DUST Search - since people are saying ADS are op

Pvt Numnutz wrote:

I have had an idea on a compromise for a while now. I'm sure that most mercs feel that it is the missile turret that makes the ads op, at least for infantry players. Av are saying the whole ship is op but if the missile turrets power per shot were decreased would you all still feel the assault dropship is op?

The compromise being,
Reduce small missile turret damage per missile
Increase small missile turret clip size

This keeps the same damage potential per clip, but requires gunner accuracy to deliver. This will also require dropships to remain in the engagement area for longer to apply the full damage, giving av more chance to interfere in the dropships run and give them more of a chance vs dropships.

Haven't thought up exact numbers yet but thought I'd bring this up for discussion. I am going to be talking to my gunners about this to get their input as to what they would feel fair. Personally I think it shouldn't be too low on the damage, enough to still be able to get in and out relatively quickly but long enough to make a difference. I don't want to have to go into hover mode to kill a single merc, nor do I think it should take over 4 missiles to kill an assault suit. Thought maybe it should take more than two.

Discuss.

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Pvt Numnutz Watchdoge Explosives 1515	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:17:00 - [1] - Quote I have had an idea on a compromise for a while now. I'm sure that most mercs feel that it is the missile turret that makes the ads op, at least for infantry players. Av are saying the whole ship is op but if the missile turrets power per shot were decreased would you all still feel the assault dropship is op? The compromise being, Reduce small missile turret damage per missile Increase small missile turret clip size This keeps the same damage potential per clip, but requires gunner accuracy to deliver. This will also require dropships to remain in the engagement area for longer to apply the full damage, giving av more chance to interfere in the dropships run and give them more of a chance vs dropships. Haven't thought up exact numbers yet but thought I'd bring this up for discussion. I am going to be talking to my gunners about this to get their input as to what they would feel fair. Personally I think it shouldn't be too low on the damage, enough to still be able to get in and out relatively quickly but long enough to make a difference. I don't want to have to go into hover mode to kill a single merc, nor do I think it should take over 4 missiles to kill an assault suit. Thought maybe it should take more than two. Discuss.
LUGMOS YELLOW JESUS EXP FORCE 545	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:23:00 - [2] - Quote Blaster should be better Anti infantry, so yes. My understanding is rails are AV, blasters are AI, and missles are supposed to be ok at both, but not the best. I think small rails should have more direct damage than missles, and blasters could have a tighter spread to make them more effective vs infantry. Quafe A question doesn't always have an answer, but a problem does, So what is DUST? A problem or a question?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2098	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:24:00 - [3] - Quote Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Judge Rhadamanthus Amarr Templar One 2282	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:28:00 - [4] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. He'll no! 4 shots can do the trick for many builds. Python that is. Judge For CPM 1 youtube Twitter @Judge_EVELegion
Seymour KrelbornX Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 97	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:44:00 - [5] - Quote I don't think ADS are OP.... I think teams who don't pull out their own dropships and forge guns are UP.... by choice.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8240	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:46:00 - [6] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. We fixed that. The Proficiency skill should now also be working for Forge Guns and Swarm Launchers against vehicles, so that should also give swarms a boost. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Pvt Numnutz Watchdoge Explosives 1515	Posted - 2014.06.20 18:54:00 - [7] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. We fixed that. The Proficiency skill should now also be working for Forge Guns and Swarm Launchers against vehicles, so that should also give swarms a boost. But does this mean they have become leas effective against shield vehicles like my python?
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 14713	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:01:00 - [8] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. He'll no! 4 shots can do the trick for many builds. Python that is. 4 shots? So getting off the entire clip, reloading, and firing again? You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
Ryder Azorria Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1005	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:05:00 - [9] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. We fixed that. The Proficiency skill should now also be working for Forge Guns and Swarm Launchers against vehicles, so that should also give swarms a boost. But does this mean they have become leas effective against shield vehicles like my python? No, it wasn't applying at all - so basically, for you, nothing has changed.
Pvt Numnutz Watchdoge Explosives 1515	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:12:00 - [10] - Quote Ryder Azorria wrote: No, it wasn't applying at all - so basically, for you, nothing has changed. Ah that explains alot

