DUST Search - [IWASWRONG] Scout hitbox is not the problem

CommanderBolt wrote:

I-Shayz-I wrote:

After playing Destiny for a while I realized how fast the acceleration to top speed is from one direction to another in Dust.

In destiny, your strafe speed is always the same no matter what suit, but you can upgrade your strafe acceleration (how fast you can change direction) by sacrificing either armour or recovery for agility.

Low agility makes it feel like you have to slow down to a stop before you can change direction, while high agility feels exactly like Dust.

I can agree to a tradeoff somehow as long as it works in the game sense. Like I have spoke about before, I am just very worried about killing speed tanking and good movement. I dont want to feel like a brick tanked heavy suit when using my light untanked speed stacked scout suit. As it is I already have next to no hit points, having more tradeoffs has to be done right.

I will watch these kinds of talks with some caution, however putting my bias to one side, I do see why it might be something we need to discuss.


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Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3193	Posted - 2014.09.26 11:55:00 - [1] - Quote Now I know it is not the problem with hit detection. Their small hitbox exacerbates the issue which becomes most notable and creates a "false positive." It is a core mechanical issue that makes "leading your target" irrelevant. I have replicated the effect with both a calsent and amsent, and have been doing so for months without realizing it. This has only become wildly obvious with the latest nerf to HAV infantry killing capacity. Compared to an HAV Main Turret, the forge sentinel has an equivalent hitbox and movement profile to a scout under a heavy machinegun on a sentinel. The situation is very different but the effect is identical. Phase 1: engagement. Sentinel or scout engages in CQC. HAV/sentinel respond with fire, tracking the target with difficulty. Phase 2: relative speed allows the sentinel or scout to dictate the pace of engagement in CQC even though in theory they should be dogmeat engaging that close. Scout strafe reaches apex when the target manages to start landing hits. Phase 3: sentinel/scout change of direction requires 1 second for human reflexes to respond. At this point it is too late. At one-second intervals the sentinel/scout change direction, causing the slower target's aim to continually move in the opposite direction of movement creating what the ignorant call "gun game". It allows the target to avooid taking any significant fire while merrily dancing through active fire. Phase 4: slow target dies after inflicting minimal damage at best. Smaller target wins a stacked engagement that SHOULD be in the victim's favor. The culprit: inertia calculation. You see it in dropships, LAVs, and HAVs. When they stop moving or chang direction they keep moving, slow down, come to a stop THEN change their direction of travel. The weight x momentum equation is not there for dropsuits. All of the suits move at different rates, but they all chang direction instantly. There is no deceleration, no brief pause where they stop, nor acceleration. In effect all dropsuits change direction instantly with no loss of momentum. It is less noticable on sentinels because they are slow, have a huge hitbox and are easy to hit. They are the broadside of the barn. But to an HAV turret, the sentinel may as well be that scout in CQC merrily ignoring the incoming fire. The problem isn't the calscout or any other scout. Rattati was right. The hitboxes are fine. It is the core movement mechanics that are breaking the ability to hit and lead a target.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3203	Posted - 2014.09.26 15:06:00 - [2] - Quote Bump for visibility. I'm not letting this go.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3237	Posted - 2014.09.27 06:39:00 - [3] - Quote He is absolutely correct. Simply chamging the speeds is a bandaid tbat doesn't address the actual problem.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3266	Posted - 2014.09.28 17:29:00 - [4] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: After playing Destiny for a while I realized how fast the acceleration to top speed is from one direction to another in Dust. In destiny, your strafe speed is always the same no matter what suit, but you can upgrade your strafe acceleration (how fast you can change direction) by sacrificing either armour or recovery for agility. Low agility makes it feel like you have to slow down to a stop before you can change direction, while high agility feels exactly like Dust. I can agree to a tradeoff somehow as long as it works in the game sense. Like I have spoke about before, I am just very worried about killing speed tanking and good movement. I dont want to feel like a brick tanked heavy suit when using my light untanked speed stacked scout suit. As it is I already have next to no hit points, having more tradeoffs has to be done right. I will watch these kinds of talks with some caution, however putting my bias to one side, I do see why it might be something we need to discuss. I think the ability to sneak up and murder people is a good compromise. This would kill scoutssault suits.