DUST Search - Why Dust failed summed up in one video

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

Aero Yassavi wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

Silas Swakhammer wrote:

It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time.

I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out.

No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them.

IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth.

That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game.

This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust.

Most reviewers on all sides did not declare the game unfinished though which is the massive flaw in likening this video to dust 514's problems.

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I-Shayz-I I----------I 3869	Posted - 2014.07.03 00:41:00 - [1] - Quote https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmLz00L6CmY Extra Credits is spot on here. If Legion is going to be a success, we need it to be as complete as possible before it's released. No 10 year plan No SOON tm Just a full, complete, polished game. Even if it means all of the testing and balancing needs to happen in Dust first. 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!
Silas Swakhammer GamersForChrist 430	Posted - 2014.07.03 00:56:00 - [2] - Quote It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. Pineapples on pizza.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8699	Posted - 2014.07.03 01:09:00 - [3] - Quote That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 11516	Posted - 2014.07.03 01:14:00 - [4] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. Indeed. I have yet to watch the video....but it makes sense to me that if certain assets like weapons and vehicles are to be introduced into Legion, then CCP will have the assets, models, and stats, and could release them in Dust for us to test in preparation for Legion. Not only could they manipulate as they saw fit the statistics of these weapons, vehicles, etc but could work out all the kinks for a smoother transition into Legion and better balance on release. *"I watched you. From candle to a torch you grew. I'll always remember those days with great affection." - Satja Askarin
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8699	Posted - 2014.07.03 01:19:00 - [5] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. Indeed. I have yet to watch the video....but it makes sense to me that if certain assets like weapons and vehicles are to be introduced into Legion, then CCP will have the assets, models, and stats, and could release them in Dust for us to test in preparation for Legion. Not only could they manipulate as they saw fit the statistics of these weapons, vehicles, etc but could work out all the kinks for a smoother transition into Legion and better balance on release. Not only that, but if they choose to have Legion be the first player exposure to these assets then they run the risk of these assets not being in a good place and then players dismissing the game and spreading bad word of mouth around the title. Whereas for Dust there bad word of mouth isn't really an issue anymore and you're going to attract a large amount of players with the initial release of Legion anyways. Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble
TEBOW BAGGINS Defenders of the Helghast Dream Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 1083	Posted - 2014.07.03 01:25:00 - [6] - Quote problem is conceptual visions are too complex for the gen pop, everything innovative gets tossed out the window in the end to appeal to the $$casual gamer$$ resulting in a massive waste of everyones time. AKA Zirzo Valcyn AFKing since 2012
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 11519	Posted - 2014.07.03 01:28:00 - [7] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: True Adamance wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. Indeed. I have yet to watch the video....but it makes sense to me that if certain assets like weapons and vehicles are to be introduced into Legion, then CCP will have the assets, models, and stats, and could release them in Dust for us to test in preparation for Legion. Not only could they manipulate as they saw fit the statistics of these weapons, vehicles, etc but could work out all the kinks for a smoother transition into Legion and better balance on release. Not only that, but if they choose to have Legion be the first player exposure to these assets then they run the risk of these assets not being in a good place and then players dismissing the game and spreading bad word of mouth around the title. Whereas for Dust there bad word of mouth isn't really an issue anymore and you're going to attract a large amount of players with the initial release of Legion anyways. I see no downside to releasing content in Dust. - CCP has us test the content and provide feed back. - They have free reign for stat tweak as Rattati is endorsed by much of the community - Game is finished resulting in positive feed back - Asset release and player translation is smoothed into Legion as while they work on Higher end goals Rattati and community is balancing core features for them. *"I watched you. From candle to a torch you grew. I'll always remember those days with great affection." - Satja Askarin
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 15690	Posted - 2014.07.03 03:46:00 - [8] - Quote Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Gallente Logistics =// Unlocked
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 919	Posted - 2014.07.03 04:23:00 - [9] - Quote why dust failed: CCP Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8706	Posted - 2014.07.03 05:21:00 - [10] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth. That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game. This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust. Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble

