to full capacity in half of the time. And we have not included any Regulator modules, two complex of which would bring that total down to 11.3 seconds for 0 -> 408 shields. That is roughly half of the tank buffer with a third of the time spent regenerating. Shields can apply a far greater regenerative capability than armour. The difference is that shields do not operate in the same way as armour does: if you fit the above six modules (2 Cx Extenders, 2 Cx Energisers and 2 Cx Regulators), your MinAslt has a far greater capacity to take damage and recover it than the GalAslt (with 3 Cx Plates and 2 Cx Reppers.) That is your regenerative capability.
Nope. You just transformed your min assault from a Assault to a scout. Nice.
The only buff I want to see right now is taking away one second from delay and 5hp more per regen and I would be happy.
Chocolate Juice
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