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Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
2415
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Posted - 2014.06.12 12:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
Split Infantry power mods into 2 types.
Reactor control units (high direct % increase of PG [10 to 15%]) Power diagnostic systems. (small direct % PG increase [3 to 5%], small % shield HP buff [3 to 5%], small % shield recharge rate [5 to 8%] )
I'm not going to get into any numbers about balance, but making a lowslot shield module would make shield. |
Lorhak Gannarsein
Legio DXIV
3476
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Posted - 2014.06.12 13:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Regulators are the low slot shield item.
I don't really see how adding another module would add much more than SP sink
A complex PG mod adds 11% PG at the very minimum to any suit as it it (flat increase of 11 on max skilled Logistics w/ 102 total). As for the rest, well, the regulators are presumably intended to add a useful amount of EHP over time to a shield tank; balancing those better would go miles, I think.
CCP Rattati Best Dev
Sorry, Blowout...
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Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
2416
|
Posted - 2014.06.12 14:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
Lorhak Gannarsein wrote:Regulators are the low slot shield item.
I don't really see how adding another module would add much more than SP sink
A complex PG mod adds 11% PG at the very minimum to any suit as it it (flat increase of 11 on max skilled Logistics w/ 102 total). As for the rest, well, the regulators are presumably intended to add a useful amount of EHP over time to a shield tank; balancing those better would go miles, I think.
You have defended the status quo with a tautology. "Regulators are the lowslot shield item, therefore don't change lowslot shields"
My argument is that since PG has been a limiting factor in shield effectiveness and increasing PG efficiency for shields would only increase the likelihood that players hybrid tank, then making some kind of small shield buff that neutralizes this would probably be effective.
...currently working out some reasonable ways to represent the trade off here, but, there should be a threshold where lowslot investments in this kind of shield upgrade on a shield suit, would provide a better eHP buffer and/or eHP over time than just a switch to armor for hybrid tanking. |
The-Errorist
SVER True Blood
762
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Posted - 2014.06.12 14:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Split Infantry power mods into 2 types.
Reactor control units (high direct % increase of PG [10 to 15%]) Power diagnostic systems. (small direct % PG increase [3 to 5%], small % shield HP buff [3 to 5%], small % shield recharge rate [5 to 8%] )
I'm not going to get into any numbers about balance, but making a lowslot shield module would make shield. Power diagnostic system modules for vehicles were awesome, they helped out shield tanks by letting the fit their shields and gave a little boost to shield HP. To those saying this conflicts with regulators, they don't since regulators only make shield recharge delays & recharge rates better and not shield HP.
We really need low slot modules that are useful for shield tankers that don't necessarily encourage hybrid tanking.
MAG + Dust cb vet, an alt of Velvet Overkill & Agent Overkill. http://vimeo.com/93181621
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Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
2418
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Posted - 2014.06.12 15:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:Beren Hurin wrote:Split Infantry power mods into 2 types.
Reactor control units (high direct % increase of PG [10 to 15%]) Power diagnostic systems. (small direct % PG increase [3 to 5%], small % shield HP buff [3 to 5%], small % shield recharge rate [5 to 8%] )
I'm not going to get into any numbers about balance, but making a lowslot shield module would make shield. Power diagnostic system modules for vehicles were awesome, they helped out shield tanks by letting the fit their shields and gave a little boost to shield HP. To those saying this conflicts with regulators, they don't since regulators only make shield recharge delays and not shield HP or recharge rates better. We really need low slot modules that are useful for shield tankers that don't necessarily encourage hybrid tanking.
I'm building some tables as we speak and one thing is pretty obvious as I look at it that a huge benefit of shield tanking is the efficiency of repairs. However, if you factor logi reps into the equation, repair tools are 3 to 5 times as CPU efficient per HP repaired compaired with PRO rechargers and energizers. I think this is what makes the logi/heavy combo pretty effective. It maximizes the low CPU cost of armor with the low CPU cost of repair tools vs. armor reps/ second. |
Lorhak Gannarsein
Legio DXIV
3486
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Posted - 2014.06.12 16:30:00 -
[6] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Lorhak Gannarsein wrote:Regulators are the low slot shield item.
I don't really see how adding another module would add much more than SP sink
A complex PG mod adds 11% PG at the very minimum to any suit as it it (flat increase of 11 on max skilled Logistics w/ 102 total). As for the rest, well, the regulators are presumably intended to add a useful amount of EHP over time to a shield tank; balancing those better would go miles, I think. You have defended the status quo with a tautology. "Regulators are the lowslot shield item, therefore don't change lowslot shields" My argument is that since PG has been a limiting factor in shield effectiveness and increasing PG efficiency for shields would only increase the likelihood that players hybrid tank, then making some kind of small shield buff that neutralizes this would probably be effective. ...currently working out some reasonable ways to represent the trade off here, but, there should be a threshold where lowslot investments in this kind of shield upgrade on a shield suit, would provide a better eHP buffer and/or eHP over time than just a switch to armor for hybrid tanking. I'm going to do some study once the new shield modules come out.
Strictly speaking what I meant was 'don't add a low slot module, work on the ones we have until they're useful first'. Might not have worded it so well.
But what I was trying to say was basically this: Regulators increase EHP over time by increasing reps in combat; a regulator that decreases recharge delay by a full second is essentially improving EHP by a full rep cycle (I think?). Whether or not that single rep pulse is significant is another matter.
I also don't think that adding a lowslot module to boost PG and buff shields is a good way to sort out this issue, although I can see where you're coming from.
Now, I'm stream-of-consciousness here, but from memory a complex shield extender takes a converted total fitting cost of about 114, where a plate takes 103 (based on 5.5:1 PG:CPU). It's a pretty significant difference IMO. I think a better fix would be streamlining the two modules somewhat and lowering the PG costs for the shield extenders (which are quite exorbitant at the moment). Although, that said, the high PG might be intended to compensate for the zero PG consumption of rechargers or something similar...
I also think that certain shield suits should have a CPU buff, but that's just me (I feel like CalLogi deserves its CPU back; I don't see a reason anymore why it should have such inferior fitting to all the other logis, but I suppose that's a topic for another thread).
One last addition before I go to bed: regulators aren't really very useful at the moment, thanks to (relatively) small bonuses and large base delays. A new module would either relegate the regulator even further to the scrap heap, or be less useful.
I suppose I just don't like the idea of useless mods.
CCP Rattati Best Dev
Sorry, Blowout...
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Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
2420
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Posted - 2014.06.12 16:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
Yeah check out the new notes. PRO regs at the moment look like they are going from 25% to 35%. |
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