DUST Search - Precision to Amarr scout is bad Idea.

Vulpes Dolosus wrote:

Bormir1r wrote:

Sir Dukey wrote:

1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows).

2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields.

3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs

4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them.

5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision

6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else.

7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better.

8.) Trust me, I'm an expert.

Caldari is OP with Precision....It has great Assault capabilities AND it has two great EWAR advantages (Precision and Range). So don't tell people Caldari should stay the same, just because you skilled into the FOTM. That's your fault. And there is a drawback, running plates decreases movement speed and with no shields, it won't be hard to kill Amarr scouts with CR/SMG etc.

And that last statement is a 100% guarantee of why we shouldn't trust you. This better be a troll post lol.

Holy crap ad hominem.

I decided to skill into the Cal scout as soon as I heard it was being released because of several reasons: its bonus, shield regen, and the possibility of pilot suits becoming a reality (I'm a shield vehicle specialist). None of my suits ever went over 350ehp.

Caldari was not OP with precision. It served as a great counter to scout abuse and was kept in check by low ehp and Gal scouts (not to mention that every scout could get under the typical FotM assault Cal scout they uses 2 prec enh).

"One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.

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Sir Dukey G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1031	Posted - 2014.07.16 16:50:00 - [1] - Quote 1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows). 2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields. 3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs 4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them. 5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision 6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else. 7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better. 8.) Trust me, I'm an expert.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 501	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:03:00 - [2] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: 1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows). 2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields. 3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs 4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them. 5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision 6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else. 7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better. 8.) Trust me, I'm an expert. Caldari is OP with Precision....It has great Assault capabilities AND it has two great EWAR advantages (Precision and Range). So don't tell people Caldari should stay the same, just because you skilled into the FOTM. That's your fault. And there is a drawback, running plates decreases movement speed and with no shields, it won't be hard to kill Amarr scouts with CR/SMG etc. And that last statement is a 100% guarantee of why we shouldn't trust you. This better be a troll post lol. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1708	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:05:00 - [3] - Quote Your numbers are wrong (Amarr gets down to 17dB iirc), but you're still correct. The Amarr sacrifices almost nothing to be a good scanner, not to mention can pull redicous ranges if going only precision and range enhancers. Rattati has said multiple times that the goal was to make all the scouts useful, but I don't see how the Amarr scout can be useful if it can't scan scouts. Scouts can already scan every med and heavy easily, so the purpose of a precision bonus should be to scan scouts. Now there's no counter to dampened scouts, which I think will make them more prevalent. I'm not as upset about the Cal changes because of the much better range bonus and damp bonus, but it does undermine the whole reason I went into the suit in the first place.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2935	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:09:00 - [4] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The Amarr sacrifices almost nothing to be a good scanner ... According to the proposed slot layouts, he'll have to run a prototype suit to scan dampened Scouts ... that's a sacrifice. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Kallas Hallytyr Skullbreakers 644	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:12:00 - [5] - Quote 9) Wait, let's ignore game balance all together! Reason for Amarr getting precision: it can fit rage amps to shore up its limited range, but that sacrifices tank. So if it doesn't, it is a slow but effective scout hunter. If it does, it is faster and better able to track but much more vulnerable. Reason for Caldari getting range: it can track high dB targets (heavies and mediums) easily, but needs to sacrifice tank to track low dB targets (scouts and dampened mediums). If it doesn't, it is vulnerable to being jumped by other scouts, like the AmScout. Reason for the changes: it means that they each shore up their weak side (AmScout gets bonuses to high slots through precision/CalScout gets bonuses to low slots through range/dampening) which means any EWar fitted will more likely than not come from their primary tank, or else they will have a powerful but limited tool at their disposal: or they'll have a powerful and flexible tool at the expense of their tank. The new bonuses are good for the health of all Scouts and the game. Alt of Halla Murr.
Clips A'hoy Escrow Removal and Acquisition Dark Taboo 162	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:13:00 - [6] - Quote I'm an Amarr Scout since 1.8 came out and let me tell you something: If I want range I have to give up my low slots. If a Caldari wants Precision they have to give up their high slots. Big whoop. I sometimes fill my bathtub with Jell-o, then I proceed to curl up and pretend I'm a fetus.
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1708	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:16:00 - [7] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: 1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows). 2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields. 3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs 4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them. 5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision 6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else. 7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better. 8.) Trust me, I'm an expert. Caldari is OP with Precision....It has great Assault capabilities AND it has two great EWAR advantages (Precision and Range). So don't tell people Caldari should stay the same, just because you skilled into the FOTM. That's your fault. And there is a drawback, running plates decreases movement speed and with no shields, it won't be hard to kill Amarr scouts with CR/SMG etc. And that last statement is a 100% guarantee of why we shouldn't trust you. This better be a troll post lol. Holy crap ad hominem. I decided to skill into the Cal scout as soon as I heard it was being released because of several reasons: its bonus, shield regen, and the possibility of pilot suits becoming a reality (I'm a shield vehicle specialist). None of my suits ever went over 350ehp. Caldari was not OP with precision. It served as a great counter to scout abuse and was kept in check by low ehp and Gal scouts (not to mention that every scout could get under the typical FotM assault Cal scout they uses 2 prec enh).
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 503	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:36:00 - [8] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The Amarr sacrifices almost nothing to be a good scanner ... According to the proposed slot layouts, he'll have to run a prototype suit to scan dampened Scouts ... that counts as a sacrifice, right? He also gives up shield HP, relying on armor tanking, which again forces that scout to lose movement speed making it easier to kill in some ways. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 504	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:39:00 - [9] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Bormir1r wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: 1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows). 2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields. 3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs 4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them. 5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision 6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else. 7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better. 8.) Trust me, I'm an expert. Caldari is OP with Precision....It has great Assault capabilities AND it has two great EWAR advantages (Precision and Range). So don't tell people Caldari should stay the same, just because you skilled into the FOTM. That's your fault. And there is a drawback, running plates decreases movement speed and with no shields, it won't be hard to kill Amarr scouts with CR/SMG etc. And that last statement is a 100% guarantee of why we shouldn't trust you. This better be a troll post lol. Holy crap ad hominem. I decided to skill into the Cal scout as soon as I heard it was being released because of several reasons: its bonus, shield regen, and the possibility of pilot suits becoming a reality (I'm a shield vehicle specialist). None of my suits ever went over 350ehp. Caldari was not OP with precision. It served as a great counter to scout abuse and was kept in check by low ehp and Gal scouts (not to mention that every scout could get under the typical FotM assault Cal scout they uses 2 prec enh). You're serious right? FOTM Cal Scouts ran 2-4 Prec. Enh...Only gal scouts could get under that stuff without risking viability problems, Min and Amarr scout were completely screwed by this. Cal scouts essentially only allowed Gal scouts to play viably. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Cavani1EE7 The Rainbow Effect Dark Taboo 152	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:54:00 - [10] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: 1.) Amarr scout gives up nothing to fit 2 precision mods (it's tank is in it's lows). 2.) Putting two complex precision mods on a caldari scout made it weak (tank wise) with max of 310 shields. 3.) Caldari scout is better suited for scanning because of 4 highs 4.) Most Caldari scouts I ran into ran 1 complex precision. Caldari scout has to give up tank for precision while Amarr scout doesn't. If Precision goes to Amarr scout, it's gonna be harder to get under because they all will be running two precisions because their is no drawback for them. 5.) There will be no counter to scouts with two complex damps and an ADV cloak because Amarr would only be able to fit two complex precision 6.) Many people specced into Caldari scout for precision and nothing else. 7.) with two complex precision mods currently, amarr scout can get down to 23 Scan DB which is pretty good especailly since there is no draw backs and range would make that 23 DB so much better. 8.) Trust me, I'm an expert. I'm ok with it being dropped on the caldari, but give it to the Amarr would make it OP basically for the first point 1337