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2103	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:13:00 - [11] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. He'll no! 4 shots can do the trick for many builds. Python that is. 4 shots? So getting off the entire clip, reloading, and firing again? To be fair, if I could crash an expensive bird with one clip I'd be concerned. The fire interval between volleys is sufficiently small such that when behind a bird I can get my clip into the air before the pilot knows anything's coming. It'd be bad news if that's all it took. Sure, the pilot need only move as I reload to avoid being crashed, but I'm OK with that. He had to move. A single swarmer being able to keep a bird away bird from a spawnpoint or objective is a huge improvement from where we were pre-fix. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 2579	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:15:00 - [12] - Quote LUGMOS wrote: Blaster should be better Anti infantry, so yes. My understanding is rails are AV, blasters are AI, and missles are supposed to be ok at both, but not the best. I think small rails should have more direct damage than missles, and blasters could have a tighter spread to make them more effective vs infantry. rails are the best ranged anti-infantry now, they are HORRIBLE av now, missiles are the best for AV now, though good blaster pilots can probably beat them. and blasters are good at killing infantry close up
skippy678 The Phoenix Federation Dark Taboo 2477	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:23:00 - [13] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: I have had an idea on a compromise for a while now. I'm sure that most mercs feel that it is the missile turret that makes the ads op, at least for infantry players. Av are saying the whole ship is op but if the missile turrets power per shot were decreased would you all still feel the assault dropship is op? The compromise being, Reduce small missile turret damage per missile Increase small missile turret clip size This keeps the same damage potential per clip, but requires gunner accuracy to deliver. This will also require dropships to remain in the engagement area for longer to apply the full damage, giving av more chance to interfere in the dropships run and give them more of a chance vs dropships. Haven't thought up exact numbers yet but thought I'd bring this up for discussion. I am going to be talking to my gunners about this to get their input as to what they would feel fair. Personally I think it shouldn't be too low on the damage, enough to still be able to get in and out relatively quickly but long enough to make a difference. I don't want to have to go into hover mode to kill a single merc, nor do I think it should take over 4 missiles to kill an assault suit. Thought maybe it should take more than two. Discuss. Not sure that I would say they are op. They are OP against weak enemies, and not so much against vetrans. I could show you tons of videos where i dont get shot down the whole match, but come in 13th with a 6 and 0. But then i could tell you about matches where i lose 4 ships and spend over two million ISK getting almost 1 shotted by forge guns (with level 5 shields) I dont think the ADS needs any changes except price, but perhaps the price is why it dosent need any changes. But I can see What your sayin! My Youtube Lvl. 2 Forum Warrior Follow:@skippy6gaming #BetaVet
IMMORTAL WAR HERO NECROM0NGERS Caps and Mercs 146	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:39:00 - [14] - Quote im sorry but its a fast pilot and good gunners that make a good dropship Frowned upon by amateurs: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP
Tectonic Fusion 1739	Posted - 2014.06.20 19:55:00 - [15] - Quote All I know is I got an ADS to about 10-50 armor, and it got behind a building and all of it's shields were back.
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 878	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:32:00 - [16] - Quote I'm going to blow the dust off my swarms tonight and try them out. Forge vs ADS is fine. My guess is that with the change in proficiency and resistance that proto swarms are in the right place. If so, the only change needed is to reduce the tier differential. Because, that's why.
Pvt Numnutz Watchdoge Explosives 1517	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:33:00 - [17] - Quote IMMORTAL WAR HERO wrote: im sorry but its a fast pilot and good gunners that make a good dropship This is true. I want to discuss this because I would rather this than a huge Nerf to the ads because of perceived over poweredness.
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 878	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:35:00 - [18] - Quote I'd like to see the price of dropships decreased further and collision damage decreased. I blow up my dropship just trying to learn to fly it while I can drive an LAV off a cliff, roll it 5 times and keep on trucking. Because, that's why.
buzzzzzzz killllllllll Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers 563	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:44:00 - [19] - Quote ccp just reduce the fuckin ads price to something like 50k. that is something almost everyone agrees about, and then when you can afford lose one every 3 matches they can be balanced properly Dedicated heavy through the hard times, still supporter of A FULL 1.8 respec and MOAR HEAVY WEAPONS!
Evan Gotabor Prima Gallicus 28	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:46:00 - [20] - Quote Let the price to what it is, reduce the small missile launcher to what they once were (before 1.7, the old proto had more or less the same damages than the militia one). As for the collision damages, yes it should be reduce. I can evade a single dropship trying to ram me, but now, people are doing it two or three at the same time. So you can evade them some time, but sooner or later, one of them can take the upper hand while you take care of the other one (happened to me yesterday while I was trying an incubus with a 120mm complex armor plate to test the efficiency of the new armor skill ; my amount of eHP was equal to a gallente tank without plates) Dropship pilot

Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 602	Posted - 2014.06.20 20:54:00 - [21] - Quote Pvt Numnutz wrote: Reduce small missile turret damage per missile Increase small missile turret clip size. Shouldn't be overdone, but generally this seems like a good idea. Prototype-turrets really wreck infantry in an instant. Less-than-proto turrets are much less of an issue however, so take care not to make those useless.
Takahashi Kashuken Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 7	Posted - 2014.06.20 21:32:00 - [22] - Quote ADS OP lolno
Brotherband REMNANT ENFORCERS 3	Posted - 2014.06.20 22:05:00 - [23] - Quote I would like to point out that I have tried to use the blaster on my ads. The accuracy of the turret makes hitting a target from the air next to impossible. Rail turrets are the same except in reverse they are so accurate that it's hard to hit a target from the air. The turret balances that ccp made are fine for ground vehicles but in the air the turret fixes make all but the missile turret unplayable. I would appreciate a variant or perhaps a drop ship specific blaster and rail turret that has a tighter accuracy.
Evan Gotabor Prima Gallicus 28	Posted - 2014.06.21 07:40:00 - [24] - Quote It depend on what you want to hit, blaster on an incubus is fun, but only against ground turrets and a bit against tanks, which is not logical to say the least. And it give the opportunity to destroy you as you become an easy target. But against vehicle, the top of the line is still the rail turret. As to target infantry, I have the impression fro what I see on the battlefield, that higher your level is on the gallente dropship, the better are your chance to touch as the rate of fire of your rail turret allow you to do a heavy suppression fire on a tight area if you are stable enough. Dropship pilot
Ryme Intrinseca The Rainbow Effect 1374	Posted - 2014.06.21 12:29:00 - [25] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. He'll no! 4 shots can do the trick for many builds. Python that is. 4 shots? So getting off the entire clip, reloading, and firing again? It's a very effective method against DS pilots who have yet to master the 'UP' control.
Ryme Intrinseca The Rainbow Effect 1374	Posted - 2014.06.21 12:35:00 - [26] - Quote buzzzzzzz killllllllll wrote: ccp just reduce the fuckin ads price to something like 50k. that is something almost everyone agrees about No one except ADS pilots agrees about this...
Pvt Numnutz Watchdoge Explosives 1518	Posted - 2014.06.21 14:55:00 - [27] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: Pvt Numnutz wrote: Reduce small missile turret damage per missile Increase small missile turret clip size. Shouldn't be overdone, but generally this seems like a good idea. Prototype-turrets really wreck infantry in an instant. Less-than-proto turrets are much less of an issue however, so take care not to make those useless. I'm going to be talking to my gunners to outline some numbers that we feel are fair. Someof the effects this change would probably* have are, Would be harder for a solo pilot to be as effective as they are now Would encourage the use of gunners to maintain the same effectiveness Would decrease dropships tank slightly as solo pilots give up their turrets to fit more tank, they would now need to fit turrets decreasing their tank slightly. While my crew and I use prototype turrets we will bear in mind how adv and std turrets would fair with any numbers we come up with.
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1146	Posted - 2014.06.21 15:00:00 - [28] - Quote Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Are high-end birds still ~~immune~~ obscenely resistant to Proto Swarms? I haven't run into any yet since the fix yesterday. An ADS isn't OP if we can shoot it down with Swarms. He'll no! 4 shots can do the trick for many builds. Python that is. That's with no hardeners or reppers on, correct? "Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero Skype: jaysyn.larrisen Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
Benjamin Ciscko Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2360	Posted - 2014.06.21 15:06:00 - [29] - Quote Buff rail range to 450-550 with fall off. Tanker/Logi
Beld Errmon 1693	Posted - 2014.06.21 16:21:00 - [30] - Quote smh inb4 ADS become expensive novelty item that 2 guys with militia swarms can make useless, good forge gunners could already knock them out of the sky with skill, now the most noob friendly weapon in the game can as well. Many people consider me a good pilot and I was already going broke before the recent changes, now its accelerated, not a problem though the moment i can't afford to fly anymore i'll uninstall, 2 years is a good run for any game. Pilot - Tanker - FOTM (insert here)



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