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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3362
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Posted - 2014.06.09 11:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
The assault suit needs to be revisited and buffed. I'm sure CCP is aware of the fact that assaults are not useful in the endgame vs other suits and needs a change.
I would really like anyone looking to contribute to watch this video that describes "incomparables" and why they are so important.
Instead of using this as a pedestal to offer the community a bunch of my own idea's i've mulled around, I wonder if I can crowdsource tons of ideas I simply haven't thought of, and for the most part play devil's advocate with your ideas and see what emerges. :3
Also: Since this hasn't yet been confirmed to be plausible, I'm personally incentivizing the feedback and thus your time spent helping us all build a convincing and palatable fix to make our assault suits better again :D
The 2 ideas that gain the most support in the thread will be given 25 million isk each.
Bear in mind that CCP is possibly going to prefer to implement changes that are easier (changing numbers) as opposed to creating incomparables in the sense of the cloak for scouts.
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3366
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Posted - 2014.06.09 12:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:I have mentioned multiple times in the past that I think assaults need regeneration on steroids, something no other suit can achieve without being gimped.
This has been my consensus for a long while as well. But I wondered if there are other less obvious ways.
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3366
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 12:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Zatara Rought wrote:Cat Merc wrote:I have mentioned multiple times in the past that I think assaults need regeneration on steroids, something no other suit can achieve without being gimped. This has been my consensus for a long while as well. But I wondered if there are other less obvious ways. Well, all my other ideas include stuff that cannot be done with hotfixes, so they're out of the question.
Sadly this also seems to be the consensus.
Regardless of it's development cost I think it's worth exploring other options that may need more development time.
I think this is a case where the extra effort in terms of development is necessary. <3
I think regen is viable, and is the 'party line' so to speak, but I wonder if we just haven't thought of something else.
I wonder if there ARE other options that could be done with a hotfix instead of making Assaults regen monsters.
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3367
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Posted - 2014.06.09 13:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Grimmiers wrote:This would probably be hell to balance properly, but what if assaults had a flat bonus to all modules used in their respective slots. For example, A gallente assault would have a 5% bonus to any module used in a low slot while a caldari assault would get the same for highs. Minmatar and Amarr would split the bonuses unevenly with 2% and 3% bonuses to their preferred slots.
I could put together a spreadsheet showing module bonuses if this is considered.
Besides that I'm already having an easier time using my assault suit with the armor repair modules buffed. I'm able to recover from surprise scout attacks and long skirmishes with heavies so maybe we could push repping further.
That's super fascinating....making them slightly better at everything with regards to modules. Wow. +1
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3367
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 13:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
Atiim wrote:
Take for example, the Shield Extender. Assuming you mean 5% efficiency per level, you would essentially be adding a 25% buff to Shield Extenders; pair that with the 10% efficiency that Shield Extension gives you, and your looking at 90HP Extenders at the Complex Tier.
Caldari Assaults would be inherently broken. Though there are possible workarounds to this, such as given certain efficiency bonuses for certain modules. i.e
+2% Shield Extender efficiency per level and +5% Shield Recharger & Energizer efficiency per level.
He didn't say 5% per level.
And I think it's quite a hasty assumption to discount the idea even if it was 5% per level until you theorycraft a fit and demonstrate why it's broken. 2 many good ideas get tossed out before they have been considered because of feedback like this.
90 on a complex would only be an increase of 54 ehp with 3 complex shield extenders.
I hardly see how that is gamebreaking.
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3367
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Posted - 2014.06.09 13:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Spademan wrote:I've an idea, but it'd mean implementing new modules entirely. (And they said they wont be doing client side updates) Weapon Mod slots. Each suit would have an amount of Weapon mod slots, Assaults (At prototype) with 4 or so, Heavies and lights with 2, and Logis with 1.
This would mean creating new sills, moving damage modules to these new slots, and making modules such as ammo expansion, heat sinks, possibly RoF mods etc. It'd be nice.
This is AMAZING, but perhaps a little 2 ambitious. <3 BUT STILL AMAZEBALLS
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3367
|
Posted - 2014.06.09 13:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Well, Assault ships in EVE get bonuses to Micro Warp Drives, which is like kinetic catalyzers on steroids.
We could try to give assaults kin cat bonuses, but that would somewhat imbalance shield and armor assaults, since one can both have a full rack of tank and kin cats, while the other needs to choose to sacrifice tank to have one kin cat.
I looked at Kagehoshi's thread and something that's been bothering me lately has been the reality that modules account for the VAST majority of all tank on all suits aside from sentinels/commando's.
If your suits base EHP comprised a MUCH larger % of your EHP pool andbrick tanking as a whole might only increase youre pool by say...30% as opposed to the 80% is is most of the time for non heavy frames (let's not get into e-war or gank) then I think balancing things like assaults and even modules like rechargers and regulators would be MUCH easier.
Because the choice isn't so drastic to your tank of choice.
Also, chew on this idea...to create imperfect balance what if we made assaults the ones with the close to parity of high/low slots (think 5 high's 3 low's on a caldari) while logi's were more polarized (6 high's 2 lows on caldari).
Just a thought to create more diversity.