Sir Dukey G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1033	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:58:00 - [11] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: The Amarr sacrifices almost nothing to be a good scanner ... According to the proposed slot layouts, he'll have to run a prototype suit to scan dampened Scouts ... that counts as a sacrifice, right? He also gives up shield HP, relying on armor tanking, which again forces that scout to lose movement speed making it easier to kill in some ways. That's like saying if a cal scout uses range amps.. it gives up armor tank... its like saying using hacking mods on a minmatar scout had disadcamtage because it gives up armor tank. Are you in your right mind bro?? Amarr don't shield tank just like minatar don't Armor tank.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2723	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:17:00 - [12] - Quote Cal scouts with range and precision giving up slots aren't the problem. Its sharing their scans with their heavy friends that cause the problem. The only thing I am concerned for about the changes are the ADV cal with just 1 LS. I don't know they can dampen enough, and there is little flexibility with the HS at this point. Its pretty much just shield tank and precision at that point. This is how a minja feels
Lynn Beck Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 2049	Posted - 2014.07.17 05:28:00 - [13] - Quote Saying 'only 310 shields' like that is funny. Minja MK.0 can hit a maximum of 343, and that's regenning slower, being blind, and having mildly working HD, so i sacrifice ALL of my slots to be 'eh, a little tougher' than an EWAR Calscout. That's OP, my friend. If an Amarr Scout could dodge the exact same things as a Galscout, using identical layouts, but it had +50 Armor to top it off, would that be OP? General John Ripper -BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse. This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation
Ryme Intrinseca The Rainbow Effect Dark Taboo 1517	Posted - 2014.07.17 06:18:00 - [14] - Quote Precision has always been the Caldari USP, so it's perverted to make it worse than the Amarr and Gallente in that respect. I'm in favour of giving Amarr some ewar but it should not usurp the Caldari specialism. If Amarr becomes precision specialist then Caldari players should be given the option of respecing Amarr.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 3625	Posted - 2014.07.17 06:25:00 - [15] - Quote Cal should just keep their precision bonus. Run, hide in fear while you can for the Amarr Scout is on the hunt! The eyes of God compelles you!!!
JUDASisMYhomeboy xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 50	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:45:00 - [16] - Quote Waahh I want a respec boohoohooo
RendonaSix Techs Laboratory 97	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:59:00 - [17] - Quote My proto amarr has to fit all e war and a kin kat to be a scout............ Oh, I have 1 armour repair for my 195 armour. The changes if precision enhancement: I fit 2 damage mods or two shields (215 shields with two complex extenders BTW) instead of precision mods. The changes if range amplification: I get to remove my range amplifier and fit a ferroscale plate (248 armour with the plate BTW). It will be fine, I'll actually be scouty right off the bat like all the others. "For those who have seen the light, repentance you shall find, for within the heart of battle, scum you shall grind"
Lynn Beck Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 2049	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:59:00 - [18] - Quote RendonaSix wrote: My proto amarr has to fit all e war and a kin kat to be a scout............ Oh, I have 1 armour repair for my 195 armour. The changes if precision enhancement: I fit 2 damage mods or two shields (215 shields with two complex extenders BTW) instead of precision mods. The changes if range amplification: I get to remove my range amplifier and fit a ferroscale plate (248 armour with the plate BTW). It will be fine, I'll actually be scouty right off the bat like all the others. LIES. 270 with 2 Complex, my minja hits 198 with 1, 260 with 2. General John Ripper -BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse. This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation


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