DUST Search - ISK and Salvage payout formula changes

Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote:

Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

[quote=TYCHUS MAXWELL]I posted my suggestion which I think would actually more accurately give incentive to proper behavior. Essentially make salvage the biggest part of the equation and have it distributed among the team based on whether they won/lost and what their WP rank was on the team.

Basically a more modified version of the current system where it matters far more what is killed then how many were killed along with making afking in a match more likely to leave you with a really bad return on isk, less then people are currently awarded for sure when afking. It also makes ambush not as profitable which should be working as intended since it's the faster game mode.

And lastly, truly good players will make lucrative amounts of isk under this system while others can still learn to break even. It mostly just punishes players that try to go 20/1 in proto gear while fighting nothing but newberries. In other words, chasing off potential new players by curb stomping them.

And I don't even pretend to understand the rare salvage system. It seems utterly random to me because I never get good salvage in good games I have only gotten good salvage in meh games. Seems to me the closer I get to 1.0 k/dr the more likely I am to get good salvage.

On your first point, you are literally pulling a politician move... "Now hold a minute I don't like this term, acceptable behavior, let me talk about it like it was the boogie man as if that was a legitimate concern instead of any real substance." By proper behavior I mean stomping the new players into Dust, pardon the pun, which ultimately led to this games unpopularity and probably influenced how fast the execs pulled the plug on development. But, if you go read my forum topic it doesn't stop people from say using proto gear, it just punishes players for using proto gear to compensate for being a bad player. FPS games never make good RPGs (IE hah I'm level 20 that poor level 10 doesn't stand a chance hahaha!!! I am awesome hahaha!!!) FPS is a genre steeped in good hand eye coordination and quick reflexes. As much as people try to obfuscate that fact by comparing it to Call of Duty, the FPS genre has always been this way even in the Quake days.

As for the actual substance, If you go read my forum topic you will learn I am talking about an isk return of salvage or as I put it loot. Not actual salvage, but an isk return based on a percentage of the price of the salvage. In fact, now reading back I never use the word salvage until we get to talking about rare salvage rates which was the last part of the OPs paragraph. Like I said go read the topic if you are concerned about what I mean by my proposed suggestion it's here:

My Proposal

Tychus... first let me draw your attention to the highlighted text in you post in the second sentence. That sentence set the tone for the rest of your post.

If I misconstrued what you were driving at my apologies, however, surely you can see how someone can make a similar mistake based on the wording in your opening statement. Also...you referenced your proposal but provided no link to it until now...perhaps I'm lazy for not doing a forum search or perhaps you could have posted the link to help clarify things. I will take a look at your post and drop a comment there so thanks for adding it.

Now...as for "pulling a politician move" that's absolutely BS. A politician move is when someone tries to shape player behavior to their own view point of what should or shouldn't happen. You are missing the point that I agree with you that some player behavior hasn't been great for Dust I just don't think that the way you stated in the post in this thread is the way to go necessarily.

You poked me several times about not reading your post and commenting...welll, I read the post in this thread and didn't happened to do a detailed search for your other referenced post. Again, I'll check your link out but don't try to jab folks that are commenting on what you write in a civil manner and basically telling them they didn't do their homework on posts you didn't supply a link to.


