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ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
26
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Posted - 2014.07.16 21:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
Nothing Certain wrote:I support the idea of lowering ADS costs and I would like collision damage to be changed as well. Judge made an excellent video with some good points about swarm speed and the AB. It was a selective video though about one aspect and in the end we need to ask, do more Pythons die to AV'ers or more AV'ers to Pythons. We can remove the factor of player skill by asking Judge, or anyone playing both roles, this question. I am confident that the pilots are winning these engagements the majority of the time. I hear pilots complain about "almost being killed" by AV all the time. AV never complains about "almost" being killed by pilots.
The issue in my opinion is the difference in TTK between the two. Yes, the AV'er often has the first mover advantage but with a TTK approaching 15 seconds for the Python this means that even after being hit the pilot has 7-8 seconds to engage the AV'er and still leave a window for escape. With a 1-2 second TTK for the AV'er, this means the outcome is always in the pilot's hands, he either wins or escapes every time unless he chooses to overstay. So how do we make it so that the TTK is a little more even without tipping the scales entirely the other direction? How do we factor in the ridiculous regen the Python exhibits which negates all previous actions done by an AV'er in a matter of seconds? You cant factor out a players skill. A good forger will take me out a bad one wont, simple so get your skill up not you but anyone complaining about dropships being op. |
ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
26
|
Posted - 2014.07.16 21:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Everything Dies wrote:Remove the ridiculous bonuses to RoF on the ADS' and the problem will be greatly reduced. Thankfully this is a confirmed bug, but since it requires a client side patch to fix, it won't get fixed for some time. Unfortunately many pilots have grown so accustomed to this crutch that they defend it with everything they have. It's honestly just sad to see. I think the bug is just fine, i dont see it getting abused.Without the rof why even make gunner dropships, you have a compromised fit with less hp, why not run 2 dropships with full hp. |
ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
26
|
Posted - 2014.07.17 03:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
Nothing Certain wrote:ACT1ON BASTARD wrote:Nothing Certain wrote:I support the idea of lowering ADS costs and I would like collision damage to be changed as well. Judge made an excellent video with some good points about swarm speed and the AB. It was a selective video though about one aspect and in the end we need to ask, do more Pythons die to AV'ers or more AV'ers to Pythons. We can remove the factor of player skill by asking Judge, or anyone playing both roles, this question. I am confident that the pilots are winning these engagements the majority of the time. I hear pilots complain about "almost being killed" by AV all the time. AV never complains about "almost" being killed by pilots.
The issue in my opinion is the difference in TTK between the two. Yes, the AV'er often has the first mover advantage but with a TTK approaching 15 seconds for the Python this means that even after being hit the pilot has 7-8 seconds to engage the AV'er and still leave a window for escape. With a 1-2 second TTK for the AV'er, this means the outcome is always in the pilot's hands, he either wins or escapes every time unless he chooses to overstay. So how do we make it so that the TTK is a little more even without tipping the scales entirely the other direction? How do we factor in the ridiculous regen the Python exhibits which negates all previous actions done by an AV'er in a matter of seconds? You cant factor out a players skill. A good forger will take me out a bad one wont, simple so get your skill up not you but anyone complaining about dropships being op. I'm not sure you understood my post. If Player A plays using a Python half the time and using AV half the time, in which does he die more often? In which does he kill more often? If money was on the line and they played against themselves would they choose to be a pilot or an AV'er? We have players that do both, so skill isn't the differentiating factor for them. Ofcourse you die more in av than in a dropship otherwise there wouldnt be any dropshippers. A good aver might die 2-3 times but depends. If i were to die that much a match i would be out at least a mil. Dropships are balanced just leave it alone. |
ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
26
|
Posted - 2014.07.17 03:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:ACT1ON BASTARD wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Everything Dies wrote:Remove the ridiculous bonuses to RoF on the ADS' and the problem will be greatly reduced. Thankfully this is a confirmed bug, but since it requires a client side patch to fix, it won't get fixed for some time. Unfortunately many pilots have grown so accustomed to this crutch that they defend it with everything they have. It's honestly just sad to see. I think the bug is just fine, i dont see it getting abused.Without the rof why even make gunner dropships, you have a compromised fit with less hp, why not run 2 dropships with full hp. The difference in HP is about a single hit from some AV, and other AV the difference doesn't even exist. You're going down in the same amount of hits regardless. Also, you only need a single side gunner to abuse the bug, not two. As I've stated countless times, peoples beef is with small turrets having obnoxious fitting requirements. It's just that bads have grown so accustomed to having bugged turrets that it's now a staple of their day to day, and they can't imagine life any other way. When shot down in 3 hits an extra hit is very significant.I rarely see people running gunner dropships even with this bug.There will be even less if you take it away. |
ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
29
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Posted - 2014.07.20 21:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote:It sounds like the removal of stacking ADS turret skills is a bad idea because:
- People dedicate themselves to this. They train with their pilots and gunners every day.
- It's not fair to someone who trained turret skill specifically for this to have their stacking bonuses removed. It should still be better to have turret skill as a gunner than not having any at all.d
Change it if you must, but don't remove it so that people have wasted SP. When you gun especially with missles they fly all over the place. We need that rof. |
ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
31
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Posted - 2014.07.22 08:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
843-Vika wrote:deezy dabest wrote:Nothing Certain wrote:True Adamance wrote:Actually I heard something yesterday that completely revised my opinion on this topic.
Mina Longstrike was discussion ADS with us and said (roughly).....
"The reason they are so fast is that they need to be, otherwise they cannot survive, the reason they choose to run and not to engage is because often times they cannot adapt to the new threat on the fly, pun intended.
Its not that they are too fast its that they can use afterburners too often......"
Which basically now surmises my opinions on the matter. ADS don't need more EHP and they don't need too be slower.
Many are saying to nerf the AB cooldown. I personally don't understand how that fixes the problem but with several people saying it who usually have good opinions, it should be on the table. All that nerfing AB cool down does is leaves the pilot staying away a few more seconds which ultimately nerfs the solo swarm who had assistance before they got bored while the dropship was away. As a dropship pilot I would be a fan of buffing the speed of swarm missles. With the right speed it leaves a pilot with the choice to GTFO or risk it as soon as the first set hits. I say this due to the fact that generally speaking I have several seconds minimum to try to find the person that launched the swarm and kill them or still escape with armor intact. I would also be a fan of rediculously buffing swarm speeds if we had a lock on indicator or atleast swarm users that render more than 50% of the time. I would love to see a speed buff to swarms so they could keep up with the AB speed boosts as well as range that swarms can travel so that ADS cant just fly to roof of map above MCC to hide. This would force ADS pilots to learn evasive moves instead of just camp the map roof. You cant evade swarms without getting behind a wall or outrunning them. With most maps being open there usually isnt much cover so i have no option but to fly the 100 m.
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