Jett Pezzin Terminal Courtesy 192	Posted - 2014.07.03 05:31:00 - [11] - Quote Dust did not die because of these things in the video. It is dead because CCP decided that they should start all over again with Project Legion. Yes, these are the reasons why Dust was not TOO successful but it was ultimately CCP's decision to shut down Dust 514. ^.^
Operative 1125 Lokaas True Companion Planetary Requisitions 263	Posted - 2014.07.03 06:04:00 - [12] - Quote Jett Pezzin wrote: Dust did not die because of these things in the video. It is dead because CCP decided that they should start all over again with Project Legion. Yes, these are the reasons why Dust was not TOO successful but it was ultimately CCP's decision to shut down Dust 514. Yep, CCP said they couldn't do what they wanted on the PS3 and its limits caused dev delays. It failed because CCP talks a big talk and doesn't even find out if they can do what they are wanting to do before they open their big mouth. Advanced promotion is CCP's biggest fault. They need to clamp that sh*t down and only show what they definitely know is going to happen in the next six months. If not, I'm walking straight out of this station. Oh yeah, I CAN'T! THIS IS THE VOICE OF RÁN
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5986	Posted - 2014.07.03 06:05:00 - [13] - Quote Not very many studios release complete polished games anymore. Soft launches and incomplete games are practically standard in the industry now. Not saying it's right but it's just common practice to release an unfinished game and finish it along the way now. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 15691	Posted - 2014.07.03 08:20:00 - [14] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth. That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game. This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust. Most reviewers on all sides did not declare the game unfinished though which is the massive flaw in likening this video to dust 514's problems. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Gallente Logistics =// Unlocked
steadyhand amarr shadows of 514 3213	Posted - 2014.07.03 09:42:00 - [15] - Quote Iron wolf thats the entire point, dust was not finished and ccp stated this is not the finished product at the time, and everyone went this finished game sucks. People treat any product they see as the finished arctical. We as a race oddly cant do forword thinking verywell outside our own thought pattern (other wise every human would rock at chess rather yhan a handfull) Thus you have release games "or leak" games in a poilshed state and finished state or it will get bad word of mouth and fail. Sunless sea is a perfect example of early access done right as its a full game in its own right right now. And Destiny bar voice acting issues was a good example of postive beta marketing (ie a demo dressed up as a test :-P) I wont touch legion until its a complete experince and free from microtransactions You can never have to many chaples -Templar True adamance
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 141	Posted - 2014.07.03 09:47:00 - [16] - Quote TEBOW BAGGINS wrote: problem is conceptual visions are too complex for the gen pop, everything innovative gets tossed out the window in the end to appeal to the $$casual gamer$$ resulting in a massive waste of everyones time. This happens to every good game. They suck in a target audience, once milked, suck in the casuals. Eventually, people will be too smart and will simply get fed up of gaming. Service with a smile
steadyhand amarr shadows of 514 3213	Posted - 2014.07.03 10:06:00 - [17] - Quote RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: TEBOW BAGGINS wrote: problem is conceptual visions are too complex for the gen pop, everything innovative gets tossed out the window in the end to appeal to the $$casual gamer$$ resulting in a massive waste of everyones time. This happens to every good game. They suck in a target audience, once milked, suck in the casuals. Eventually, people will be too smart and will simply get fed up of gaming. Dust burned me so bad i took up Parkour and rockclimbing i just dont game anymore :-( Im only posting here because im at work and cant go outside You can never have to many chaples -Templar True adamance
Paran Tadec The Last of DusT. General Tso's Alliance 2147	Posted - 2014.07.03 10:16:00 - [18] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: True Adamance wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. Indeed. I have yet to watch the video....but it makes sense to me that if certain assets like weapons and vehicles are to be introduced into Legion, then CCP will have the assets, models, and stats, and could release them in Dust for us to test in preparation for Legion. Not only could they manipulate as they saw fit the statistics of these weapons, vehicles, etc but could work out all the kinks for a smoother transition into Legion and better balance on release. Not only that, but if they choose to have Legion be the first player exposure to these assets then they run the risk of these assets not being in a good place and then players dismissing the game and spreading bad word of mouth around the title. Whereas for Dust there bad word of mouth isn't really an issue anymore and you're going to attract a large amount of players with the initial release of Legion anyways. CCP hasnt been able to balance this garbage in 2 years. What makes you think they are capable now? Bittervet Proficiency V thanks logibro!
Aisha Ctarl Praetoriani Classiarii Templares 4957	Posted - 2014.07.03 10:59:00 - [19] - Quote So CCP got blasted in two EC videos, the one in the OP (Dust), and their video covering tutorials (EVE was shown for having a terrible tutorial). Scrambling brains since 5/14/13
Maximus Stryker Who Are Those Guys 1003	Posted - 2014.07.03 11:16:00 - [20] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: That absolutely makes sense. In fact it is absolutely insane to think CCP would do any sort of early access for Legion when Dust 514 already exists. Why risk bad word of mouth on your new title when you can test almost everything you wanted to test with Dust 514? That's why when CCP says Amarr/Minmatar vehicles or player market or new game modes such as Salvage will not be coming to Dust I scratch my head. The will be testing as much as they can in DUST, they just have a limited dev team for dust so it is likely everything can be tested in DUST. the people who still play dust and come to these forums when CCP is ready for an Alpha and a Beta test are very likely to be the hardcore in it for the long haul types who wont dismiss the game early on. overall I agree, with the way things are, I hope they learn from their mistakes, give Legion massive amounts of support (financial and man power) and release a game with loads of features and then build on that. EX don't give us the frame of a car and say it will be a corvette one day, give us a corvette and say it will be an awesome and highly customized corvette one day. Best Idea For Legion

