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Forlorn Destrier
2564
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Posted - 2014.06.24 22:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:The assault is in a dubious place right now. All the things it can do can be done by another class.
What can the role of the assault actually be?
It's not to provide firepower, HP, EWAR, or speed. Those are all the realms of other roles and classes. The scout, logistics, heavy, and commando classes all have something unique about them to provide a reason to choose them.
The heavy is the only class that can fit heavy weapons.
The logistics is able to use far more equipment than any other class.
The commando can use two light weapons on one suit.
The scout has EWAR and a cloak.
What can the assault do that's unique?
A straight buff set of buffs won't change anything. It still won't have a role. It doesn't hard counter anything at all, but every other class has something over it.
It's the jack of all trades, and can best adapt to a changing environment.
Example - running a long distance across an open field and offering sustained point defense of a closed in objective. Can other classes do the same? Sure - but let's look at what happens.
A scout gets there faster than the assault, but will die more quickly if he encounters more than 1 or 2 players.
A heavy will eventually get the objective, but by that time there is nothing to defend and the MCC would have already taken damage. Also with low mobility if the enemy is there they will see him coming a mile away.
The Logistics can there and offer defense, but lacking a sidearm (the Amarr logi really isn't a logi) means that he can also be overwhelmed more easily than an assult can be.
The commando can get there faster than the heavy, and can hold the defense longer than the assault - again though you trade speed for defense, just not as extreme of a trade of as the heavy. |
Forlorn Destrier
2564
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Posted - 2014.06.24 22:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Forlorn Destrier wrote:
It's the jack of all trades, and can best adapt to a changing environment.
That title belongs to the Commando. To show, let's look at this hypothetical (yet entirely plausible) situation. Quote:
A Commando is fighting Infantry with a Mass Driver in an Urban, CQC defined area. However he then needs to combat Infantry in a long range, open field. He adapts by using a Rail Rifle.
An Assault is fighting Infantry with a Mass Drive in an Urban, CQC defined area. However he needs to combat Infantry in a long range, open field. He adapts by using an err... Magsec SMG?
Which one seems the most adaptable to you? Forlorn Destrier wrote:The commando can get there faster than the heavy, and can hold the defense longer than the assault - again though you trade speed for defense, just not as extreme of a trade of as the heavy. My Commando can reach speeds of 7.81m/s, which is about as fast as most Assault suits are. You don't really use Commandos that much do you? 
I would pose that an Assault using a Mass Driver is doing it wrong. The Mass Driver is area of denial weapon. Assault makes up for the range deficiency by selecting the right weapon type and using his maneuverability to close the gap to optimal range. The Commando will likely die faster as he will be less able to dodge, dip, dive, and... um... dodge (points to those that get the reference).
"Can get to" says to me you have to put speed mods on there to do it, sacrificing low slots on a suit woefully bereft of them. By doing this, you are using the mods to approximate another role - one that the Assault fills naturally without having to sacrifice low slots for speed.
The idea of balance is that you fit to your strengths, not weaknesses. If you are compensating for your weekness, your strength is not as effective, and overall you lose the best features of your class. This would be the same as brick tanking a scout as the sacrifice of the EWAR capability, in my opinion. Why brick tank the scout if you are playing a more assault role? Use the suit better designed for adaptability for situations that change quickly.
And that is my overall point - battles that require fluidity are better suited for the Assault. If you have to approximate the Assualt's speed with mods, and the situation changes and you need better point defense, and not supply depot is around, you're hosed. Is the Assault best at anything? No. But it balances everything much better than the other suits do, and if you need to adapt you don't necessarily have to find a depot to do so.
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Forlorn Destrier
2564
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Posted - 2014.06.24 22:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Forlorn Destrier wrote:
It's the jack of all trades, and can best adapt to a changing environment.
Example - running a long distance across an open field and offering sustained point defense of a closed in objective. Can other classes do the same? Sure - but let's look at what happens.
A scout gets there faster than the assault, but will die more quickly if he encounters more than 1 or 2 players.
A heavy will eventually get the objective, but by that time there is nothing to defend and the MCC would have already taken damage. Also with low mobility if the enemy is there they will see him coming a mile away.
The Logistics can there and offer defense, but lacking a sidearm (the Amarr logi really isn't a logi) means that he can also be overwhelmed more easily than an assult can be.
The commando can get there faster than the heavy, and can hold the defense longer than the assault - again though you trade speed for defense, just not as extreme of a trade of as the heavy.
To some extent, I agree. Except... At the moment, the scout can fight just as well as the assault can on that point, arguably more effectively as it'll be assisted by EWAR and its greater mobility during the actual fight. The logistics is as good at combat as the assault is - the sidearm is negated by the extra slots and fitting the logi has, and the logi has access to a number of tools to assist it as well. The heavy frames, I agree, might not get there in time. But if the assault is getting there in time to realistically defend an objective (that is to say, it's not basically lost already) then the heavy won't be so far behind that it won't be able to proceed to clear the objective and casually hack it back. The assault is below mediocre. It can't excel at anything - it can perform almost adequately in a number of tasks but is significantly outperformed in all of them even when dealing with multiple tasks and versatility. A scout is more versatile than an assault. A logi is also debatably more versatile than an assault. A heavy is not - but it has such vast power behind it that it doesn't matter. To either a scout or a heavy, an assault is essentially prey. What can the assault seriously counter?
My point is that the Assault isn't supposed to excel at any one role, hence the "jack of all trades, master of none" comment. It's supposed to do everything moderately well, while there isn't anything that it does poorly or fantastically.
And to be honest, I can beat scouts or heavies in my Assault - been doing it since closed beta. There is nothing I lose to more than others, and I consistently beat all others more than I lose. |
Forlorn Destrier
2564
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Posted - 2014.06.24 22:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:@Forlorn -
The idea of a commando making a real sacrifice by using the low slots for speed mods doesn't really make much of a difference in the end because the base HP on a commando is so much higher than an assault.
It's quite likely that a commando can be both tankier and faster than an assault whilst having two weapons with more damage on.
Essentially, it can outperform the assault in almost every meaningful way.
They why don't I die to it more often when I'm running my Assault?
EDIT: minor buffs, sure. Major overhaul is major overkill. It doesn't need a specialization. |
Forlorn Destrier
2564
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Posted - 2014.06.24 22:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Forlorn Destrier wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:@Forlorn -
The idea of a commando making a real sacrifice by using the low slots for speed mods doesn't really make much of a difference in the end because the base HP on a commando is so much higher than an assault.
It's quite likely that a commando can be both tankier and faster than an assault whilst having two weapons with more damage on.
Essentially, it can outperform the assault in almost every meaningful way. They why don't I die to it more often when I'm running my Assault? Are we bringing anecdotal evidence into this now? If assaults are fine, why do I never die to them?
I lick my lips when I see a Commando. I beat them straight up in my assault 8 out of 10 times. Maybe its the quality of the other driver? I don't know. All I'm saying is a major overhaul isn't needed. Small buffs are always better than major changes. Tweaks. Not overhaul. |
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