DUST Search - **** the needle changes.

Baal Omniscient wrote:

MINA Longstrike wrote:

Joel II X wrote:

If you're complaining about how you can only get people up if they ask to do so, then screw you.

If not, then I have no idea what you're talking about.

That's exactly what I'm pissed about. Yes, bad needles happen, this change is once again the wrong way to go about it - 1) a 'death' shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated, 2) warpoints for a revive should require the target to stay alive a minimum amount of time.

Arbitrarily preventing people from using a piece of equipment designed to sustain pressure and save suits and clones is idiotic.

Furthermore, people cant make a request to be picked up if they get off the screen too quickly or an area is too flooded with equipment. This is an idiotic change all because KDR people whined long and hard.

If we were to do this your way, then you would have to add the anti-boosting bits too. So it would be:

1) A 'death' shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated.
2) A "kill" shouldn't be counted unless the clone is terminated.
3) War Points for a revive should require the target to stay alive a minimum amount of time.
4) War Points for a kill shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated.

And even then, you should still be able to opt out (as opposed to the "opting in" for the revive approach currently deployed). Getting revived should still be the ultimate decision of the player dealing with a situation, and at a minimum an easy access suicide button should always be at the ready to help block trolls.


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MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1524	Posted - 2014.11.04 13:50:00 - [1] - Quote Who honestly thought caving to people who got a 'bad needle' once or twice was a good idea? These needle changes are completely moronic. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1524	Posted - 2014.11.04 14:06:00 - [2] - Quote Joel II X wrote: If you're complaining about how you can only get people up if they ask to do so, then screw you. If not, then I have no idea what you're talking about. That's exactly what I'm pissed about. Yes, bad needles happen, this change is once again the wrong way to go about it - 1) a 'death' shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated, 2) warpoints for a revive should require the target to stay alive a minimum amount of time. Arbitrarily preventing people from using a piece of equipment designed to sustain pressure and save suits and clones is idiotic. Furthermore, people cant make a request to be picked up if they get off the screen too quickly or an area is too flooded with equipment. This is an idiotic change all because KDR people whined long and hard. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1524	Posted - 2014.11.04 14:07:00 - [3] - Quote Awesome Pantaloons wrote: It's my body and only I decide what happens to it. No. It's the teams clone and if someone has a needle they should always have the chance to pick you up. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1526	Posted - 2014.11.04 14:18:00 - [4] - Quote postapo wastelander wrote: MINA Longstrike wrote: Who honestly thought caving to people who got a 'bad needle' once or twice was a good idea? These needle changes are completely moronic. Honeslty i like new needle change, mercs will finaly have chance to be resucted safely without possibility of crossfire around. Why ever fit 50-100% needles if you are only allowed to use them 'out of combat' or on people who are expected to already know what you have fit? That's kind of the point of higher tier needles - the ability to use them in combat, even in high-crossfire situations. Even low tier needles give you a chance if an enemy has to say reload or a person body-blocks some shots for you. I mean I already know you're not the sharpest tool in the shed, but why carry around a piece of equipment when one isn't even able to actually use it the majority of the time? I have never, ever gotten upset at a bad needle for two reasons 1) the clone isn't mine it's the teams and 2) as suit value goes up needles are inherently more valuable and the effort of attempting to save or be saved by someone is much more appreciable. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1529	Posted - 2014.11.04 14:53:00 - [5] - Quote SagaB wrote: Wouldn't this stop teamkill needlespam in fw? You can't get rezzed without pressing help right? That's not as big of a problem as it's made out to be honestly. Also in real life EMT's don't need your permission to save your life if you're unable to speak, why should logi's? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1529	Posted - 2014.11.04 14:58:00 - [6] - Quote ^** happens, minor inconveniences are not a good reason to change positive, functioning mechanics into things that are overall negative and non-functioning. Not hitting the 'help' button is the exact same thing as denying a revive, and I run 50-80% needles on a lot of fits. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1534	Posted - 2014.11.04 16:05:00 - [7] - Quote SOME IDIOT wrote: It wasnt minor it was abused big time It was minor, and it was explained what is wrong with the new mechanics above. You're kind of **ing dumb aren't you? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1538	Posted - 2014.11.04 17:16:00 - [8] - Quote Sergeant Sazu wrote: I love this thread. "I'm right, everything is about me. If it wasn't a problem for me, it wasn't a problem for anyone. Anyone who disagrees is stupid. Also, real life comparisons are valid." Nice logic, MINA. Protip: flaming people and demonstrating self-centered thinking reduces credibility. Even if you're right, I'm not inclined to see your point with that attitude of yours. It's just how debates work. "I'm going to disregard all the points you've made, call you self centered and then claim you're wrong even if you're right because I don't like that you feel this treats the symptom not the problem". You sure are good at debating yourself. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1538	Posted - 2014.11.04 17:31:00 - [9] - Quote Kaze Eyrou wrote: MINA Longstrike wrote: SagaB wrote: Wouldn't this stop teamkill needlespam in fw? You can't get rezzed without pressing help right? That's not as big of a problem as it's made out to be honestly. Also in real life EMT's don't need your permission to save your life if you're unable to speak, why should logi's? EMT's in real life are also not knocking you unconscious with a hailstorm of bullets after reviving you either. Try again. Logi's don't do that in dust either. Unless you're talking about facwar which means you're referring to a niche problem and it means that the symptom is being treated not the problem. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1540	Posted - 2014.11.04 19:10:00 - [10] - Quote Riruodo wrote: Awesome Pantaloons wrote: I get revived by dumbass needle-fishers OFTEN. Not once or twice, not even ten times. I can safely say that over my long Dust career, no fewer than one hundred deaths can be attributed to some stab-happy fuckwit. Screw your warpoints, I want to die! It's my body and only I decide what happens to it. See, this is why I hate running as a logi. People get mad at me if I don't revive them and they're sitting in the middle of a firefight and I'm having to take out that pesky scout with a shotgun... and then other times they get mad at me when I DO revive them and a sniper or something takes them out. So I revive them again because they are super close to getting to cover. And then they send me hatemail telling me I'm a stupid b**. So I'm like ok, I won't revive you. And spend the rest of the match watching little needle icons blink back and forth. So it goes both ways and I'll be happy to watch your clone be terminated. I think I'm just going to remove all equipment from all of my characters for the next few weeks. Any time I need something I'm just going to turn around and walk back to the supply depot in my redline. If there isn't one, or it's been blown up I'm just going to afk the rest of the match. If I see a friendly nanohive I'll stand on it and throw grenades till it runs out. People within this game are so antagonistic towards anyone actually trying to be of assistance that its prettymuch a situation where I'm ready to throw my hands up in the air. It's astonishingly and truly frightening the amount of people are seriously missing the problem and the point here, because 'hurf durf KDR' & 'one time I got revived and it was awful' Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.

MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1541	Posted - 2014.11.04 20:40:00 - [11] - Quote Sigberct Amni wrote: All my many hours laughing and needle destroying your K/DR... culminated in this thread full of amazing tears. God bless pubbies and God bless CCP. Why are you dismissing legitimate valid complaints as tears? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1560	Posted - 2014.11.06 07:06:00 - [12] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: MINA Longstrike wrote: Joel II X wrote: If you're complaining about how you can only get people up if they ask to do so, then screw you. If not, then I have no idea what you're talking about. That's exactly what I'm pissed about. Yes, bad needles happen, this change is once again the wrong way to go about it - 1) a 'death' shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated, 2) warpoints for a revive should require the target to stay alive a minimum amount of time. Arbitrarily preventing people from using a piece of equipment designed to sustain pressure and save suits and clones is idiotic. Furthermore, people cant make a request to be picked up if they get off the screen too quickly or an area is too flooded with equipment. This is an idiotic change all because KDR people whined long and hard. If we were to do this your way, then you would have to add the anti-boosting bits too. So it would be: 1) A 'death' shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated. 2) A "kill" shouldn't be counted unless the clone is terminated. 3) War Points for a revive should require the target to stay alive a minimum amount of time. 4) War Points for a kill shouldn't be counted until the clone is terminated. And even then, you should still be able to opt out (as opposed to the "opting in" for the revive approach currently deployed). Getting revived should still be the ultimate decision of the player dealing with a situation, and at a minimum an easy access suicide button should always be at the ready to help block trolls. You're right, I missed a few 'anti-boosting' points. This is exactly how the system should be. The only nitpick I have is that you should still get points for attempting to revive someone who ends up not accepting it anyways, because hey, you did actually stick them with the needle. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1561	Posted - 2014.11.06 08:18:00 - [13] - Quote ^Not even sure where about 3/4 of that is coming from. What I'm saying is that they took a system that for the most part worked - it wasn't perfect, it needed some improvements, but it worked - and it was thrown out the window to largely cater to people who whined about KDR. Now speaking as someone with some programming experience you do not ever throw away something that works, unless it is so screwed up it needs a complete rethink/redesign from the ground up and even then you try to preserve as much of the original as possible, ie. you don't ever, ever break functionality if you cannot help it. Yes I've spouted some vitriol about these changes, however being angry about something doesn't mean the arguments I've made do not have any merit, that's attacking a characteristic of the person making the argument not disproving the argument itself. And If anything parkour, I'm prejudiced against people in general. Misanthropy is a thing. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1561	Posted - 2014.11.06 09:16:00 - [14] - Quote PARKOUR PRACTIONER wrote: I take extreme offensive to attacks verbal or otherwise of autistics people whether there aware they have autism and what it means or not. Im getting help with it but as you can see its a work in progress. I looked that ** up im more of cynical myself. I have autism but also anti-social and have little faith in the human race. Is it spectrum autism? Like Asperger's? I'm sorry if you felt that I was attacking you. It's one thing to be frustrated about game mechanics or to express anger over someone's behaviour (in short, my issues with various CPM are with them alone) but another completely to attack a person over whatever disorders they might have - I myself suffer from an anger disorder and fall within the 10% lifetime persistence group and an ongoing struggle with chronic depression (13+ years now), both diagnosed professionally but with limited treatment success. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.