DUST Search - Why Don't Caldari Get the Bonus to Swarms?

Mobius Kaethis wrote:

CHANCEtheChAn wrote:

Mobius Kaethis wrote:

Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus.

It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix.

Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps?

This has been talked about since the beginning of DUST

I think the main reason they were Caldari originally is because they did armor damage and most most of everything was Caldari and Gallente back then

Honestly it should just be changed to be a Minmatar weapon like it should always have been

Really? Look at the design. It is clearly a Caldari weapon.

Plus think about the EvE universe. Missile weapons and hybrid rails are what Caldari are bonused towards. Minmatar, while being able to use missiles and having a few ships with missile bonuses, are primarily projectile using ships.

In Dust this same balance could be achieved by giving Minmatar the non-missile explosives and giving Caldari the missile ones. This is already true with vehicles. Caldari DS and Tanks recieve bonuses to using missiels. Before you say it I do realize that there are no Minmatar vehicles in the game but in Legion when they do show up I expect that they will have bonuses towards vehicle based projectile weapons, not missiles.

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Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1527	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:18:00 - [1] - Quote Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? Fun > Realism
CHANCEtheChAn 0uter.Heaven 557	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:33:00 - [2] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? This has been talked about since the beginning of DUST I think the main reason they were Caldari originally is because they did armor damage and most most of everything was Caldari and Gallente back then Honestly it should just be changed to be a Minmatar weapon like it should always have been Closed Beta Vet/ Chromosome and Corp battle Vet/ Uprising 1.0-Now PC vet Ex D.F. Director Current Inner.Hell Director
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1527	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:39:00 - [3] - Quote CHANCEtheChAn wrote: Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? This has been talked about since the beginning of DUST I think the main reason they were Caldari originally is because they did armor damage and most most of everything was Caldari and Gallente back then Honestly it should just be changed to be a Minmatar weapon like it should always have been Really? Look at the design. It is clearly a Caldari weapon. Plus think about the EvE universe. Missile weapons and hybrid rails are what Caldari are bonused towards. Minmatar, while being able to use missiles and having a few ships with missile bonuses, are primarily projectile using ships. In Dust this same balance could be achieved by giving Minmatar the non-missile explosives and giving Caldari the missile ones. This is already true with vehicles. Caldari DS and Tanks recieve bonuses to using missiels. Before you say it I do realize that there are no Minmatar vehicles in the game but in Legion when they do show up I expect that they will have bonuses towards vehicle based projectile weapons, not missiles. Fun > Realism
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10741	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:41:00 - [4] - Quote We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. -HAND
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1527	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:44:00 - [5] - Quote Atiim wrote: We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. That is an excellent point. Not only would it spread the light AV out more evenly among the commandos but it wouldn't be unreasonable given that the lore supports both the races using missiles. The only commando without a light AV weapon is Amarr, a fact that sadly will not be fixed until we get Legion. No client side updates Fun > Realism
CHANCEtheChAn 0uter.Heaven 557	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:55:00 - [6] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: CHANCEtheChAn wrote: Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? This has been talked about since the beginning of DUST I think the main reason they were Caldari originally is because they did armor damage and most most of everything was Caldari and Gallente back then Honestly it should just be changed to be a Minmatar weapon like it should always have been Really? Look at the design. It is clearly a Caldari weapon. Plus think about the EvE universe. Missile weapons and hybrid rails are what Caldari are bonused towards. Minmatar, while being able to use missiles and having a few ships with missile bonuses, are primarily projectile using ships. In Dust this same balance could be achieved by giving Minmatar the non-missile explosives and giving Caldari the missile ones. This is already true with vehicles. Caldari DS and Tanks recieve bonuses to using missiels. Before you say it I do realize that there are no Minmatar vehicles in the game but in Legion when they do show up I expect that they will have bonuses towards vehicle based projectile weapons, not missiles. Oh yeah I forgot Caldari gets missle damage bonuses EvE wise Then if its the case than most definitely the swarm launcher should be switched to missle damage, because they are after all, small homing missiles I think because back in closed beta they were dumbfire missiles so they were more explosive than actual missiles And because damage enhancements for certain weapon types weren't enforced until Commando damage/reload bonuses came out, no one really bothered to change it +1 petition to change accepted Closed Beta Vet/ Chromosome and Corp battle Vet/ Uprising 1.0-Now PC vet Ex D.F. Director Current Inner.Hell Director
Defy Gravity 458	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:57:00 - [7] - Quote Actually missile tech was originally minmatar and caldari stole it from them and used it as their own & improved it Pokey Dravon for CPM1 :D
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1527	Posted - 2014.07.20 16:00:00 - [8] - Quote Defy Gravity wrote: Actually missile tech was originally minmatar and caldari stole it from them and used it as their own & improved it I'll take that as a vote for both commandos getting a bonus to them. Fun > Realism
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3651	Posted - 2014.07.20 17:32:00 - [9] - Quote Thats a critical one. Commandos allready get a decent reload bonus to them and adding a damage bonus could flip the whole av-vehicle balance upside down.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2439	Posted - 2014.07.20 19:17:00 - [10] - Quote If they ultimately stick with the damage bonuses for Commandos, I'd like to see them switch over to +% to Caldari Weapons rather than dealing with the damage types. Unfortunately when you have 5 damage types but only 4 races, someone is going to get a better deal. It makes more sense to make it tied to the race of the weapon rather than the damage type. Like my ideas? Pokey Dravon for CPM1