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3367
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Posted - 2014.06.09 13:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
Baal Omniscient wrote:I've said this before, but I'll do so one last time. Give an additional bonus to each racial suit in order to increase it's survivability, and thus it's killing effectiveness.
Gallente: 3~5% Bonus to Armor Repair Modules and Reactive Plates Per Level
Result: Gallente Assaults become an armor buffer tank who get additional eHP and repairs from reactive plates and a lot better repairs from their armor repair modules. Gallente assault becomes viable.
Amarr: 3~5% Bonus to a Armor Plates and Ferroscale Plates Per Level
Result: Amarr assaults become armor eHP tanks, basically becoming a light heavy suit with a smaller hit box. Amarr assault becomes viable
Caldari: 3~5% Bonus to Shield Extender, Recharger and Energizer Modules Per Level
Result: Caldari suits become shield eHP tanks with super fast shield regeneration. Caldari assault becomes viable.
Minmatar: 20% Increase to Damage Modules and 3~5% Increase to Shield Regulator Modules Per Level
Result: Minmatar Assault becomes a hit-and-run shield buffer tank with high DPS and low eHP. Minmatar assault becomes viable.
The Minmatar bonus is tricky because you don't want to make it tanky but you want it to be effective. Giving it a bonus to 20% damage mods lets their damage mods to 10% at level 5 instead of the current 5%, thus helping them to make up for their ridiculously low eHP. And the regulator bonus also helps them make up for their low eHP by helping them get their shields back more quickly.
I think the other bonuses speak for themselves.
Somehow I feel like this alone still wouldn't give me enough of a significant reason to choose assault over scouts or logi's.
Just gut, but i'd love to see some fits that demonstrate the strength of this suggestion :D
BTW, gg earlier Baal, those knives hurt
CEO of FA, Candidate for CPM1
Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3373
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Posted - 2014.06.09 16:40:00 -
[9] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Officially entering this idea in the contest, major assault slot buff. I want ISK.
Reasons I don'tl ike this.
instead of making the slot count unique or polarizing it's just not going to be a major boost to assaults for them to have the increased cpu/pg along with slot count increase.
If I get 1 equip, a bit more mobility and a sidearm vs 4 equips...I'm going with 4 equips.
And most have reasoned this way despite the assault suit at proto level having had marginally more tank vs logi's in the past.
I want something incomparable, something that sets it apart. <3
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3382
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Posted - 2014.06.10 05:51:00 -
[10] - Quote
Spademan wrote: Thanks. Another advantage i see from this is that it counteracts the Logi argument that they have to spend more isk and Sp on their fittings. Might be ambitious, but there's no reason not to pass it on to CCP from time to time
Indeed. I think it might be unfeasible on dust, but if they said they'd like to do it i'd be way impressed.
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3398
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Posted - 2014.06.12 01:18:00 -
[11] - Quote
BUMP.
All entries for the 50 million isk must be done by 23:59 on 6/20.
Got some great ideas here! <3
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3405
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Posted - 2014.06.12 18:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
Meee One wrote:Logis currently sacrifice: -Shield -Armor -Sidearm -Movement/sprint speed
For +1 module slot and + 3 equipment slots.
So giving assaults the same (or more) slots just wouldn't be right. Logis are hunted by everyone,and have to pay 10k+ isk for a single piece of equipment.
Unless logis get buffed in some way,i'll fight this suggestion tooth and nail.
Simple answer?
Buff assault eHP to above basic mediums but below commando,and buff logis speed (2nd only to scouts) and hack (to be the fastest) that would be a reasonable trade.
inb4 2nd spam (grenade) slot
I think these ideas can be improved.
Logi's sacrifice speed and a sidearm, the amount of tank you can get on a logi is very nearly identical to assaults due to superior slot count.
They also get a lot more cpu/pg and that was BEFORE the bonus reduction to equipment was applied to all logi's.
I am not convinced logi's should have more slots. Equipment is precious. Perhaps equipment IS 2 expensive though. That's an interesting assertion.
I do not believe logi's should be faster than assaults. Those equips gotta be traded off for speed IMO.
And I certainly don't think logi's should have a faster hack base speed than scouts, but perhaps should be 2nd. I'm more open about that.
I don't like the fact that logi's end up with more tank in most cases vs assaults due to the cpu/pg differences.
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3420
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Posted - 2014.06.19 15:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
Unless there is support to extend this contest we will begin voting tomorrow and entries will be closed for the isk contest.
Feel free to help us continue to propel new ideas that help assaults become unique and interesting.
It'll pretty much be 2 threads, one in general and one in the war room. People will be invited to post which idea or 2 they like. Idea that gets the 1st and 2nd most support will be declared on the 25th. I will personally be weighing in on my thoughts on each idea, proffering any lingering doubts I have about them in the posts.
Again thank you so much forum crawlers. Assaults need love. They need something that allows them to offer a position unfilled by the other roles. And we've got a lot of potential solutions! vov
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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Zatara Rought
General Tso's Alliance
3446
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Posted - 2014.06.24 14:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
OKAY so I will be posting the threads today with all the suggestions. I realize i have been lax and not met my goal to have the thread up sooner. Apologies for that as I have been quite consumed.
I humbly ask you support my candidacy for CPM1
CEO of FA Skype: Zatara.Rought
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