DUST Search - Fixing the Flaylock (Spreadsheet Inside)

Sir Dukey wrote:

Boot Booter wrote:

First, thanks CCP Rattati for being so active on the forums. The hotfix was amazing, great work on it.

OK! So now that everything seems to be going in the right direction balance wise, I wanted to take a look at the flaylock and propose a small buff.

1. Buff blast radius to 2 meters and normalize across all tiers.

2. Buff Direct hit damage to 1.25 of its current value (see spreadsheet below)

3. Nerf splash damage to half of buffed direct damage (see spreadsheet below)

The damage changes may seem odd but emphasize its use as "skill shot" weapon. The buff of the blast radius is balanced by the nerf of splash damage while making it a viable choice again (and more fun). Naturally its a tricky weapon to buff without making OP, so I am open to suggestions and will make changes accordingly. The numbers I have provided seem like a good starting point though.

Spreadsheet: Fixing the Flaylock

they will still be UP, a 2 meter blast radius in Dust is equivalent to 4.567654 inches....

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Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 547	Posted - 2014.06.08 17:49:00 - [1] - Quote First, thanks CCP Rattati for being so active on the forums. The hotfix was amazing, great work on it. OK! So now that everything seems to be going in the right direction balance wise, I wanted to take a look at the flaylock and propose a small buff. 1. Buff blast radius to 2 meters and normalize across all tiers. 2. Buff Direct hit damage to 1.25 of its current value (see spreadsheet below) 3. Nerf splash damage to half of buffed direct damage (see spreadsheet below) The damage changes may seem odd but emphasize its use as "skill shot" weapon. The buff of the blast radius is balanced by the nerf of splash damage while making it a viable choice again (and more fun). Naturally its a tricky weapon to buff without making OP, so I am open to suggestions and will make changes accordingly. The numbers I have provided seem like a good starting point though. Spreadsheet: Fixing the Flaylock SMG Specialist
Llast 326 An Arkhos 3496	Posted - 2014.06.08 18:11:00 - [2] - Quote Looks pretty decent Mr Booter I think the increased radius works with the lower splash damage. Direct damage increase is welcome. I like it as a skill shot weapon. One thing I would like to see is an increase to efficiency against Vehicles. Just enough to make it a threat to LAVs, no real Problem for HAVs. KRRROOOOOOM
Spademan The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 1855	Posted - 2014.06.08 18:38:00 - [3] - Quote I'ma add a request to this list. Advanced and Prototype Breach Flaylocks. I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special. Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 548	Posted - 2014.06.08 18:56:00 - [4] - Quote Spademan wrote: I'ma add a request to this list. Advanced and Prototype Breach Flaylocks. Ok I'm on it. SMG Specialist
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1467	Posted - 2014.06.08 22:04:00 - [5] - Quote How does that compare to other pistols for DPS and range? Blast radius weapons seem like they would be tough to balance so I'm not even going to try on this one. I have made a spread sheet though where I'm putting in all the side arms stats so I can propose some balancing runs (I was actually thinking about the flaylock specifically but you beat me too the punch). Feel free to use the data I'm collecting here to help show your thinking. Spreadsheet Fun > Realism
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 548	Posted - 2014.06.08 23:05:00 - [6] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: How does that compare to other pistols for DPS and range? Blast radius weapons seem like they would be tough to balance so I'm not even going to try on this one. I have made a spread sheet though where I'm putting in all the side arms stats so I can propose some balancing runs (I was actually thinking about the flaylock specifically but you beat me too the punch). Feel free to use the data I'm collecting here to help show your thinking. Spreadsheet Having trouble opening your spreadsheet. As for range its a bit different because the shell explodes at a set distance, 50m? DPS might not be a good metric for this weapon, plus I don't know its fire rate. SMG Specialist
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 548	Posted - 2014.06.08 23:18:00 - [7] - Quote DPS of the current proto flaylock is about 395 (estimate) With the buff I proposed it would be about 493 (estimate). But really this is a poor metric because 1) you only have three rounds per clip and 2) it assumes you hit your target directly The dps, for splash damage only, is roughly 245 for my proposed changes. SMG Specialist
PLAYSTTION GamersForChrist 173	Posted - 2014.06.10 21:32:00 - [8] - Quote check my post on this. its somewhere around here 44/4 in a BPO Scout (1.8) 40/5 in a Proto Assault (1.7) Open Beta Vet 23mil sp R.I.P Dust 514
Lynn Beck Heaven's Lost Property 1742	Posted - 2014.06.10 21:43:00 - [9] - Quote Why is it i say 'flaylock needs splash range buff' and everybody flames me, but here you are proposing a radius AND direct buff AND to normalise splash radius, and people are fine wirh it? Not saying i'm not in agreement with you, but it strikes me as odd. I would love the Flaylock to be in a way, the Minmatar's method for anti-rail rifle, being able to hit a Rifler at decent ranges and being able to 'snipe' a sniper(much akin to a Bolt Pistol/Tact Scrambler) What would be your idea of a 'tactical' Flaylock, having 80m explosion range, and havin a slight clip change (+ or -) with appropriate damage adjustments? General John Ripper Like ALL the things!!!
Spademan The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 1867	Posted - 2014.06.10 21:47:00 - [10] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: Spademan wrote: I'ma add a request to this list. Advanced and Prototype Breach Flaylocks. Ok I'm on it. Edit: Updated OP with new spreadsheet that includes breach Cheers, quite liking your numbers for them. I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special. Official Time Lord of the Scout Community

Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 558	Posted - 2014.06.10 22:01:00 - [11] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Why is it i say 'flaylock needs splash range buff' and everybody flames me, but here you are proposing a radius AND direct buff AND to normalise splash radius, and people are fine wirh it? Not saying i'm not in agreement with you, but it strikes me as odd. I would love the Flaylock to be in a way, the Minmatar's method for anti-rail rifle, being able to hit a Rifler at decent ranges and being able to 'snipe' a sniper(much akin to a Bolt Pistol/Tact Scrambler) What would be your idea of a 'tactical' Flaylock, having 80m explosion range, and havin a slight clip change (+ or -) with appropriate damage adjustments? Well the splash damage is pretty far reduced. My thinking is that the flaylock should be highly rewarding for skill shots while also being capable of finishing of a close range enemy with low splash damage. Ill have to think about the tactical flaylock idea. Kinda would be similar to a breach. (I think the breach should have a longer range) SMG Specialist
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 1003	Posted - 2014.06.10 22:12:00 - [12] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: First, thanks CCP Rattati for being so active on the forums. The hotfix was amazing, great work on it. OK! So now that everything seems to be going in the right direction balance wise, I wanted to take a look at the flaylock and propose a small buff. 1. Buff blast radius to 2 meters and normalize across all tiers. 2. Buff Direct hit damage to 1.25 of its current value (see spreadsheet below) 3. Nerf splash damage to half of buffed direct damage (see spreadsheet below) The damage changes may seem odd but emphasize its use as "skill shot" weapon. The buff of the blast radius is balanced by the nerf of splash damage while making it a viable choice again (and more fun). Naturally its a tricky weapon to buff without making OP, so I am open to suggestions and will make changes accordingly. The numbers I have provided seem like a good starting point though. Spreadsheet: Fixing the Flaylock they will still be UP, a 2 meter blast radius in Dust is equivalent to 4.567654 inches....
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 559	Posted - 2014.06.10 22:36:00 - [13] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Boot Booter wrote: First, thanks CCP Rattati for being so active on the forums. The hotfix was amazing, great work on it. OK! So now that everything seems to be going in the right direction balance wise, I wanted to take a look at the flaylock and propose a small buff. 1. Buff blast radius to 2 meters and normalize across all tiers. 2. Buff Direct hit damage to 1.25 of its current value (see spreadsheet below) 3. Nerf splash damage to half of buffed direct damage (see spreadsheet below) The damage changes may seem odd but emphasize its use as "skill shot" weapon. The buff of the blast radius is balanced by the nerf of splash damage while making it a viable choice again (and more fun). Naturally its a tricky weapon to buff without making OP, so I am open to suggestions and will make changes accordingly. The numbers I have provided seem like a good starting point though. Spreadsheet: Fixing the Flaylock they will still be UP, a 2 meter blast radius in Dust is equivalent to 4.567654 inches.... Well it would actually be 2.5 meters with prof 5, so that would make it 5.7095675 inches. It's half of the STD mass driver. SMG Specialist
Boot Booter Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 568	Posted - 2014.06.12 19:34:00 - [14] - Quote Bump SMG Specialist


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