DUST Search - @CCP Rattati: Galente and Caldari assault bonus

Boot Booter wrote:

Jack 3enimble wrote:

Boot Booter wrote:

No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot.

The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well.

Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead.

Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level

Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level

It has to do with altering the assault stats (Min assault) in Delta, so that people can't bring up the fact up that all assault changes were done in Charlie already. So I'm asking for my stats and the Gal assault (read assault bonus) to be changed in Delta too. This is called thinking ahead of counter arguments.

These two things are completely unrelated and anyone who would use such an argument as to why gallente and Caldari assault bonuses shouldn't be looked at is a complete moron.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 301	Posted - 2014.09.04 15:24:00 - [1] - Quote Rattati, I've seen that the Min assault gets a EHP buff (being discussed). My question to you is: When will the Caldari and Galente assault get a suit bonus that actually makes the racial weapons for those suits perform better than on those weapons other suits? If you look at the Min and Amarr assault you'll see that their weapons on those suits perform far better compared to the same weapons on other suits. IMHO the racial assault bonus is there to make it so that racial weapons perform better on their racial than on any other suit. If you look at the Min and Amarr assault you'll see this is the case, like it should be. Now on the Gal and Cal this racial suit bonus is underperforming when compared to the other assault suits. Right now the RR and AR perform almost the same on the Cal and Gal assault as they perform on any other suit. There has been alot of talk about this and I was thinkin if this could be looked at for Delta too. Here's a link to the thread. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=171650 Thank you in advance
2Berries Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 272	Posted - 2014.09.04 17:42:00 - [2] - Quote Reload speed on cal assault is beast compared to any other suit. Near non-stop suppresive fire at range is a fine bonus. Sure, it's not as sexy as the heat sink on amarr assaults, but don't discount it either. Burning through clones like Rusty Venture.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3053	Posted - 2014.09.04 17:48:00 - [3] - Quote 2Berries wrote: Reload speed on cal assault is beast compared to any other suit. Near non-stop suppresive fire at range is a fine bonus. Sure, it's not as sexy as the heat sink on amarr assaults, but don't discount it either. While that's true, is that not more a role of the Commando for sustained DPS, and less so the Assault? Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1680	Posted - 2014.09.04 18:06:00 - [4] - Quote 2Berries wrote: Reload speed on cal assault is beast compared to any other suit. Near non-stop suppresive fire at range is a fine bonus. Sure, it's not as sexy as the heat sink on amarr assaults, but don't discount it either. Here's the thing. The assault bonuses are about shoring up the weapon's shortcomings to help them apply their DPS. For example, the weakness of scramblers that hinders their DPS is heat. Amarr Assault reduces heat buildup, allowing them to apply more damage before overheat. Combat rifles weakness is ammo capacity, meaning you have to stop for reloads often as the magazine is small relative to the rate of fire. Minmatar Assault gives a magazine size bonus, allowing more rounds to go downrange before a reload. Reload speed on Caldari doesn't help applied DPS that much. The drawback hindering applied dps is Rail Rifle kick. Therefore, the Caldari Assault should reduce kick, allowing more of the Rail Rifle's DPS to be applied, instead of or possibly in addition to the reload bonus. As for Gallente Assault, I can't think of a good bonus for them. Perhaps an increase in range, or a rate of fire bonus. I'm not sure what would be best, but the Plasma Rifle's drawback is it's range, and that can quickly become OP if we give it too much range. Shoot Scout with yes.
Devadander Woodgrain Atari 87	Posted - 2014.09.04 18:23:00 - [5] - Quote I hated cal bonus at first, after sinking sp into reloads I'd hate to lose it now All my cal weaponry is now at least lvl III reload if not V. Talkin bout slappin home a fresh one in less than one second on my RR. "Tossin uplinks and runnin fer my life" ~ Gunny blownapart "Lets group up and push an objective" ~ No blueberry ever
Heimdallr69 Nyain San General Tso's Alliance 3447	Posted - 2014.09.04 18:37:00 - [6] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: 2Berries wrote: Reload speed on cal assault is beast compared to any other suit. Near non-stop suppresive fire at range is a fine bonus. Sure, it's not as sexy as the heat sink on amarr assaults, but don't discount it either. Here's the thing. The assault bonuses are about shoring up the weapon's shortcomings to help them apply their DPS. For example, the weakness of scramblers that hinders their DPS is heat. Amarr Assault reduces heat buildup, allowing them to apply more damage before overheat. Combat rifles weakness is ammo capacity, meaning you have to stop for reloads often as the magazine is small relative to the rate of fire. Minmatar Assault gives a magazine size bonus, allowing more rounds to go downrange before a reload. Reload speed on Caldari doesn't help applied DPS that much. The drawback hindering applied dps is Rail Rifle kick. Therefore, the Caldari Assault should reduce kick, allowing more of the Rail Rifle's DPS to be applied, instead of or possibly in addition to the reload bonus. As for Gallente Assault, I can't think of a good bonus for them. Perhaps an increase in range, or a rate of fire bonus. I'm not sure what would be best, but the Plasma Rifle's drawback is it's range, and that can quickly become OP if we give it too much range. This ^ AR gotta be range, RR gotta be kick. Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3054	Posted - 2014.09.04 18:48:00 - [7] - Quote If anything I'd like the reduction to recoil to make the Magsec more viable. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Boot Booter Pure Evil. 897	Posted - 2014.09.04 19:09:00 - [8] - Quote No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level What happened to the repair tool glow? Why won't CCP answer? Conspiracy?
Heimdallr69 Nyain San General Tso's Alliance 3449	Posted - 2014.09.04 19:14:00 - [9] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level I've been a cal ass since the start of closed beta.. I hate this bonus it's useless and can suck my ass. I like the kick reduction idea though. Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 307	Posted - 2014.09.04 19:49:00 - [10] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level It has to do with altering the assault stats (Min assault) in Delta, so that people can't bring up the fact up that all assault changes were done in Charlie already. So I'm asking for my stats and the Gal assault (read assault bonus) to be changed in Delta too. This is called thinking ahead of counter arguments.

Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 307	Posted - 2014.09.04 19:50:00 - [11] - Quote Heimdallr69 wrote: Boot Booter wrote: No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level I've been a cal ass since the start of closed beta.. I hate this bonus it's useless and can suck my ass. I like the kick reduction idea though. Me too bro, I've seen the bonus get worse every build
Boot Booter Pure Evil. 898	Posted - 2014.09.04 20:13:00 - [12] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Boot Booter wrote: No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level It has to do with altering the assault stats (Min assault) in Delta, so that people can't bring up the fact up that all assault changes were done in Charlie already. So I'm asking for my stats and the Gal assault (read assault bonus) to be changed in Delta too. This is called thinking ahead of counter arguments. These two things are completely unrelated and anyone who would use such an argument as to why gallente and Caldari assault bonuses shouldn't be looked at is a complete moron. What happened to the repair tool glow? Why won't CCP answer? Conspiracy?
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 312	Posted - 2014.09.04 21:05:00 - [13] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: Jack 3enimble wrote: Boot Booter wrote: No stop this nonsense. You can't have bonuses that alter the range vs dps scale that Rattati is working hard to tune. Secondly, yes assaults are about sustaining dps, this is exactly how the minmatar and amarr bonuses work. Third, wtf does the minmatar assault ehp buff have to do with this. Minmatar suits are all getting ehp buffs, the assault is getting +15 total, hardly a lot. The way I see it is Caldari like their reload but I think they should get a bonus to recoil as well. Gallente dispersion bonus is awesome whether you realize it or not. However the kick bonus is worthless for the plasma weapons so I think we should give gallente a reload bonus instead. Gallente - 5% dispersion reduction and 5% reload speed per level Caldari - 5% kick reduction and 5% reload speed per level It has to do with altering the assault stats (Min assault) in Delta, so that people can't bring up the fact up that all assault changes were done in Charlie already. So I'm asking for my stats and the Gal assault (read assault bonus) to be changed in Delta too. This is called thinking ahead of counter arguments. These two things are completely unrelated and anyone who would use such an argument as to why gallente and Caldari assault bonuses shouldn't be looked at is a complete moron. The bonus needs a change. I hope Rattati responds in this thread

