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Stevez Wingyip
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
So I downloaded Dust having played EvE for countless years. I make a minmatar because they are my favourite race.
I have a look at the market and want to use the Heavy Machine Gun. Fortunately enough, there was 5 sets of the AUR version of the Golem HMG or something to try out. I loved it.
As a new player, we are put into matches of others players of equal skill and equipment. So everyone was using very similar gear except the few that had purchased AUR.
With my 5 free sets of gear, I managed to obtain 64 kills. In an equal footing ground.
So after a few really good games, I get put into the "real public" matches. And we get completely stomped over and over and over.
Weapons of prototype level and officer equipment that my standard militia gear and level 1 sets just cannot stand up against. People who I normally would have been able to kill, now, not even being able to reduce shield. Getting beat over and over and over by people who just have more stats.
I am not the best player in the world, but I am not terrible either. I did very well when there was equal gear and equal skill and to instantly be thrown into this where I am being killed by scouts that I cannot see and one shot me, scouts that have MORE shields and armour than I do as a heavy is VERY FRUSTRATING.
It seems that I will just have to watch my 91 - 14 KDR fall apart while I try and skill to to gear that can even just withstand the massive stat difference. While I will do that, I don't know many that would.
Please note, this is not a rant. This is a general post that is just explaining my experience. |
Cheydinhal Guard
Abandoned Privilege Top Men.
238
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
K/D holds no merit anyway. Just give it time, you'll get better.
Be the mercenary of tomorrow, today. Go beyond with Aurum!
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Protocake JR
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
1483
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hopefully, if Legion goes through, CCP will omit the bonuses that the Core Skill tree give... I think that might be a big part of the problem. It's just creates another barrier between newbies and vets. Lvl 5 armor and shields (and Lvl 5 plates and extenders) is the standard, without it, you're at a permanent disadvantage.
Rather than empowering the player, these core skills serve as a necessary time consuming requirement. It's the same as giving new players -25% stats while veterans get to play with normal stats. |
Powerh8er
The Rainbow Effect
501
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
If your gonna play as a newb heavy. I have this advice: Become paranoid schizofrenic, because invisible scouts, they know where you are! |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound
579
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 13:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
I can say that it gets better
I have 52 mil SP now and still play in militia gear. Once you get those core skills up to snuff, it becomes more about skill than gear.
That's not to say that gear doesn't help, it does, but it's not the deciding factor some people make it out to be. I have many matches that i come out on top on my side running militia gear. I also have matches that I run proto gear and get my ass handed to me. |
Stupid Blueberry
Wirykomi Wolf Pack
530
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 13:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
Try to stay in Skirmish, there's less proto there. Queuing up Dom as a newbie is the equivalent of going to catch in your noob ship.
Chillin, waitin on Legion.
Ishukone loyalist, Caldari Scout enthusiast!
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Bright Steel
Horizons' Edge Proficiency V.
174
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 13:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Only at to survive is to be in a squad. This gives some protection against scouts and evens the odds against heavies.
Other Han that... Welcome to the grind
The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
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Stevez Wingyip
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
2
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:53:00 -
[8] - Quote
Thanks for all the replies folks :) I have played the game before and I do have a decent about of knowledge. The main purpose for this post was to inform others of the frustrating experience that is probably sending so many new players away. :( |
Operative 1125 Lokaas
True Companion Planetary Requisitions
538
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Posted - 2014.10.27 13:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
Stevez Wingyip wrote:So I downloaded Dust having played EvE for countless years. I make a minmatar because they are my favourite race.
I have a look at the market and want to use the Heavy Machine Gun. Fortunately enough, there was 5 sets of the AUR version of the Golem HMG or something to try out. I loved it.
As a new player, we are put into matches of others players of equal skill and equipment. So everyone was using very similar gear except the few that had purchased AUR.
With my 5 free sets of gear, I managed to obtain 64 kills. In an equal footing ground.
So after a few really good games, I get put into the "real public" matches. And we get completely stomped over and over and over.