steadyhand amarr shadows of 514 3214	Posted - 2014.07.03 11:19:00 - [21] - Quote EVE and Dust514 are walking examples of how not to do nearly everything from development to design but showing co-op gameplay is what makes stuiped ammounts of cash because thats what EvE is, who huge coop game with a few random causals dotted about :-P You can never have to many chaples -Templar True adamance
Seymour KrelbornX Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 259	Posted - 2014.07.03 11:24:00 - [22] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. of course you say this.... how many more sycophantic posts do you need to make before ccp gives you another scratch behind the ear? yes this described so many games, including dust 100%.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2356	Posted - 2014.07.03 12:42:00 - [23] - Quote Good find, Shayz. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2079	Posted - 2014.07.03 13:00:00 - [24] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth. That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game. This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust. Yah except that doesn't fit into reality... If you ignored the entire ride of DUST while on it and then just agree with what someone smart sounding has to say? then sure. DUST played better in chrome then it does now...The gameplay felt better in Beta's then it does now.. People who tried DUST in the beta come back and end up hating it very quickly.. The problem with DUST is we threw out the Heart of CCP Hardcore gamer focused development and cut the nutts off DUST in the hopes to appeal to a crowd CCP had no idea how to market to. They traded a bird in the hand for two in the bush. DUST has been re-reviewed by everyone.. 2-3 times since Beta, and has received WORSE scores then the Beta builds. DUST had magic in a bottle in Beta and they threw it out on Uprising launch. making textures more pretty only does so much.
Pvt Numnutz Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1610	Posted - 2014.07.03 13:39:00 - [25] - Quote Wow, thank you so much for posting this. I've been spending hours now watching these videos and this team is truly amazing. Their views on the medium of video games is touching and they show the show issues from both a developer standpoint and a gamers point of view. I've found myself agreeing and seeing issues they bring up, sometimes I can even see these issues in games I've played on the subject before they even mention it. What these guys/gals are doing is just incredible for the entire industry. Game developers would be wise to lend an ear to their videos and take something away from it, as well as the video gaming community as a whole. The episode you posted is very relevant to dust, hell even all games in the model. Again thank you for posting. Have a like.
G Sacred Rubber Chicken Bombers 88	Posted - 2014.07.03 15:13:00 - [26] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth. That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game. This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust. Most reviewers on all sides did not declare the game unfinished though which is the massive flaw in likening this video to dust 514's problems. I'm pretty sure you were here when the game was in closed beta IWS. I think everyone who saw the game back then can agree it has come a long way. The game does however have some unfinished stuff, like vehicles for example. We have seen 3 forms of tanks come into the game, and 3 forms get taken out. (Black ops, Marauders, and Enforcers) Almost the same story for LAVs. (Scouts and Logistics). I would like to know how long it takes to "re-balance" these vehicles as it has been a LONG time since we have seen a tank better than the standard class. I think the rifles themselves have been fairly well balanced, but the overall time to kill is too high. (My opinion people, bash me if you want) So, in my opinion, the game had some unfinished aspects to it, but it is still an overall good game.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8710	Posted - 2014.07.03 18:05:00 - [27] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Silas Swakhammer wrote: It seemed like the guys at EC were almost specifically talking about DUST the entire time. I disagree, if felt like they were talking about the multitudes of games that have bad early access states, ie planetary annihilation is one such where its extremely early access did peeve off quite a few folks. Also Star Citizen is beginning to show signs of every single negative issue pointed out. No I dear say there are about 2-7 videos that would engage wtf went wrong with dust 514, this was not one of them. IWS did you even watch the video? The biggest point the video made was that people who tried the game when it was unfinished feel they already tried the full game so whenever they are asked about it they say, "Yeah, I tried that. It was ok/sucked." Bad word of mouth. That is exactly what has happened to Dust 514. Talk to your various gaming friends are ask gaming websites and forums about Dust 514, you'll have people who tried either during Open Beta in January 2013 or on release in May 2013 and they will say "Meh, the game was ok/sucked" entirely off how the game was back then despite all the massive improvements CCP has made since that date. The Dust 514 brand has gotten so bad that CCP feels they need to rebrand it entirely, which is exactly why they say Legion is a different game. This video pretty much hits the nail on the head for Dust. Most reviewers on all sides did not declare the game unfinished though which is the massive flaw in likening this video to dust 514's problems. Most reviewers did not declare the game unfinished because CCP falsely declared the game finished on 5/14/13 when clearly it was nowhere near finished. That is CCP's fault for "releasing" an unfinished game, which is exactly what the video is about. And everything the video states has happened to Dust. It seems like you're trying to find a work-around because the game was technically fully released on 5/14/13 but that is such an arbitrary statement to make. The game really released back in January 2013 when anyone who wanted to play it had completely open access to it, and that's when the bad word of mouth started. 5/14/13 wasn't a full release, it was just another update in a really unfinished game and a day for the media to focus on and bring even more bad word of mouth. Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble


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