DUST Search - Death taxis are a broken tactic

DeathwindRising wrote:

Joe Macro wrote:

Gotta chime in on this. I remember back when everyone had a BPO LAV. I learned quick to fit AV grenades. It worked on 90% of the murder taxi's or Drive by Heavies. Then they nerfed AV grenades.

Its pretty simple really, standard AV grenades should destroy MLT LAV and put a good dent in MLT tanks. That way if you really want to be a murder taxier or Drive by Heavy, or pretend to be a tanker, then you need to skill into it.

Jihad Jeeps are not in this category, because it is about RE's not the vehicle and not so much about the fit the person driving it is in.

Im no pro at this game but I have seen enough to know how things work and I know the OP is not a typical QQ'er.

yea but that lead to the av nade spam plague tanks. everyone on the map had av nades to counter the lavs. problem was that also meant everyone was able to counter tanks en mass. nanohives made it worse as they replenished your nades faster than you could throw them.

combined with the logistics lav most tanks couldnt stay on field since an lav with swarms, av nades or even a forge gun could roll up to you before you could kill the lav.

imagine how crap this game would be if the murder taxis returned in our new age of jihad jeeps. id ask ccp to simply paint a troll face on it and call it a day.

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Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 3856	Posted - 2014.06.18 04:49:00 - [31] - Quote Mauren NOON wrote: I think scouts with REs are a broken tactic. But no one fix's that..oh...you run 10 meters a second and have an equipment that can insta kill anyone? Why even carry weapons. Just carry hives and continue chucking them like frisbees What is your point commandos can throw death frisbees too nothing special bout that I'm not resting in peace but rather wandering as a zombie in vengeance of no good reason
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 14602	Posted - 2014.06.18 05:56:00 - [32] - Quote Mauren NOON wrote: I think scouts with REs are a broken tactic. But no one fix's that..oh...you run 10 meters a second and have an equipment that can insta kill anyone? Why even carry weapons. Just carry hives and continue chucking them like frisbees Guess what? They're being nerfed. Now there is no excuse for even a heavy to not get well out of the way of the blast zone before they're primed. Frisbee REs are no longer a thing. I'm rather disappointed at the number of people in here who haven't even tried to present an argument for drive-by heavies, they've just gone 'no but THIS is OP!!11!' referring to a completely different thing. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 14604	Posted - 2014.06.18 06:09:00 - [33] - Quote Joe Macro wrote: Gotta chime in on this. I remember back when everyone had a BPO LAV. I learned quick to fit AV grenades. It worked on 90% of the murder taxi's or Drive by Heavies. Then they nerfed AV grenades. Its pretty simple really, standard AV grenades should destroy MLT LAV and put a good dent in MLT tanks. That way if you really want to be a murder taxier or Drive by Heavy, or pretend to be a tanker, then you need to skill into it. Jihad Jeeps are not in this category, because it is about RE's not the vehicle and not so much about the fit the person driving it is in. Im no pro at this game but I have seen enough to know how things work and I know the OP is not a typical QQ'er. Unfortunately, since the base HP of all LAVs was buffed in 1.7 and the number of AV grenades you can carry was reduced in 1.8, that's no longer a viable way of dealing with them. Two Lai Dai packed AV grenades (which is all you can carry, and are the most powerful AV grenade option available) will not kill an LAV with any tank modules added at all. They won't 1 hit any LAVs - which prevents them from being that effective, because to land a hit with an AV grenade the LAV is going to be within the HMG's optimal. Perhaps if you're using Lai Dai packeds you'll be able to kill the LAV if it's an Onikuma, but it won't save you. If you're not using the proto packed grenades, then most LAVs are unkillable. The sleek grenades won't even kill the weakest LAV at the proto tier, they can be discounted. Wiyrkomis won't kill a Baloch either. At EX-0 and below, you won't be able to even kill an Onikuma. Of the very few things you can do against these, AV grenades are one of the best picks. Unfortunately, to use them means that you'll be in the firing line immediately as the heavy bails, if you're using some powerful enough to take out the LAV. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
Baal Omniscient Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 1721	Posted - 2014.06.18 10:16:00 - [34] - Quote I suggest taking LAV health down and allowing skill sinks to buff them back up. Right now 2 Lai Dai packed's can't kill an Onikuma if he's fitted it with militia mods. 2 basic packed AV grenades should kill an unspecced, unfitted Militia LAV. Any skilled and fitted militia LAV should die to 2 packed EXO's. And any fully fitted, fully specced & fitted basic LAV should die to 2 packed Lai Dai grenades. This would allow tankers to defend against jihad jeeps easier, would give people a defense against Fat Taxi's (what I call them), and would force people who use this tactic to have to spend SP and a decent amount of ISK to make it viable. Right now I could fit an all BPO LAV and throw a basic HMG on an all BPO Skinweave heavy suit for right around 30k a pop. On a side note, the AV biff should coincide with this change. PSN ID: AlbelNox2569 Cross Atu for CPM1