Weapons of prototype level and officer equipment that my standard militia gear and level 1 sets just cannot stand up against. People who I normally would have been able to kill, now, not even being able to reduce shield. Getting beat over and over and over by people who just have more stats.
I am not the best player in the world, but I am not terrible either. I did very well when there was equal gear and equal skill and to instantly be thrown into this where I am being killed by scouts that I cannot see and one shot me, scouts that have MORE shields and armour than I do as a heavy is VERY FRUSTRATING.
It seems that I will just have to watch my 91 - 14 KDR fall apart while I try and skill to to gear that can even just withstand the massive stat difference. While I will do that, I don't know many that would.
Please note, this is not a rant. This is a general post that is just explaining my experience.
You just restated everything that people have been saying that is wrong with is game for the past year. This is why CCP is dumping this game and developing Legion.
Between matchmaking, cloaked scouts, heavy suit spam and vehicles being continually nerfed in favor of strong AV I'm getting close to saying eff it. It has become even more of a dumbed down arena rumble console kiddie game.
The new World of Warcraft expansion is about to be out anyway. Will most likely be spending time on that. I don't measure my c*ck by what games I play. I play games worth playing. DUST has been the exception.
THIS IS THE VOICE OF RÁN
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Kevall Longstride
DUST University Ivy League
1894
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 14:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Stevez Wingyip wrote:Thanks for all the replies folks :) I have played the game before and I do have a decent about of knowledge. The main purpose for this post was to inform others of the frustrating experience that is probably sending so many new players away. :(
CPM 1 member
CEO of DUST University
Vist dustcpm.com
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Bax Zanith
Sinfonia1898
200
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:09:00 -
[11] - Quote
Dust 514 is vary much like Eve Online; harsh and unforgiving. As a new player, it is your job to pad the KDrs of vet players everywhere. Sorry to say, but that's the NPE in a nutshell, it will be like that for a while too. The only way you can have a shot at winning is if you only put skill points into core dropsuit skills, specifically the skills that affect your dropsuits all together. Once those are all at level five, pick a drop suit, a weapon, possibly equipment, and build the skills for all that up to level five. Only then will you have a chance.
Oh, and when you get access to advanced level gear, us it and no matter what don't use anything lower, Militia and standard gear will only get you killed.
They didn't die from the cold without
They died from the cold within.
- James Patrick Kinney
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Luk Manag
of Terror TRE GAFFEL
545
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
This game is hard on new players. I suggest squad-finder until you're ready to solo.
Despite what others say, having a skill tree that has an actual benefit is a necessary component. If you want people to keep playing, and keep spending money, there needs to be some non-cosmetic advantages. The average Dust player plays a lot of hours every single week, and CCP will want to keep it that way. Cosmetic enhancements are nice, but it is essential to reward advancement in an MMO.
I have pretty much only played Dust for the last couple years, and after the first few months of maxing out my first role, it can't get any better. The only advantage to playing more is unlocking additional roles. I can't make my Caldari Assault any better, but I can add in a Scout role and max it out.
In a very short few weeks you should be able to reach mid-tired suits and equipment. Advanced armor plates, repairers, suits, and HMG. I also suggest forge sniping. You can be competitive without max skills.
There are some beastly Minmatar Heavies. They focus on speed, reps and Kin Cats and they never hold still. If you see one on your team, try following him around.
There will be bullets. ACR+SMG [CEO of Terror]
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Stevez Wingyip
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
2
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
I have a 40m SP vet. I made this new character to play with a few friends and it has literally been one of the most frustrating gaming experiences I have ever experienced. |
Jack Boost
Zarena Family
473
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 14:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
There is little trap with playing at beginning like heavy.
RAW HP MEANS NOTHING IN THIS GAME.
Get fast as you can scout. - build in eficient ewar - buged dmg when you fast move.
You will die - but only when you make clear mistake to engage target. At heavy.... everything make you mad and more hp makes you feel longer your rage...
Not much time left...
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Lloyd Orfay
Commando Perkone Caldari State
112
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
I always excel in a game when I have the right equipment, and in this game I estimate it would need to be a year for me to get the right equipment.
