If you are a suck pilot.

Lvl 5 Minmando, 2 complex DMG mods, Wiyrkomi Swarm Launcher (prof 3 or 4)

I generally find that most sensible pilots have got the **** out of dodge before i can get the 3rd volley off... and outside of militia DS most ADS I see can tank 3 volleys easily.

ADS can still hit that afterburner, increase altitude and outrun swarms.

Reserved.

The only issue with swarms now is the damage profile of swarms. The minus 15-20% damage to shields means that vs gunnlogi and pythons ads damage is far too minimal, proficiency is worthless and the ads or hav has plenty of time to escape. I bet that for every 10 armour tanking vehicle I only take 1 gunnlogi and never a python (min com 5, 2 complex damage mods, prof 4 swarms, rapid reload 4 using wiyrkomis) perhaps alter damage profile to neutral and change proficiency to a simple flat out damage increase or perhaps +15m to lock range

reserved

awaiting some sort of fancy comment

Please , don't give these scrubs any more ammo then they need , there crying about a weapon that has a less then 200 m range and a 2 to 3 second lock on time ... that's more then enough time to escape and they have the most maneuverability of all vehicles with the best escape as well .

If they sit around long enough to get swarmed then they deserve all that they get .

These were the same ones who talked crap about HAV users , until they were hit themselves and now it's " Oh , woe is me " .

They would fly around instablapping anything and anyone in their path .

I bet the next time anything that comes up about vehicles , they will watch what they say because it effects them as well , not just tankers or LAV drivers .

I told them , anything that they do to tankers will have an effect on them as well but they didn't listen and look at them now .

These are some of the main people who talked crap about tankers and now they see what they didn't at the time .

Instead of talking crap , come with solutions that will help and not handicap the role or else , you might be next .

Your not just pilots , your vehicle users .

Nevermind, wrong post

[i will probably retire from the posting

I cant remember that I have ever been brought down by a swarm launcher after the lock on was cut down to almost melee range despite the fact that I get hit by them quite often

and I am a casual player at heart.

what does it tell us about the OP

Quick question... Every time you guys 'do the maths' do you include the weak points? Because sometimes I notice a severe difference in damage from these things and I'm guessing it's because the balance is based on shooting the front end not the back half.

Maybe we should remove the weak points and see how that changes things, although that would suck for us forgers, so if there's a way to just stop the swarms dealing that extra damage (if you can't miss what's the problem with the damage only ever hitting it's intended amount?)

Lets forget about "balance" for a minute. For those that know me, I am as hard core of a Caldari loyalist as there can be. I only skill up Caldari tech and only use Caldari tech (except for flux grenades). I have every Caldari suit, weapon, and vehicle at proto (except for Cal heavy and forge, which are at adv), and I HATE the mechanics of the swarm launcher. It is a weapon that aims for you and requires no skill other than situational awareness.

Something needs to be done but I'm not sure what yet. However, I do like the idea of swarm with faster speed, more damage, bigger clip/ammo, increased range and lockon time, but a greatly increased turn radius. And when I say bigger turn radius, I mean big enough to where we swarmers would have to lead a moving target and us pilots could have a chance to dodge shots if we see them coming.

Thoughts?

I find swarms fine from a Pilot and AV point of view.

The reason I find it fine is that im actually worried about fighting a swarmer. Before id kill them with little trouble, but now I actually have to think about what im doing, like how to escape if I miss a shot, potential escape routes, and the likelihood of them coming back to the same spot with more AV'ers. I like that. Makes killing them as satisfying as it is with a Forger.

When im AV'ing, ive noticed the only ADS pilots ive killed are the bad ones. The ones who underestimate the threat of swarms, especially. I also find it hilarious how many pilots fly into a group of swarmers still expecting it to be a good idea. I did that just after Delta and dropped like a stone. So I adjusted my technique, and ive been fine ever since. Only ADS I lose regularly now are in PC. Or if im playing drunk.

Only adjustment id like to be seen made to the swarms is for you to actually track the moving vehicle. Though not necessary, would remove the no skill argument.