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 6670	Posted - 2014.09.05 00:31:00 - [14] - Quote I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 315	Posted - 2014.09.05 00:36:00 - [15] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. I completely understand and I'm happy with your response. I don't want it to be OP, I want the same thing that you're trying to accomplish and that is balance within the roles and classes. I'm glad you agree though.
Zindorak 1.U.P 801	Posted - 2014.09.05 00:51:00 - [16] - Quote Heimdallr69 wrote: This ^ AR gotta be range, RR gotta be kick. Pretty much this is what i think would be best Pokemon master! CCP undo ScP nerf. It hurt my feering very bad
SponkSponkSponk The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 1057	Posted - 2014.09.05 01:09:00 - [17] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. What about Minmatar Assault's missing bonus to anything explosive? Dust/Eve transfers
Michael Arck 5402	Posted - 2014.09.05 02:02:00 - [18] - Quote So we'll come back to this in Echo? I can live with that. The bonus does needs to be changed for the CalAss Archistrategos *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain*
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 404	Posted - 2014.09.05 05:17:00 - [19] - Quote Devadander wrote: I hated cal bonus at first, after sinking sp into reloads I'd hate to lose it now All my cal weaponry is now at least lvl III reload if not V. Talkin bout slappin home a fresh one in less than one second on my RR. ^ This have saved my butt multiple times! (I would also hate to lose it) With that said, I also agree that it's slightly annoying the Commando gets a similar bonus (to all light weapons).
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 536	Posted - 2014.09.05 05:22:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. what good is range when ive got to fight this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpl0vMx8_cU&list=UUj4cCHkz2Q-x2juvDj3wiqg look at that recoil during ads. why would that even be an intended design?

Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1698	Posted - 2014.09.05 05:40:00 - [21] - Quote I vote recoil reduction for Caldari, maybe in addition to reload speed. Shoot Scout with yes.
Scar Scrilla 376	Posted - 2014.09.05 12:25:00 - [22] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. what good is range when ive got to fight this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpl0vMx8_cU&list=UUj4cCHkz2Q-x2juvDj3wiqg look at that recoil during ads. why would that even be an intended design? Sorry, but this video proves nothing but that your skills as a camera man need a giant buff :) "Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses" " ... or grab a shotgun and REs." - UN1TE
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 2550	Posted - 2014.09.05 14:13:00 - [23] - Quote I havent had any problems with RR ADS at all.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 1610	Posted - 2014.09.05 14:20:00 - [24] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. what good is range when ive got to fight this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpl0vMx8_cU&list=UUj4cCHkz2Q-x2juvDj3wiqg look at that recoil during ads. why would that even be an intended design? Recoil increases over time. You cant get that to happen without the unlimited ammo bug.
Paladin Sas Pro Hic Immortalis 401	Posted - 2014.09.06 18:08:00 - [25] - Quote i personally hope the calass keeps the reload bonus. ive never had any problems applying dps at any range with any of the rail weapons (snipers not included). I can, on the other hand vouch for the fact that an insanely fast reload speed has saved me more than a few times from getting overwhelmed by the enemy when they were making a push. gallente bonus could possibly use some rework, but the ability to slam home a fresh mag in under a second on a rail rifle is undervalued in this community. Commandos do great burst DPS, assault is great for sustained damage and holding the line. and for the record, i use the assault RR
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1706	Posted - 2014.09.06 18:29:00 - [26] - Quote If it came down to it, I would prefer the kick reduction over reload on CalAssault. A lot of the time I find shots missing because of kick, even when ADS. If it doesn't die in about 5-7 shots, kick becomes hard to manage. While reload speed is nice at times, I find myself wanting less kick more often than fast reload. Although both would definitely help. Shoot Scout with yes.
Kin Cat Another Clone in the Wall 41	Posted - 2014.09.06 19:11:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. Echo perhaps?
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1254	Posted - 2014.09.06 19:41:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I agree, but not for Delta, it's very crowded as is, we want to get rifle range and dps right first, and I think we are going to get there in Delta, and then find the right assault bonuses for those two to enhance their racial weapons in a good, but not OP way. There is a lot more to rifle balance than DPS and range. If you are going to have a linear progression of DPS and Range then can you add similar idea for things like Recoil/Dispersion/Heat build up? For example...the RR has high recoil and charge time...those things make it more difficult to apply that low end DPS in the weapons optimal. Could you take a look at that area? "Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero Skype: jaysyn.larrisen Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen


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