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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2686
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Posted - 2014.09.09 10:15:00 -
[1] - Quote
As much as I loathe admitting this, once splash is removed from the standard and breach forge guns they are likely to be dropped utterly to the back burner by most forge gunners. This is not a call to cancel, but plan to adjust for the change in echo.
At this point the assault forge will have all of the advantages and only one major comparative drawback, the inability to hold a charge and one minor, which is the unstable reticle.
Standard and Breach forge guns are already used as primary sniper weapons by heavies too lazy to SP into sniper rifles and commandos. This change will see most forge sentiels simply swap to the assault forge.
As it stands the Assault Forge gun:
Hits harder than a standard forge gun
Has higher DPS than the Breach Forge Gun
Largest splash radius (and most damaging)
Identical range.
Higher efficacy vs infantry and LAVs.
Higher overall efficacy against dropships. (They can charge fast enough for killshot chances)
Higher efficacy vs. Tanks (faster fire rate, excellent damage)
Drawbacks:
Inability to hold a charge. I don't know a single dedicated forge gunner who thinks this drawback is enough to cramp their style.
Shaky reticle: creates margin for error. You can miss shots because of this, but there are ways to adjust to the problem and minimize the impact.
I have some very specific ideas on how to adjust in the wake of the splash nerf but I would like to hear the thoughts of others and constructive ideas to adjust because in my opinion the intended changes (which do not bother me) will relegate the standard forge to "oversize sniper rifle."
I consider this to be a problem, not one that is critical to the game as a whole, but I also consider it to be an opportunity. While in the past I have objected to this in the past, the removal of splash from standard and breach should probably come with a buff to the standard forges in AV, while reducing the AV capacity of the assault forge gun vs. AV in favor of antipersonnel and LAV killing (with shorter ranges) duty if it will retain splash.
As I said I have very specific ideas on how, but would appreciate feedback from other gunners and vehicle users that is more constructive than ideas to entirely nerf the gun line.
If the devs would like to weigh in their thoughts here I would appreciate their input. I know GM Archduke is a forge gunner, and he might have some insight along this slant. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2688
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Posted - 2014.09.09 11:59:00 -
[2] - Quote
My thought is that if splash is removed it means that the railgun is intended to be a hypervelocity kinetic slug heated by friction in a manner similar to incendiary heat penetration rounds used in modern machineguns on a larger scale. It's basically how an APDS does damage. Only from a railgun at mach 5.
The keeping of an explosive blast would indicate a explosive charge involved. But realisticallyif this is a thing the forge line needs to be adjusted.
One forge gun to rule them all seems like bad ground to tread. I already only bother with the standard and breach when I feel like being lazy and blapping people from 200m.
Not very often. I prefer to tear ass in close. My favorite range to tackle tanks is 20m with the AFG |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2699
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Posted - 2014.09.10 02:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:The only thing we wanted was to increase the risk to rooftop forgegunners blapping the console. This scenario:
line up perfectly, back away, hold the charge, walk 3 steps, release, charge another, if shot, retreat back, regain full health.
Timing this with an Assault Forge is more difficult.
The other changes mentioned here are all fine, and something we can keep tweaking over time.
Breach, high alpha, low ROF and DPS, maybe longer range, no movement
Standard, your normal DPS and range, medium alpha, medium range, primarily AV and heavy-counter
Assault, high dps, low alpha, lower range, splash
Oh no, that was intuitively understood as the intent from the word "go." The change to splash isn't one I believe is a problem at all. I'm just thinking: unintended side-effects. Planned change good, just pointing out the issues I forsee cropping up.
Hell there's probably more. I'm not psychic. Thanks for the response. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2706
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Posted - 2014.09.10 11:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
How much leeway is there to change a weapon? Do they pretty much have to function the same way or can they be changed up to do other things when you're talking about variants?
I have ideas, I don't want to bother with something if it's not going to be something that can be approved for use anyway. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2710
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Posted - 2014.09.10 17:48:00 -
[5] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:If anything you should have left the splash on the breach...
If someone gets hit with the splash from that, they're going to get chance to run away. But leaving it on the fast firing variant is just asking for the pew-pewing of objectives to stay.
actually the standard versions were better for that. Easier to blap with. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2710
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 19:48:00 -
[6] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Derpty Derp wrote:If anything you should have left the splash on the breach...
If someone gets hit with the splash from that, they're going to get chance to run away. But leaving it on the fast firing variant is just asking for the pew-pewing of objectives to stay. actually the standard versions were better for that. Easier to blap with. I'd argue that the standard version was easier to direct hit with, while the assault was better at killing via continues splash damage... Meanwhile the Breach has a mega charge time, forces you to stand still and get shot yourself, and only allows aiming with 1 stick. Edit - But really I don't see the point of leaving splash damage on any of them.
I'd trade splash on the assault for more ammo in the magazine and carried. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2720
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Posted - 2014.09.11 16:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Hey kerosini the only forge gun effective at shooting ADS down (without help) ias the assault forge. The barrel never stabilized and the final destination of your shot wobbles like a drunk.
It's the only forge capable of pulling the triple shot needed to pop an ADS and the third shot is where it gets iffy. Everything else fires too slowly to kill anything but a thundering idiot. Even tanks usually escape. Its why most forge gunners use the assault to begin with.
Past that teamwork is OP and forge guns should not be nerfed so you can feel safer in your dropship. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
2769
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Posted - 2014.09.13 14:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Mortishai Belmont wrote:Yeah, I'll be using absolutely nothing but my assault variant after delta. A giant ball of energy not having any splash damage (dispersion of displaced energy at the point of combustion) is just a stupid concept. Also, I like to be able to actually defend myself with it when an a**hole comes at me with a shotgun or nova knives.
Also on a side note, shouldn't the forge do bonus Shield damage? You know, swarms are explosive so they do more to armor and stuff... There being only two AV guns in the game.... One for armor maybe one for shield...
The plasma cannon is the shield av.
The forge gun fires the big ball because tank drivers screamed about not being able to see the hugeass fatsuit firing the nickel-iron slug from the railgun. |
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