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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1061
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Posted - 2014.06.12 00:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Alena Ventrallis wrote: . . . OP POST . . .
Good point
Sorry but I dare to say: NOT a good point. The system described would be a return to the dark ages.
Why? Because balance has to be created taking the maximum skills into consideration. Sure no one has every single skill maxed - but on single field like vehicles even alts have maximums. People will max narrow areas in masses. Those maxed out chars will go out against each other - and junior players as well.
In that environment the REAL ttk on vehicles would still be as low as now - on field it would seem that tanks for example live longer and are vital lions hunting. But those would be the high-SP tankers while anyone not maxed out would be the prey. Until they get that 22M SP for tanks...
Abovementioned tanks are just one example. The same goes to suit balance and all weapons. The highest possible combination sets the par in all balance design. If ignored, it there will be opening for another FOTM.
During the years of Dust developement the biggest improvements have been getting away from the hard skill bonuses (proficency +2%s, AR operation +5%s and - sigh - blanket weaponry +5%) into soft bonuses. Soft bonuses are ones like smaller dispersion, faster reload, faster turret rotation. Those make skilling up interesting but not knife on the throat mandatory. Hard bonuses make SP king. Hard bonuses are the dark middle ages.
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1061
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Posted - 2014.06.12 00:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
To make it clear, my stance on 'unlocking-only'-skills is that they are dull. Every skill should grant some bonus - but a soft one.
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1066
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Posted - 2014.06.12 23:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote: That's not the problem with SP, it's a problem with fundamental game design. Eve has lots of skills that give "Hard bonuses" like damage and optimal range. These are fine because low skill characters without those trained up have safe places to do their thing, like PVE missions and such. True matchmaking would help out greatly with this. But skills should definitely confer a bonus, up to and including raw damage. If you've invested the SP, you should gain an advantage, plain and simple.
I will say this though, that it can definitely cause an imbalance if the skills are too powerful. But giving flat nerfs and returning them through skills, gives CCP a way to more easily adjust things.
Let's take large railguns again. As mentioned before, give a flat 15% nerf and return it through 3% per level of operation. Now CCP thinks this is too much, and wants to tone it down. Now they can either a. adjust railgun damage directly or b. reduce how much the skill gives, like to 2% instead. This can complicate things y having many variables, but it also allows more fine tuned tweaking to happen.
Actually that is not tweaking, that is just delaying the inevitable with the expense of juniors. And yes skills should have effect but damage bonuses are as hard as they get.
Others have already mentioned this is not eve. - no other game forms (especially PVE) - limits on player counts so that an extra junior rifter pilot is not extra, it's hindrance in from of militia suit - Combat variables and environment play differently
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1066
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Posted - 2014.06.12 23:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
jaksol JAK darnson wrote:
it didnt use to be that ways every skill has a small like 2% bonus like dropsuit fiting skilluse to give a 1 to 5% pg and cpu increase same with tanks you some skills you can buy lvl 5 in but after 1 or 3 you dont get rewarded for going higher! needs to change
[/quote]
That is one particular detail in the way skill tree was built. Designers ignored that as PG values are small few %s won't matter. Blame the unfinished design or beta legacy weaknesses.
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1066
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Posted - 2014.06.12 23:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sole Fenychs wrote:KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:To make it clear, my stance on 'unlocking-only'-skills is that they are dull. Every skill should grant some bonus - but a soft one. I totally agree with you. You want hard bonuses? Those are called higher tier equipment. Run proto if you want more damage. Skills should give soft bonuses. Otherwise you have proto stompers that not only run proto, but also get massive skill gains. That issue already exists, as most of the tanking module skills increase the strength of their associated modules, but this would make it even worse. However, I really wish the pure unlock skills would grant actual bonuses. There should be a point to level dropsuit command, basic dropsuits or HAV/LAV/DS operation to level 5.
Interesting thing about how better modules could be considered hard bonuses is that they bring many choices. Choices about sacrificing a slot, PG+CPU and maybe some handicap. With isk cost on top (which btw is NOT a good way to balance ever).
Only thing where that high SP unlocked gear does not function that way is dropsuits themselves with only isk cost countering their use (plus minor addition: CPU modules...)
:-S
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1253
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Posted - 2014.09.04 20:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
Seymour KrelbornX wrote:KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:To make it clear, my stance on 'unlocking-only'-skills is that they are dull. Every skill should grant some bonus - but a soft one. your ideas only serve to undermine the beauty and uniqueness of the skillbook system and tree this game uses... I agree with the OP... the new eden experience is all about reward for investment. using skillbooks as part of the plan for balancing is a no brainer. unlocking skills should be mandatory if you want to have something powerful in this game. a new player vs a vet should never even come into question, because if you try to balance based on this it makes investment pointless. if there were proper matchmaking that wouldn't even be an issue. balancing should be viewed from equal tiers, and skillbooks are an important part of doing this.
Wut wut wuuut...?
So having skills that grant zero bonuses bring beauty and uniqueness into Dust skill system...?!? wtf?
People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change
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