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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3217
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Giving this bonus to the amarr changes what? The caldari suit is not even the problem....there are counters to it. It's the Gallente scout that there is no answer for.
There is nothing OP about the cal scout suit. It's supposed to regen faster because it's caldari. Aside from shield regen...what is the advantage? Precision bonus may be the only thing....but now that same bonus is moved to another suit....so what is being fixed or changed or balanced?
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
Soulja Ghostface wrote:Ydubbs, Arn't you too busy steamrolling faces in a tank to fret over a nerfed suit?
I do everything nowadays
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:The fact that shared scanning can piggy back off of a caldari so that a squad of heavies can know the locations of all players but the most hidden squishy gallente scout, at which point the heavy can spin 360 using his HMG after any shotgun blast and kill the squishy galente no problem.
Sounds like imbalance to me.
Incorrect on so many levels.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
Clone D wrote:It's about time that another dropsuit received a decent precision bonus. If knowing is half the battle, then cal scouts have had a ginormous advantage over every other suit in the game. Now they have some competition.
~friendly but smug~ Eat it
This is also ridiculous....so is the precision scan bonus going to be passed around to every scout suit every few months?
I'd like to have that dampening bonus passed as well..since we're sharing
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:The bonus is being given to the Amarr because it makes it a useful suit.
So, it isn't for nerfing cal scouts but more for balancing out the roles of the suits?
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:The cal scout will still be the best suit in the game for slaying.
Not really.....the only decent thing about the suit will be shield regen. There is no clear advantage to caldari scout suits.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:35:00 -
[7] - Quote
Appia Vibbia wrote:I think there's a lot of . . . Giving precision to the Amarr is just lack of foresight. There are only so many possibilities on how it can work out.
A) you can give the suit a bonus like the Caldari currently have at 5% per level to which the suit doesn't have enough High Slots to act as a Scout hunter or you can give a much larger bonus, like 8% per level and for most of the time they won't need to run precision enhancers
B) You can give the suit a bonus to the efficacy of Precision Enhancer modules, that has 2 results. Either the bonus is so low, a Caldari scout will still have more precision or the bonus is 17% per level and with 2 modules the Amarr Scout will be able to do what the Caldari needed 4 modules to do before.
EWAR is a system that is all-or-nothing, this is either going to make the Amarr Scout useless, the Amarr Scout OP, or the Gallente Scout OP.
There just is no balance you can find with any set of numbers when you're giving a precision bonus to a suit with only 2 high slots
It's so true.....there is no balance with these precision and profile dampening bonuses. They should just remove them all.
They should give the bonus to the modules instead of the suit itself...good point.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3218
|
Posted - 2014.07.11 20:37:00 -
[8] - Quote
Arcturis Vanguard wrote:One Eyed King wrote:The fact that shared scanning can piggy back off of a caldari so that a squad of heavies can know the locations of all players but the most hidden squishy gallente scout, at which point the heavy can spin 360 using his HMG after any shotgun blast and kill the squishy galente no problem.
Sounds like imbalance to me. So the caldari scout is the only suit in the game that has shared scans? I think not. Moving the scans to a suit with more low ends will increase what can be scanned distance wise. Typical caldari scout build would have two precision, two extenders and maybe 1-2 range amps.
Exactly my point.....for the cal scout, in order to you use precision enhancers, you have to sacrifice some of your primary tank. Amarr gets most of its tank from low slots, so there is no give and take. It's just the wrong suit to give the bonus to.
Imagine profile damps on the high slot side...gallente scouts can put two on and be virtually undetectable and still have all of their slots for speed and tank.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3221
|
Posted - 2014.07.11 20:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:The cal scout will still be the best suit in the game for slaying. Not really.....the only decent thing about the suit will be shield regen. There is no clear advantage to caldari scout suits. 450+ shields, best shield delays, best regen rate, small hitbox, great cpu/pg, two equipments slots, second fastest suit, resistances against the most popular weapons (hmgs, combat rifles, rail rifles)
Use good logic, ok?
besides having shields (it's supposed to because it's caldari. The same argument could be made for armor suits. 600+ hp of armor on gallente and amarr scouts) the hitboxes are the same as other suits. All scouts have 2 equipment slots. All of the scouts have good base speed and the gallente and the caldari have the same base speed.