Pretty much Dust's gear setting follows a hierarchial system, which is the worst system to use in any game as it always sets it so that players not above the hierarchial system underperform.
It also has to be worse for you where we don't have semicompetent people changing the game, so there are extreme mistakes where everyone is forced to use a team and some don't, like scouts. Scout players especially don't play to play, more like to ruin people's time with their antisocial exploitation. I could bet you only a quarter of a quarter of players here use scout suits simply to exploit their ****** up stats to help teams and teams only
Of all things you chose to use also, was a very nightmarish class. Heavies are overpowered, but being a heavy is extremely stressful. There are a lot of illogical, or impractical stuff in the game like active scanners that could provide very asymmetric advantages to other players that the heavy suits can't gain immunity or protection from, which can make scenarios nightmarish. It comes from the fact that heavy suits are a combination of pure killing power and pure defense, which neither aspect is easy to balance or practical, so what happens is that because they cannot sacrifice pre defense or pure killing power they lack all the features that REALLY matter (like helping teams by providing spawns, ammunition or so, immunity from at least one something that can help them, etc)
People that can't achieve greatness without exploitation don't deserve to exist. Enroll in scout erradication today.
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4724
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:37:00 -
[16] - Quote
I would like you to join Immortal Guides. We are a training Corp dedicated to helping new players get through the teething pains of getting into DUST. However, I will not be offended if you choose to go with DUST University instead.
I often run a fit that uses a Standard Level Sentinel suit with a Militia HMG (the same gun you are using) and I kill plenty of prototype suits. The difference between us is skill points, tactics, and experience, as I doubt that I am all that much better than you as a player. We can help you with the tactics, and make gaining experience a little more fun/less painful. Skill points will come with time, but I can help you allocate those early skill points to get maximum effect out of them.
Here is my HMG Sentinel guide.
Good hunting.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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saxonmish
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
603
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Posted - 2014.10.27 14:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
Watch my youtube video's :)
Link is below :P
SAXON ON A MISH - My Youtube Channel :)
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MINA Longstrike
Kirjuun Heiian
1449
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 14:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Stevez Wingyip wrote:So I downloaded Dust having played EvE for countless years. I make a minmatar because they are my favourite race.
I have a look at the market and want to use the Heavy Machine Gun. Fortunately enough, there was 5 sets of the AUR version of the Golem HMG or something to try out. I loved it.
As a new player, we are put into matches of others players of equal skill and equipment. So everyone was using very similar gear except the few that had purchased AUR.
With my 5 free sets of gear, I managed to obtain 64 kills. In an equal footing ground.
So after a few really good games, I get put into the "real public" matches. And we get completely stomped over and over and over.
Weapons of prototype level and officer equipment that my standard militia gear and level 1 sets just cannot stand up against. People who I normally would have been able to kill, now, not even being able to reduce shield. Getting beat over and over and over by people who just have more stats.
I am not the best player in the world, but I am not terrible either. I did very well when there was equal gear and equal skill and to instantly be thrown into this where I am being killed by scouts that I cannot see and one shot me, scouts that have MORE shields and armour than I do as a heavy is VERY FRUSTRATING.
It seems that I will just have to watch my 91 - 14 KDR fall apart while I try and skill to to gear that can even just withstand the massive stat difference. While I will do that, I don't know many that would.
Please note, this is not a rant. This is a general post that is just explaining my experience.
Much like in eve, it's the people playing dust who make the experience terrible, not the imbalances in and of themselves. There is a lot of very strong metagame elements to dust and it causes some stuff like scouts (currently ~50% or more of all suits bought are scout suits) to be wildly overpowering to players who don't know how to deal with them.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.
I have a few alts.
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Vesta Opalus
Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment.
107
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 15:32:00 -
[19] - Quote
I really wish they had an option to play only with Std gear or less, or only Adv gear or less.
Meta of the game gets really ******** at prototype because HP stacking gets way out of hand. |
Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
2243
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 15:33:00 -
[20] - Quote
Bax Zanith wrote:Dust 514 is vary much like Eve Online; harsh and unforgiving. As a new player, it is your job to pad the KDrs of vet players everywhere. Sorry to say, but that's the NPE in a nutshell, it will be like that for a while too. The only way you can have a shot at winning is if you only put skill points into core dropsuit skills, specifically the skills that affect your dropsuits all together. Once those are all at level five, pick a drop suit, a weapon, possibly equipment, and build the skills for all that up to level five. Only then will you have a chance.