iKILLu osborne Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 9	Posted - 2014.06.18 10:40:00 - [35] - Quote Mauren NOON wrote: I think scouts with REs are a broken tactic. But no one fix's that..oh...you run 10 meters a second and have an equipment that can insta kill anyone? Why even carry weapons. Just carry hives and continue chucking them like frisbees lol you know i use this tactic i can honestly say it separates dumb players from smart ones if you pay attention you can hear equipment drop (including remotes) so learn the sound and when hacking listen for it. and fyi throwing them like frisbees is a huge exaggeration , when i full sprint jump then toss them, they go about 7 to 10m then the sec it takes for me too land and then the 1.5s animation of me detonating gives you almost 3s to move so if you hear the sound move duh, and before you say heavies can't move in time (i run a heavy also) you do two hops back like jumping away from a grenade hey you liar! i didn't sneak up on you, i was following you for 5 minutes , waiting for you to hack that cru for a camp
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 261	Posted - 2014.06.18 10:42:00 - [36] - Quote Remember the good old days? When heavies with LAVs were the ones rage killing Snipers? Now it's tanks and Caldari scouts... My thoughts on Hotfix Alpha: First I noticed a scout running from my AR. Then a heavy. Then a COMBAT RIFLE USER. CCP +1
iKILLu osborne Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 9	Posted - 2014.06.18 10:46:00 - [37] - Quote simple make it 10 secs to re-enter a vehicle after exiting thusly making them vunerable if just for a brief moment that way it don't destroy the tactic completely but makes it more fair(and to prevent them from running from my viziam after they realize they picked on the wrong scout) hey you liar! i didn't sneak up on you, i was following you for 5 minutes , waiting for you to hack that cru for a camp
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS 363	Posted - 2014.06.18 11:25:00 - [38] - Quote Joe Macro wrote: Gotta chime in on this. I remember back when everyone had a BPO LAV. I learned quick to fit AV grenades. It worked on 90% of the murder taxi's or Drive by Heavies. Then they nerfed AV grenades. Its pretty simple really, standard AV grenades should destroy MLT LAV and put a good dent in MLT tanks. That way if you really want to be a murder taxier or Drive by Heavy, or pretend to be a tanker, then you need to skill into it. Jihad Jeeps are not in this category, because it is about RE's not the vehicle and not so much about the fit the person driving it is in. Im no pro at this game but I have seen enough to know how things work and I know the OP is not a typical QQ'er. yea but that lead to the av nade spam plague tanks. everyone on the map had av nades to counter the lavs. problem was that also meant everyone was able to counter tanks en mass. nanohives made it worse as they replenished your nades faster than you could throw them. combined with the logistics lav most tanks couldnt stay on field since an lav with swarms, av nades or even a forge gun could roll up to you before you could kill the lav. imagine how crap this game would be if the murder taxis returned in our new age of jihad jeeps. id ask ccp to simply paint a troll face on it and call it a day.
Baal Omniscient Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 1723	Posted - 2014.06.18 11:46:00 - [39] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Joe Macro wrote: Gotta chime in on this. I remember back when everyone had a BPO LAV. I learned quick to fit AV grenades. It worked on 90% of the murder taxi's or Drive by Heavies. Then they nerfed AV grenades. Its pretty simple really, standard AV grenades should destroy MLT LAV and put a good dent in MLT tanks. That way if you really want to be a murder taxier or Drive by Heavy, or pretend to be a tanker, then you need to skill into it. Jihad Jeeps are not in this category, because it is about RE's not the vehicle and not so much about the fit the person driving it is in. Im no pro at this game but I have seen enough to know how things work and I know the OP is not a typical QQ'er. yea but that lead to the av nade spam plague tanks. everyone on the map had av nades to counter the lavs. problem was that also meant everyone was able to counter tanks en mass. nanohives made it worse as they replenished your nades faster than you could throw them. combined with the logistics lav most tanks couldnt stay on field since an lav with swarms, av nades or even a forge gun could roll up to you before you could kill the lav. imagine how crap this game would be if the murder taxis returned in our new age of jihad jeeps. id ask ccp to simply paint a troll face on it and call it a day. Currently the resupply rate for grenades is greatly reduced when compared to when you are referring to and you only have 2 (as opposed to the previous 3) to begin with, not to mention grenades DRAIN hives. I use the hell out of locust grenades, and my X-3 hives only yield 4 grenades before disappearing due to grenade's increased nanite cost compared to before. In addition, hive fitting costs have been greatly increased so fitting a better hive for more grenades means wearing a much weaker suit than before. Lastly, tanks are FAR faster than they used to be and are typically stacking reps and/or hardners which work far better than they used to. TL;DR: The issue you refer to shouldn't be an issue these days. PSN ID: AlbelNox2569 Cross Atu for CPM1
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 79	Posted - 2014.06.18 12:07:00 - [40] - Quote after reading all the nerf heavy and nerf HMG comming from scouts and non heavy users it makes sence to use death taxi's cause at range heavys are at a severe disadvantage. with the plasma cannon changes and such it shouldnt be hard to keep popping death taxi's Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone? No Mic and no time for "Squeekers" Nerf scout cloak+shotgun

Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 14610	Posted - 2014.06.18 12:45:00 - [41] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: after reading all the nerf heavy and nerf HMG comming from scouts and non heavy users it makes sence to use death taxi's cause at range heavys are at a severe disadvantage. with the plasma cannon changes and such it shouldnt be hard to keep popping death taxi's Did... Did you seriously just suggest using a plasma cannon? Have you ever used a plasma cannon? You can't kill an LAV before it reaches you by using a plasma cannon. Also, it doesn't 'make sense' because people are complaining about heavies being overpowered. It makes sense because it renders the weaknesses of the class irrelevant. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
Baal Omniscient Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 1725	Posted - 2014.06.18 12:48:00 - [42] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Apothecary Za'ki wrote: after reading all the nerf heavy and nerf HMG comming from scouts and non heavy users it makes sence to use death taxi's cause at range heavys are at a severe disadvantage. with the plasma cannon changes and such it shouldnt be hard to keep popping death taxi's Did... Did you seriously just suggest using a plasma cannon? Have you ever used a plasma cannon? You can't kill an LAV before it reaches you by using a plasma cannon. Also, it doesn't 'make sense' because people are complaining about heavies being overpowered. It makes sense because it renders the weaknesses of the class irrelevant. I was just gonna quote and put "lolololololol", but I suppose a reasoned argument is better for the soul.... PSN ID: AlbelNox2569 Cross Atu for CPM1
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 1009	Posted - 2014.06.18 13:17:00 - [43] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: The Murder taxi is a ridiculous tactic and sometimes it's overbearing but I am a true-LAV user and the last thing it needs is Murder taxis ruining it for everyone. It's a hard tactic to counter you've pointed that out but I have a solid RE counter strategy that rarely fails but it does require RE's. Again at the heart the Murder Taxi is only as effective as the HMG and the heavy. It's true that LAV removes the mobility loss from the equation which seems unfair but hell I don't want people to pin the crime on the LAV. It's not the LAV's fault that it can be used by anyone and everyone. Certain villains paint it ugly which is the true crime here. The criminal is purely the Heavy-HMG- LAV relationship not the Heavy-Pistol-LAV, not the Heavy Anything Else LAV. Heavies and HMG's are also a common issue on the ground in terms of balance. The Murder Taxi is just a volunteer from the same root. I'm in the same boat as this guy. I don't see the LAV as the problem. It's a tool just like any other, there if you are willing to gamble the ISK. I predominately use mine to hunt other tanks, and have tried this tactic you described to much success and a few failures thrown in. Hell I'll even slide that thing sideways and use it as cover. That HMG is deadly, most other heavies setup differently wouldn't be as annoying. But throw an HMG on there with an LAV and you can murder some bluedots. But even with that said, it's not 100% fool proof, and generally works best on someone running around by themselves! And I disagree with the notion that AV nades are useless against LAV's. I've been using them on my forge setup at STD level of all things, and generally use those to kill LAV. Unfit LAV's crumble to 2 packed STD AV nades. No, you won't kill an LAV that has a half decent fit, with just 2 nades, but I know for a fact that you will severely damage that thing, leaving it open for others to finish the job. My favorite though as been watching LAV's zoom up to me, single forge shot to em, get them weak and angry like a charging bull. I've had several LAV's that would have turned me into roadkill, but drop a single AV nade after a forge shot and boom, dead LAV. Then I calmly jump back in my LAV as the burning wreckage flies past. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
Atiim NoGameNoLife 9570	Posted - 2014.06.18 13:33:00 - [44] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Then by that logic is it fair to say Jihad Jeeps are a broken tactic.....which they are. No, and they don't correlate. Unlike the 'Death Taxi' the 'Jihad Jeep' can easily be countered by a shot to the front by literally every weapon in the game, and can be killed near instantaneously by a 20/80GJ Blaster. Unlike the 'Death Taxi', the Jihad jeep requires you to terminate at least 1 clone, which while it may seem insignificant, it is crucuial in competitive matches and is usually the deciding factor in whether or not you win the match (assuming your using a Clone Pack, of course). It should also be noted that (after sampling 15 heavies for 24 matches, over a span of 3 days); the success rate of the 'Death Taxi' rests at about 94%, and that 6% is only because of the Large CA Railgun Installation AI killing them before they reached their target. Director of NoGameNoLife "The Snack That Smiles Back; Amarr Suits" -HAND


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