Caldari scout doesn't have any resistances to weapons.....you can't be this out of touch.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3221
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:43:00 -
[10] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:Arcturis Vanguard wrote:One Eyed King wrote:The fact that shared scanning can piggy back off of a caldari so that a squad of heavies can know the locations of all players but the most hidden squishy gallente scout, at which point the heavy can spin 360 using his HMG after any shotgun blast and kill the squishy galente no problem.
Sounds like imbalance to me. So the caldari scout is the only suit in the game that has shared scans? I think not. Moving the scans to a suit with more low ends will increase what can be scanned distance wise. Typical caldari scout build would have two precision, two extenders and maybe 1-2 range amps. Typically, but not always. Minja and Amarr can't hide from a fully precisioned cal. Plus, I think as it stands they also have a range bonus. The combination of those 2 AND shared scans is insane. It is a problem. Cal had to take a hit in order for Minmatar and Amarr to have a purpose.
The min and amarr scout can go under a double precisioned cal scout. It's been tested.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3221
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:The cal scout will still be the best suit in the game for slaying. Not really.....the only decent thing about the suit will be shield regen. There is no clear advantage to caldari scout suits. 450+ shields, best shield delays, best regen rate, small hitbox, great cpu/pg, two equipments slots, second fastest suit, resistances against the most popular weapons (hmgs, combat rifles, rail rifles) Caldari scout doesn't have any resistances to weapons.....you can't be this out of touch. Shields do, and caldari have the most shields
But then shields are finished by scrambler rifles and duvolles. What is the point? There are counters to shield and armor tanking.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3221
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:46:00 -
[12] - Quote
Seigfried Warheit wrote:I wish for scouts the primary skill was for the module itself not the incorporated in the suit itself. Let Caldari keep precision..then they HAVE to use the precision module keeping their tank low, same will Gal their main tank will be kept low, Amarr with range...but it might be a bad idea cause that causes problems with the minnie cause they have no tank...
Exactly...let the bonus be to the modules.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3222
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:55:00 -
[13] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:My point is the caldari scout will still be a strong suit after the change. It will also have the longest scan range of any suit.
It will be as good a suit as any other but not more. And lol at the "longest scan range" when you can't pick them up anyway. Not to mention, the cal scouts already have that bonus so there is nothing new being given.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3222
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:56:00 -
[14] - Quote
Leadfoot10 wrote:Appia Vibbia wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:The cal scout will still be the best suit in the game for slaying. Then why are they rarer than hen's teeth in PC? The only thing that the cal scout is best at is passive scanning -- which has little applicability except as a long distance flanker -- and even that advantage is about to evaporate after hotfix Charlie (i.e. the Amarr scout will have the same bonus). The gal scout can also, through the use of his low slots, evade even the best cal scout's scans. PCs are full of gal scouts and heavies...because they are really the best suits for slaying. your joking right? please tell me your joking. Literally all the best slayers use the cal scout yeah.... leadfoot, I kinda just posted my slayer suit on skype. It's a shield-tanked Cal-Scout with the Allotek AR Until/Unless The Assault Suits get a bonus that doesn't limit them to just 1 weapon the Cal Scout will be better than a Cal Assault that only gets a bonus to Rail Rifle Agreed, but the assault suit is even rarer than a slaying cal scout in PCs. When was the last time you saw someone top leaderboard in kills with a cal scout suit in a PC? I cannot think of a single instance, but perhaps you guys and gals are seeing something I'm not.