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TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 231	Posted - 2014.07.22 05:13:00 - [1] - Quote I posted my suggestion which I think would actually more accurately give incentive to proper behavior. Essentially make salvage the biggest part of the equation and have it distributed among the team based on whether they won/lost and what their WP rank was on the team. Basically a more modified version of the current system where it matters far more what is killed then how many were killed along with making afking in a match more likely to leave you with a really bad return on isk, less then people are currently awarded for sure when afking. It also makes ambush not as profitable which should be working as intended since it's the faster game mode. And lastly, truly good players will make lucrative amounts of isk under this system while others can still learn to break even. It mostly just punishes players that try to go 20/1 in proto gear while fighting nothing but newberries. In other words, chasing off potential new players by curb stomping them.
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 234	Posted - 2014.07.22 08:00:00 - [2] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: I posted my suggestion which I think would actually more accurately give incentive to proper behavior. Essentially make salvage the biggest part of the equation and have it distributed among the team based on whether they won/lost and what their WP rank was on the team. Basically a more modified version of the current system where it matters far more what is killed then how many were killed along with making afking in a match more likely to leave you with a really bad return on isk, less then people are currently awarded for sure when afking. It also makes ambush not as profitable which should be working as intended since it's the faster game mode. And lastly, truly good players will make lucrative amounts of isk under this system while others can still learn to break even. It mostly just punishes players that try to go 20/1 in proto gear while fighting nothing but newberries. In other words, chasing off potential new players by curb stomping them. And I don't even pretend to understand the rare salvage system. It seems utterly random to me because I never get good salvage in good games I have only gotten good salvage in meh games. Seems to me the closer I get to 1.0 k/dr the more likely I am to get good salvage. First...not really sure I think it's a good idea to define "proper behavior" the way you are implying. Anything outside boosting or using exploits / cheats is fair game. I understand where you are coming from but I don't really want this game to have a constraint system based on "oughts and shoulds" that are arbitrarily handed out...even If I may agree with some of them. Second...if I'm reading you right you want a significantly larger share of salvage as the driver for payouts, correct? if so...unless you've got a line that a player market is coming to go along with it that's unfortunately a non-starter. My point is that we all know the player market or cashing in on assets is totally off the table and that makes the model you are describing very dicey at best. On your first point, you are literally pulling a politician move... "Now hold a minute I don't like this term, acceptable behavior, let me talk about it like it was the boogie man as if that was a legitimate concern instead of any real substance." By proper behavior I mean stomping the new players into Dust, pardon the pun, which ultimately led to this games unpopularity and probably influenced how fast the execs pulled the plug on development. But, if you go read my forum topic it doesn't stop people from say using proto gear, it just punishes players for using proto gear to compensate for being a bad player. FPS games never make good RPGs (IE hah I'm level 20 that poor level 10 doesn't stand a chance hahaha!!! I am awesome hahaha!!!) FPS is a genre steeped in good hand eye coordination and quick reflexes. As much as people try to obfuscate that fact by comparing it to Call of Duty, the FPS genre has always been this way even in the Quake days. As for the actual substance, If you go read my forum topic you will learn I am talking about an isk return of salvage or as I put it loot. Not actual salvage, but an isk return based on a percentage of the price of the salvage. In fact, now reading back I never use the word salvage until we get to talking about rare salvage rates which was the last part of the OPs paragraph. Like I said go read the topic if you are concerned about what I mean by my proposed suggestion it's here: My Proposal
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 235	Posted - 2014.07.22 18:15:00 - [3] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: [quote=TYCHUS MAXWELL]I posted my suggestion which I think would actually more accurately give incentive to proper behavior. Essentially make salvage the biggest part of the equation and have it distributed among the team based on whether they won/lost and what their WP rank was on the team. Basically a more modified version of the current system where it matters far more what is killed then how many were killed along with making afking in a match more likely to leave you with a really bad return on isk, less then people are currently awarded for sure when afking. It also makes ambush not as profitable which should be working as intended since it's the faster game mode. And lastly, truly good players will make lucrative amounts of isk under this system while others can still learn to break even. It mostly just punishes players that try to go 20/1 in proto gear while fighting nothing but newberries. In other words, chasing off potential new players by curb stomping them. And I don't even pretend to understand the rare salvage system. It seems utterly random to me because I never get good salvage in good games I have only gotten good salvage in meh games. Seems to me the closer I get to 1.0 k/dr the more likely I am to get good salvage. On your first point, you are literally pulling a politician move... "Now hold a minute I don't like this term, acceptable behavior, let me talk about it like it was the boogie man as if that was a legitimate concern instead of any real substance." By proper behavior I mean stomping the new players into Dust, pardon the pun, which ultimately led to this games unpopularity and probably influenced how fast the execs pulled the plug on development. But, if you go read my forum topic it doesn't stop people from say using proto gear, it just punishes players for using proto gear to compensate for being a bad player. FPS games never make good RPGs (IE hah I'm level 20 that poor level 10 doesn't stand a chance hahaha!!! I am awesome hahaha!!!) FPS is a genre steeped in good hand eye coordination and quick reflexes. As much as people try to obfuscate that fact by comparing it to Call of Duty, the FPS genre has always been this way even in the Quake days. As for the actual substance, If you go read my forum topic you will learn I am talking about an isk return of salvage or as I put it loot. Not actual salvage, but an isk return based on a percentage of the price of the salvage. In fact, now reading back I never use the word salvage until we get to talking about rare salvage rates which was the last part of the OPs paragraph. Like I said go read the topic if you are concerned about what I mean by my proposed suggestion it's here: My Proposal Tychus... first let me draw your attention to the highlighted text in you post in the second sentence. That sentence set the tone for the rest of your post. If I misconstrued what you were driving at my apologies, however, surely you can see how someone can make a similar mistake based on the wording in your opening statement. Also...you referenced your proposal but provided no link to it until now...perhaps I'm lazy for not doing a forum search or perhaps you could have posted the link to help clarify things. I will take a look at your post and drop a comment there so thanks for adding it. Now...as for "pulling a politician move" that's absolutely BS. A politician move is when someone tries to shape player behavior to their own view point of what should or shouldn't happen. You are missing the point that I agree with you that some player behavior hasn't been great for Dust I just don't think that the way you stated in the post in this thread is the way to go necessarily. You poked me several times about not reading your post and commenting...welll, I read the post in this thread and didn't happened to do a detailed search for your other referenced post. Again, I'll check your link out but don't try to jab folks that are commenting on what you write in a civil manner and basically telling them they didn't do their homework on posts you didn't supply a link to. Sorry I missed that salvage lol, yeah I just meant the value of the salvage not actual salvage. That has always been a bad idea to me unless it's smart salvage (IE it only gives you usable salvage.) But since it's completely random I'm also in the camp that we should have a buyback button. It's the biggest reason I don't play FW, because I get too many random proto suits I will never use. Sorry I didn't mean to be on the attack so much, it just happens a lot on these forums that someone hooks into one sentence and ignores the rest and it's frustrating when you're trying to suggest improvements. IE you can post a detailed explanation on say how to improve suits and they will go: "Well I like my suit everything's fine your suggestions are bad!" Etc. Etc. without actually explaining why they feel justified.