Recent updates have left me feeling somewhat jaded and overall concerned for the future of dust as well.

Loyalty ranks and Market sales while overall good ideas, seem to be designed in such a manner that they say **** you to anyone who isn't willing to dump money on the game. Yes I understand that you're not really 'losing' on anything with them being present as opposed to not existing.

Changes seem to cater to whoever can shout the loudest on the forums about something rather than actual in-depth analysis what is or isn't functioning with something, and why or why not it would need to be changed. Eg. Dropships, Nanite injectors, RR's, scouts and small missiles will very likely be on the chopping block soon.

I'm incredibly bothered by the state of rail rifles and their hipfire (60 to 140 degrees of kick! when any other 'service' rifle has less than 5) to 'balance' their range (if range is such a problem nerf the ****ing range!).

While it is somewhat re-assuring to know that they can patch dust, this recent patch has left me with the gut feeling of 'this was a cash-grab and recanted on a lot of things that shouldn't exist - like respecs'.

I have felt for a while and stated several times I think CCP is preparing itself to be sold.

I don't believe they have the capital or resources to bring Legion to life.

The recent trend to monetizing everything possible like BPO's, respec, customization plans etc is to show a potential buyer they are as profitable as possible.

This scenario makes the most sense for every one involved.

You guys forgot your tin foil hats this morning! Smh. You cry out demanding content and once you get it you claim that they're selling out. I see them making more items for sale with aur and I see them improving their f2p Model. If dust or legion was dead we would not see a shred of a hot fix or a new patch.

Mediocrity is opinIon in this case. I can't stand CoD for its simplicity. PS2 feels pointless. For me, those two would be selling for mediocrity. The quality of this game is opinIon based, not factual.

Why does eve have a ten year plan and dust dOesn't? Because eve was out for ten years before they announced their first ten year plan. I can't thinkof any fpsmmorpg that has a ten year plan or even a five year one. Ccp doesn't have one year plan as I suspect ccp will be releasing legion. When ccp was confronted with fears that dust would die they did announce a one year plan. It wasn't detailed or specific but they had one.

Let's have a look in that SOONGäó-LONGTERM ROADMAP document.

...

or in other words: don't expect an answer, at least not an honest one.

I don't understand why they are afraid to trust their fans. Yes, the industry is competitive, yes you might be behind in technology, but you don't do yourselves any favors with gag orders and secret development plans. CCP should know better than anyone that they can sell a vision and a dream and all we need is occasional roadmap updates... If you don't tell us Legion is "greenlit" then we assume it was redlit. Then what?

Point is, threads like these aren't going to cause them to come out and tell you just because of loosely sourced extrapolations. Speculate all you want, but we'll get Legion. And it'll be great. Just because you aren't getting the information you want, doesn't mean that what you want isn't coming.

Who do we hold accountable? Are you the CEO of CCP? They aren't forcing you to play their game, so I suppose that only leaves you to hold yourself accountable.

Actually, if you guys go over to the Feedback/Suggestions Forum, you'll see that they're working on the Commandos and Logis next in the hotfixes. And as was said previously, before they add more content they need to balance what is here. Obviously Logis and Commandos aren't balanced quite right, that's why CPM is taking input on it now for CCP.

Before CCP can add more content that you're searching for and so very impatient for, they need to balance what is here. I understand that you're upset because we weren't delivered what was promised when it was said to be. But every game goes through this. Everything gets pushed back. Release dates, etc.

I don't know that we'll get Legion for a 100% fact. But being that Rouge and Rattati JUST said they have a team working on it in Shanghai RIGHT now, means that they're still putting money into it which means that they're working on bringing it to us. So sit, down, play DUST, 'have a coke and a smile and shut the **** up' :) the last quote was from Eddie Murphy but eh, I'm all about references ;)

Aeon,

I understand the points you are making and it is a valid and interesting discussion. So do others.

You will also noticed I bowed out of the thread instead of beating my head against the wall trying to fix stupid.

The people that get it, get it. Don't worry about those that are not savable.

It's a triage situation in here.

Until you hear EVE Developers talking about Dust/Legion, there's nothing there. They're the gatekeepers (to resources in and out of Game, Roadmaps and Planning) Not whomever is tasked with making the mechanics of a FPS component (or 0g FlightSim component).

Obviously Dust was to be released alongside/shortly after a successful Incarna component in EVE.Obviously Carbon failed both Dust and EVE (as well as WoD). If those had worked (even a little bit) we might have a different state of affairs.

Beyond OBs there's never been a discussion of shared platforms coming from EVE devs.

I think like a lot of us I saw simple and obvious places for the 2 games to interact: PI.

It would have been simple (conecptually) to have made Dust/Legion maps and assets that used the PI concepts in EVE to produce sockets in Dust that then overlay on their trumpeted procedurally generated terrain. There were only like 16-24 'buildings' that EVE players could place on planets. More than we have in Dust as sockets now, but not many more.

The problems arise when you consider that EVE devs would have to introduce a mechanic into EVE that took something from EVE players. There's never been any EVE devs (of those left) that have spoken on Dust/Legion let alone advocating deeper interaction between the games.

