DUST Search - Apex: The Elephant In The Closet ... Nerfs

Clone D wrote:

I am using the term gear to encompass modules, equipment, grenades, weapons and dropsuits.

Hypothetical instance: if I were to purchase the 'Renegade' Commando, and then due to the heated AV vs Vehicles debate, the swarm launchers are rebalanced in hotfix Echo, resulting in a 50 HP dmg nerf per missile, then I may be disappointed in my purchase, due to the nerf, and decide to abandon using the Apex dropsuit in exchange for my own AV build.

My point is that people value different aspects about gear. Maybe one person likes their RE damage. Maybe another likes their triage capabilities. If that aspect about the suit that they bought changes, then they may lose the value of the original purchase, rendering the suit useless to them, because they will build another more favorable fitting.

Not having the ability to swap out dropsuit slot items is the thorn of owning Apex dropsuits. The Apex owner is at the mercy of CCP rebalances. That is one caveat of the inflexibility of Apex.


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Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4913	Posted - 2014.11.18 16:27:00 - [1] - Quote Clone D wrote: When you commit to an Apex build, you are committing to all of the concomitant gear. What happens when CCP nerfs the gear that you spent $29 on (or grind 100 FW battles for)? The suit may be rendered completely useless due to the diminution of one critical feature. "Completely useless" you say? The modules on these suits are very 'core gameplay'; shield extenders, armor plates, damage modules. Some of these things may be balanced one day, but made "completely useless"... I highly doubt that. Can you postulate on how a module (which, by the way, if a module is nerfed and that destroys the entire dropsuit that is a pretty massive nerf) might be nerfed that would make the entire fitting useless? Let's try to stay within the realm of possibility please. None of "THEY COULD MAKE ARMOR PLATES GIVE HALF THE HP AND TRIPLE THE MOVEMENT PENALTY!" Clone D wrote: Thoughts? Is Apex over priced? Money wise? No. $29 for an unlimited proto/standard dropsuit is fine. 100k LP + 10mil ISK is insanity. 50k LP and 10mil ISK I could stomach, I wouldn't LOVE it, but that is at least tolerable. My advice to you, playa...
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4913	Posted - 2014.11.18 16:54:00 - [2] - Quote Clone D wrote: I am using the term gear to encompass modules, equipment, grenades, weapons and dropsuits. Hypothetical instance: if I were to purchase the 'Renegade' Commando, and then due to the heated AV vs Vehicles debate, the swarm launchers are rebalanced in hotfix Echo, resulting in a 50 HP dmg nerf per missile, then I may be disappointed in my purchase, due to the nerf, and decide to abandon using the Apex dropsuit in exchange for my own AV build. My point is that people value different aspects about gear. Maybe one person likes their RE damage. Maybe another likes their triage capabilities. If that aspect about the suit that they bought changes, then they may lose the value of the original purchase, rendering the suit useless to them, because they will build another more favorable fitting. Not having the ability to swap out dropsuit slot items is the thorn of owning Apex dropsuits. The Apex owner is at the mercy of CCP rebalances. That is one caveat of the inflexibility of Apex. When you purchased the APEX dropsuit you should know that the fitting is set in stone. You signed up for whatever nerfs or buffs your fitting would be given. The 50 damage reduction to swarm launchers' missiles doesn't make the fitting "completely useless". If the nerf was done in an effort to balance the game then the player should adapt to the changes. Sometimes weapons, modules, or equipment overperforms its role or performs roles it was not intended to perform. Then nerfs/buffs happen. CCP doesn't have to make amends to you for balancing the game for everyone. This thread is starting to sound like a stealth nerf-whine. My advice to you, playa...
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4916	Posted - 2014.11.18 17:10:00 - [3] - Quote Clone D wrote: It's always been clear that you don't like me, but there's no need for insults. I don't feel one way or another about you. Your threads walk the line between trolling and nonsensical. Clone D wrote: One person might like their Apex gear as a mere collector's item. Another might want Apex for the utility of the fitting. The utility could possibly change for better or for worse, due to rebalances. If the utility changes for the worse, the hard work grinding, or money spent purchasing the suit may be wasted, as the suit is put aside, perhaps never to be equipped again. The time/money spent on the APEX dropsuit isn't wasted. It is in the same boat as literally every other player using the weapon/ dropsuit/ modules that was nerfed. In your earlier hypothetical situation, with the swarm launchers' missiles, would effect everyone would fits a swarm launcher. Supposing I bought 500 proto swarms pre-nerf. "All that time into earning that ISK for those swarms in wasted!"... no... the weapon was nerfed for a reason. If CCP pulls data a month or two from now and the swarm is severely underperforming then they will adjust it accordingly. The only leg you can stand on is if a piece of equipment had it's functionality completely changed. E.g. nanohives now only restock sidearm ammo and grenades or swarm launchers now fire a semi-intelligent missile that only targets infantry or ScR being only allowed 100% charge up shots. Then I might be able to see where you are coming from. But number tweaks? No. My advice to you, playa...
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4917	Posted - 2014.11.18 17:26:00 - [4] - Quote Clone D wrote: The difference is that on a non Apex suit, the owner can merely say, 'oh what a useless turd this piece of gear is now. I think I'll swap it out with something more relevant.' With an Apex suit, the owner is simply stuck with it. This inflexibility affects the intrinsic value of the suit, especially in an environment as dynamic as Dust, with the recently increased cadence for hotfixes. That is the nature of these dropsuits: proto type dropsuits fitted with standard modules that you may not edit. That is how these dropsuits were sold and we were never promised that they would be editable or that gear stats are not subject to change. So what happens when CCP nerfs something in an APEX fitting? If the nerf was too much you can post about on the forums. Rattati obsessively reads the forums so it will get looked at. Chances are the nerf was needed and you just need to toughen up buttercup. My advice to you, playa...
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4923	Posted - 2014.11.18 21:51:00 - [5] - Quote Clone D wrote: In other words, buying inflexible Apex suits is much much riskier than buying a modifiable BPO dropsuit. And that is the risk you take when you buy an uneditable proto dropsuit. One day something might change and you can't alter your APEX fit. This is a non-issue for players who know ahead of time that the fitting can't be edited. My advice to you, playa...