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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1142
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Posted - 2014.07.11 17:32:00 -
[1] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I am having a hard time understanding the logic behind the needs to have a side arm.
Its along the same grounds as taking away minmatar grenade slots. Subbing Gallmando's second light weapon for a side arm. And giving Min logi two side arms instead of 1 light, or Cal scout 1 eq.
If we had to introduce the class (under the context it never existed before) in charlie and not since the start we'd be mocking the mere stupidity of giving one class a side arm over its fellows.
Arguing that "sidearm for A-Logi is wrong because every logi suit should be similar"
is as wrong as
"every logi suit should have same amount of his and same amount of lows because every logi suit should be similar"
Sidearm added some flavour and functionality plus some combinations otherwise unreachable without being OP. Seriously, who honestly thinks that A-Logi is 'too assaulty' and 'too powerful' because they have sidearm?
Sidearm for logi only gives a supportive suit type an option to wield supportive weapon (like laser or MD - no matter how powerful they still need sidearm)
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1142
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Posted - 2014.07.11 17:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:THUNDERGROOVE wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I am having a hard time understanding the logic behind the needs to have a side arm.
Its along the same grounds as taking away minmatar grenade slots. Subbing Gallmando's second light weapon for a side arm. And giving Min logi two side arms instead of 1 light.
If we had to introduce the class (under the context it never existed before) in charlie and not since the start we'd be mocking the mere stupidity of giving one class a side arm. Because over a year ago, I got the Amarr logi because of the sidearm and nothing more. I got a titan for its AOE DD your point?
Bad analogy.
No one ever questioned AOE DDs usefulness or power. They were removed because of obvious gameplay reasons.
It seems people do regard sidearm as useless trash no one wants. Mr Thundergrooves point is that is has a need.
Nevertheless AOE DD =/= logi sidearm.
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1142
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Posted - 2014.07.11 18:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
Pvt Numnutz wrote:I find it odd that A-logis say they are useless without a side arm, while every other race says "im doing fine with my light weapon" logistics is a support class, not an assault class, i suggest they run amarr assault if they want to run with two weapons.
It might be because those ppl wanted to use laser or MD oe other supportive weapon like that.
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1142
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Posted - 2014.07.11 18:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:Alright, so to actually give proper context. This is solely about equalizing the slot numbers and equipment ability for all the logistics. The sidearm slot for Amarr logistics isn't causing any specific concerns
However, I am actually open to the possibility of adding a second logistics variant (using the same skills, think the old Type-II) for all races that has an equipment slot traded for a sidearm, plus possibly a few base stat nerfs (not sure what yet, I'm just a little worried that these new logistics would crowd out actual assault suits).
However, that's a fair bit of extra work. Thoughts?
Uuuh Mama, nice!!!!
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1154
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Posted - 2014.07.13 20:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:
Despite how bad that analogy is; CEO Pyrex was exceptionally upset the aoe dds were removed. It still does not change the fact that there are very specific ships eve pilots train for because they offer something no other option offers and they oft feel short changed when the nerf bat looks their way.
I knew plenty of pilots that trained for the Moros because of the drone bay. I knew pilots that trained Ravens because they could stack torpedo vollies. I knew pilots that trained Apocs to shove 8 auto cannons on it and 8 Gryostabs. I knew plenty of pilots that trained not only for the Machariel but all the interceptor like skills and implants and massives amounts of booster and research to make a battleship go 14km/s The list pilots who were overly fond of the things they trained expansive and rather wide in what sort of things pilots train for. The thing is we typically forget the small changes some pilots absolutely despised. It can be simple as 1 slot on a highly unpopular ship and it doesn't make headlines because its not a fotm ship and all of these changes have always been in the name of balance.
So the question is what is balance? you can look at spreadsheets all day but if play behaviors mutates the stats beyond intended then; When do we consider it wrong?
Am I wrong to use the amarr logi to use a medic? Should you nerf that? There are those who will oddly say yes to that. Are those who use logis to kill people wrong? Should that be nerfed? I think not; REs and Proxies and Light weapons are sufficient in that deal as well as a generous tank. Are those who use logis to uplink also wrong? Should that be nerfed? I also think not; its a valuable tool set keeping the front lines restocked.
The overall major problem is though are any of these players being disenfranchised because they picked poorly? Are there other classes that does the job better than they can? And oddly enough from my point of view the latter of the two are a resounding yes; Amarr are severely under classed as a support class. Maybe its because I can't proto; maybe because I don't PC that much. Maybe uplinks themselves are broken. Maybe other players I observe feel similar to the way the logi bonuses are and don't use them often. Maybe players don't trust most uplinks I have still have a massive annoyance with public ambush uplinks because just far too often they're placed to only farm points as they're often in line of fire of the enemy.
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Dude, we agree that amusing specced-in people is nowhere near as important as making right choices about gameplay design. No need to lecture me on that.
I've even said that "People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change"
:-S
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