Its pretty clear once you consider mounting direct competition (Elite, Star Citizen) and the last year's worth of messaging from CCP that they intend to make the Legion and Valkyrie components a part of the EVE client, if they can, before those competitors are fully in place.

But until you hear EVE Devs talking about how they want their players interacting (winning *and* losing) with players in another game, there won't be any.

It's CCP's game. Not yours. If you're not satisfied with content they're releasing now, nothing will be good for you. You want your candy and you want it now. Jump up and down harder, hold your breath and bite your arm. Because it'll be here when it's ready. Not when you want it. :)

Maybe if I get you a bottle, you'll be happier, eh?

Can I get one too, I prefer rum, any kind is good.

Also Aeon, the fact that you're still asking the hard questions after months of silence is remarkable. However I doubt the community can see past these short term goals anymore. Most of the people who cared either moved on or stopped.

Except we've not seen any PvE FPS gameplay at all in either Dust or Legion. I've seen screen shots and renders, but nothing more (please link if anyone has video.)
Consider this thread: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2175598#post2175598
and that it's been locked. (not moved to 'Legion Discussions' assuming it was 'off topic')
how's that for dialogue?

Aeon,

I didn't vote for CPM. Maybe I should have. Keep up the fight.

I think that answer is "yes" Aeon. I don't think any company, any person, with a good conscious says "we're listening to the fans" and then won't drop a single word on the apparent resource vampire sucking away our franchise's hope at a future.

Frankly, I'd think that CCP has let go quite a substantial number of Shanghai's employees. Right after FanFest, they claimed to be at 60 developers, so y'know 50 at max by this point. Despite some vigorous discussion in this area, my gut feeling is that the amount of resources sunk into 1.9 is about the extent of CCP Shanghai's past exertions on other Uprising 1.X variants. I don't get the impression that the material, no matter how much of it was already half complete, was done by anything less than the majority of their devs.

Altogether? Legion is probably iced, at best in hypersleep. Meanwhile CCP do as much as they can to wring revenue out of Dust, long term be-damned. This isn't a negative, I completely understand the need to make as much money as you can on your product, but as people have mentioned in this thread the changes that have been made really don't help the game's longevity. They'll keep on talking about mid-term and short-term plans for the game, and fulfilling some of them, just to keep the servers alive and to try to recoup some of the game's sunk costs.

Unless CCP tell us otherwise, they're not working on Legion. This silence is just another typical round of betrayal of their fan base by CCP. I would say that it breaks my trust and loyalty, but those have been long spent up on my account. Maybe they'll start working on Legion again when and if Valkyrie releases and replenishes their coffers and their investors' confidence.

We're sorry for surprising you with Legion. We promise to keep you, our loyal fans, informed on our progress with Legion...as soon as it is greenlit.

- Aeon Amadi The pessimist sees a dying IP (legion and dust combined) and a company trying to recoup whatever losses they can before scrapping the whole thing once it's no longer paying for it's own maintenance.

- The optimist gets a new patch, which was previously said not to be possible, and sees new life and actual investment into what was a dead-end game with no new content planned. They believe that further development is not only possible, but actually in the pipeline.


I think I'm in the middle. My best guess (which is worth as much as anyone else not working for CCP, which is to say, not a whole heck of a lot) is that Legion has not been canned, it's either on the back-burner due to more pressing issues with EvE development, or is on track but not fully greenlit for various reasons:

Think about it this way. You are CCP. Your big splash into the console market (really, any market that is not EvE) crashed and burned. You probably lost a lot of money; if not outright, at the very least revenue you planned on having when making your budget for upcoming years is gone. You make the hard but probably financially sound decision to scrap it and start over, but completely and utterly botch it, creating a PR disaster and angry fan base.

What's your next move? Job one is to un-alienate the fan base. Continue to **** them off and you may as well not bother making Legion to begin with. Easiest way to do that is to make cost-effective changes to Dust that improve our playing experience.

Job 2 is to right the ship and try to keep yourself from being a one-hit wonder and develop a successful second game. One thing you don't want to do is repeat past mistakes by over-promising or releasing a fundamentally broken product. Think about it: If Legion fails like Dust did, it's over. Nobody, whether they be players, investors, or upper management, is going to give them a third chance. So you have to get it right on day 1:

- Don't hype or release an unfinished game
- Don't promise ANYTHING that is not already implemented and tested
- Don't get yourself into an eternal nerf/buff cycle

How does Dust fit in? For one, it helps fund it. Thus the push to sell aurum. Two, since they run on the same engine, by far the easiest way to test your new assets is to have the Dust playerbase break them. You may or may not be happy with being a glorified playtester, but some people are probably fine with that if it means new toys in Dust and successful development of Legion.

________________________________________________________________________________________________

It really comes down to perception. If you are very suspicious of CCP, which is not unreasonable, this is dishonest, plain and simple: A cash grab and they are using whatever nearly-finished content they already had to create the illusion of continued development and will shut it down once they've squeezed every cent out of us. Caveat emptor, I guess. On the flip side, there are plenty of legitimate reasons for them to be doing things the way they are doing them.

Easy if legion dies, more time and efford for dust, what i actually prefering more boyo