Oh, and when you get access to advanced level gear, us it and no matter what don't use anything lower, Militia and standard gear will only get you killed. I've been having fun in my Dragonfly Assault suit and STD rail rifle. I definitely see why it could use a nerf.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star. EoN.
2243
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 15:42:00 -
[21] - Quote
Vesta Opalus wrote:I really wish they had an option to play only with Std gear or less, or only Adv gear or less.
Meta of the game gets really ******** at prototype because HP stacking gets way out of hand. No, infantry wouldn't allow it.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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MINA Longstrike
Kirjuun Heiian
1450
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 15:43:00 -
[22] - Quote
Vesta Opalus wrote:I really wish they had an option to play only with Std gear or less, or only Adv gear or less.
Meta of the game gets really ******** at prototype because HP stacking gets way out of hand.
Honestly, it's not even about gear, it's about knowledge. I could make a new character right now and go into the battle academy and I'd probably come out with a score of something like 60 or 70k to 1-3d, using just a scrambler pistol. The 'metagame' is a major factor in ones ability to be successful in dust.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.
I have a few alts.
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Son-Of A-Gun
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
1351
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Posted - 2014.10.27 17:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
I've play as a newb 5 different times now on 5 different characters.
1) Knowing the level design and how to stay alive in a real battle is THE most important deciding factor in Dust. End of story.
2) the second most important deciding factor in Dust (and very key to early newb success) is knowing how to skill your character properly to ensure success. Knowing what's important to skill early and what can wait.
My newest character "Mr Demeaner" (if you want to look up his stats) whom I haven't played in a many months, has a 1.41 KDR with 454 kills, 321 deaths and lifetime war points of 53802. When I first got out of the academy and in to "real" public matches I was I was stunned by how well I was doing in comparison to the rest of my team mates. I was getting really good KDRs per match - like I remeber one was 17/10 and another one was in the twenties but I don't remember the deaths on that one. And like I said, this was just several games out of the academy. Of course I was dying quite a bit more than I am used to, but I was still really kickin ass.
Now, based on my experiences (that's now 5 times as a newb) I whole heartedly reject the idea that this game favors gear and leveling over personl skill and good choices.
This is a very complex game with very large maps to fight on. It's going to take you some time to learn. Until then YOU ARE GOING TO SUCK. My advice to you is to seek a good corp, willing to show you the ropes, as quickly as possible - especially when it comes to proper skilling. Get with a good group of people who know the maps, like the backs of their hands, and Stick to the like glue.
{:)}{3GÇó>
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Meisterjager Jagermeister
Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire
453
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Posted - 2014.11.02 02:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
Stick with it S.W., and have fun; it gets better. Roll with the Ds, study what the other players are doing and learn all the maps as you go. In time you will flip that KDR around again. The frustrations however, they never go away. They just morph into new ones.
AKA - StarVenger
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Vesta Opalus
Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment.
132
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Posted - 2014.11.02 17:38:00 -
[25] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:Vesta Opalus wrote:I really wish they had an option to play only with Std gear or less, or only Adv gear or less.
Meta of the game gets really ******** at prototype because HP stacking gets way out of hand. Honestly, it's not even about gear, it's about knowledge. I could make a new character right now and go into the battle academy and I'd probably come out with a score of something like 60 or 70k to 1-3d, using just a scrambler pistol. The 'metagame' is a major factor in ones ability to be successful in dust.
HP on proto suits can reach 1k+ on prototype suits, and the damage does not keep up with the hp inflation. This results in people having to sit there doing the lame strafe dancing **** to kill each other, which I think is not fun at all, maybe other people disagree ;\
Im not talking about gear vs. knowledge vs. skill, etc. What Im talking about is I think the game is just fundamentally less fun when everyone is using proto suits and stacking a shitload of hp. |
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