Fizzer94 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2982	Posted - 2014.07.20 21:05:00 - [11] - Quote Defy Gravity wrote: Actually missile tech was originally minmatar and caldari stole it from them and used it as their own & improved it I'm pretty sure the Amarr invented everything first. They were an Interstellar Empire before the other races even escaped their atmosphere. My best match on Dust, 23/6/4 Placon. Please unnerf ScPs and fix IoPs...
Harpyja Legio DXIV 2123	Posted - 2014.07.20 21:17:00 - [12] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Atiim wrote: We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. That is an excellent point. Not only would it spread the light AV out more evenly among the commandos but it wouldn't be unreasonable given that the lore supports both the races using missiles. The only commando without a light AV weapon is Amarr, a fact that sadly will not be fixed until we get Legion. No client side updates Well in that case Amarr commando should also receive the bonus. Because Khanid use Amarr hulls and combine them with missile technology. "By His light, and His will"- The Scriptures, 12:32
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 12043	Posted - 2014.07.20 21:37:00 - [13] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? Assume the Min Commando is the Talwar of Matari dropsuits..... but you make a very solid point.... no reason both suits cannot have that..... or all suits of the commando persuasion cannot have that. To my knowledge all races barring the Gallente have ships that actively make use of Missiles. "Your Faith stands as a shield for the Faithful, and you are one of His Angels." - Soren Tyrhannos to Templar Ouryon
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10762	Posted - 2014.07.21 00:03:00 - [14] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Well in that case Amarr commando should also receive the bonus. Because Khanid use Amarr hulls and combine them with missile technology. Sure. The more players with ready access to AV, the better. Once a ScRub, always a sCRub. -HAND
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1535	Posted - 2014.07.21 14:17:00 - [15] - Quote CCP I am bumping this idea because I really don't want it to just get ignored. Please take a look and consider implementing it in hotfix Delta. Fun > Realism
RendonaSix Techs Laboratory 109	Posted - 2014.07.21 15:03:00 - [16] - Quote Why don't all commandos get an explosives buff?. "For those who have seen the light, repentance you shall find, for within the heart of battle, scum you shall grind"
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 6629	Posted - 2014.07.21 16:42:00 - [17] - Quote CHANCEtheChAn wrote: This has been talked about since the beginning of DUST I think the main reason they were Caldari originally is because they did armor damage and most most of everything was Caldari and Gallente back then Honestly it should just be changed to be a Minmatar weapon like it should always have been Get out see you space cowboy...
Atiim Commando Perkone Caldari State 10799	Posted - 2014.07.21 18:24:00 - [18] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Get out Well if your an AVer or Pilot, everything still is Caldari and Gallente. Once a ScRub, always a sCRub. -HAND
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1619	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:05:00 - [19] - Quote Atiim wrote: We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. Or, even better, the breach MD could get 100% efficacy on vehicles so that it becomes a viable AV weapon...just saying. "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 231	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:15:00 - [20] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Mobius Kaethis wrote: Currntly swarms are tagged in the code as an explosive weapon, just like REs and mass drivers. The issue with this is that swarm launchers are a Caldari weapon but the Caldari commando recieves no bonus when using them, the Minmatar commando gets the bonus. It seems like changing the tags associated with the swarm launcher from 'explosive' to 'missile', then changing the Caldari Commando's bonus to affect 'hybrid rail' and 'missile' weapons would be an easy fix. Has this change not happened yet because changing the weapon's tags requires a client side change? If it is handled server side then this change really needs to happen in an upcoming hotfix. Delta perhaps? Assume the Min Commando is the Talwar of Matari dropsuits..... but you make a very solid point.... no reason both suits cannot have that..... or all suits of the commando persuasion cannot have that. To my knowledge all races barring the Gallente have ships that actively make use of Missiles. Which Honestly this would make since metagame wise anyways since it will give all Commandos a bonus to some sort of light AV weapon. Amarr, Caldari, and Minmitar could have a Swarm Launcher bonus while Gallente would have the PLC Bonus.

Atiim Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 10823	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:19:00 - [21] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: Atiim wrote: We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. Or, even better, the breach MD could get 100% efficacy on vehicles so that it becomes a viable AV weapon...just saying. There's no reason why we can't do both. Though seeing HAVs getting demolished by a squad of NK and Breach MD users could give Pilots PTSD. Once a ScRub, always a sCRub. -HAND
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 231	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:28:00 - [22] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: Atiim wrote: We could always give them both a bonus to the Swarm Launcher. That benefits both sides of the coin (CalComs & MinComs), without negative repercussions. Or, even better, the breach MD could get 100% efficacy on vehicles so that it becomes a viable AV weapon...just saying. This seems more reasonable then in the past since the MDs ROF isn't going to make quick work of a HAV. True get multiple HAVs and it could but the same goes for all AV weapons. The primary offender really was everyone carrying packed AVs that caused tanks to be scrap heaps pre 1.7. CCP just went overboard back then with the nerfs. Then again why not carry AV grenades now? Locus are pretty meh and flux are for clearing out equipment more then anything.
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1539	Posted - 2014.07.23 14:54:00 - [23] - Quote TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: I also never understood the point of a not packed av grenade. It's a homing grenade why would you need slightly more AOE for less damage? The non-packed av nades home much better than the packed ones. You can actually watch them lock-on and fly towards their targets. The packed av nades' homing is mild by comparison. Fun > Realism
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Cornballs Get Stonewalled 956	Posted - 2014.07.23 15:23:00 - [24] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Caldari Tanks recieve bonuses to using missiels. When did this happen ? You would think that CCP would have given the infantry refund that should have been in 1.8.
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1541	Posted - 2014.07.23 15:34:00 - [25] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: Mobius Kaethis wrote: Caldari Tanks recieve bonuses to using missiels. When did this happen ? Can't believe I spelled missiles wrong. If they don't get a bonus any more than that is just me being an old fart and remembering the good old days when Cal tanks used to get a missile bonus. Can someone confirm if they do/do not get a bonus so I can change this post to seem less stupid. I have to go to work. Fun > Realism


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