Exactly..the most dangerous scouts are the ones OHKing everyone with the shotgun. And you'll see more min scouts than cal scouts because of the speed. But definitely gal scouts are just ridiculous for that.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3222
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Posted - 2014.07.11 20:57:00 -
[15] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:hfderrtgvcd wrote:My point is the caldari scout will still be a strong suit after the change. It will also have the longest scan range of any suit. It will be as good a suit as any other but not more. And lol at the "longest scan range" when you can't pick them up anyway. Not to mention, the cal scouts already have that bonus so there is nothing new being given. I think ccp will be changing it from 3% to 5%.
You think that's going to make a difference? 10% difference...what is that 2, 3 meters?
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3222
|
Posted - 2014.07.11 20:59:00 -
[16] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:[quote=Appia Vibbia]
Agreed, but the assault suit is even rarer than a slaying cal scout in PCs.
When was the last time you saw someone top leaderboard in kills with a cal scout suit in a PC?
I cannot think of a single instance, but perhaps you guys and gals are seeing something I'm not.
In 90% of pcs I do either espeon or xD3struction tops the leaderboard in kills. Both use the caldari scout.
For all it's worth...xDestruction has been topping the leaderboard of pcs long before the cal scout was introduced. You can give that man a medium frame Cal logi suit and he will still be there.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3222
|
Posted - 2014.07.11 21:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
hfderrtgvcd wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:I don't recall what suit Espeon runs.
I thought xD3 was gal.
They are both quality scouts, though, no doubt. I play with them everyday. They both use the cal scout. Along with zatara, ydubbs, dwater, regnyum, king kobrah, rexero and more. I could literally go on and on.
I have 6 proto suits....I use any of them at any given time.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3225
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Posted - 2014.07.11 21:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
8213 wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:The bonus is being given to the Amarr because it makes it a useful suit. That's a very poor reason. Instead of nerfing one suit, try a buff to the Amarr. I don't use the Amarr, so I honestly don't know if its as truly bad as people say. On paper and actually practicality and use in game are different
It should get a bonus where the module that's related to it is in the low slot...like dampening, range, etc
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3225
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Posted - 2014.07.11 21:32:00 -
[19] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote: Caldari scout doesn't have any resistances to weapons.....you can't be this out of touch.
Well technically it has a 5% resistance to Projectile Weapons, a 10% resistance to Railgun Weapons, and a 20% resistance to Explosive Weapons. Though every suit in the game with at least 1HP of shields has that, so it's a moot point.
technically, it's not the suit..but shields. I know guys that use just as much armor that they have with shields on a cal suit. If you have 250hp of shields and 250hp of armor, you are in the same boat as every other suit out there.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3229
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Posted - 2014.07.12 01:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
Nocturnal Soul wrote:Coming from an Amarr scout, yes the bonus needs to be range amplification instead. The only problem I've had with Proto Cal scouts is that I was in a advance suit. Maybe nerf Cals precision so it can't scan gallente scouts but to do that you'd have to sacrifice all slots or three with a advance clack and then make scanners be able to catch gal scouts for 10 seconds.
It's how I'd fix things
you can't scan a dampened gal scout.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3230
|
Posted - 2014.07.12 01:31:00 -
[21] - Quote
Grimmiers wrote:About galscouts being able to dodge all scans, it's bad in any shooter to have constant info on where someone is so having suits that can stay hidden isn't as bad as a scan that can't be dodged.
The problem is that the profile is always a fixed number and things like shooting, sprinting, and standing still don't come in to play. A crouching sniper in a medium frame should be as hard to detect as a scout until he shoots his loud rifle. It makes stealth rely on player choice in battle and not just a number tied to a suit. I think that might eventually make it into dust.
I hear you....issue is you shouldn't be able to couple that with a cloak. In other games as well....enemies show up when they start shooting. In this game? Well.....
Stealth in dust is on a whole other level.
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